Goodbye Studio

[technominds]

Looking good. Hows the isolation? You got seals round your door?

Still another wall side to finish before i start sealing everything up tight.

Il have seals around the door, im also applying a rubber sealing to literally any joint i can find. I also spoke to the handymen, and ive ordered my Rigid Rockwool which im going to make a fabricated back wall from.

I also found that a light fitting in there isnt snug at all, and if you look up it, you can see straight into my loft. So im going to go up to the loft and cover the entire top over with a small amount of rigid, and then throw some loft insulation over the top.

I got round to ordering my furniture. For desk chairs, ive found some very cool retro pod chairs in a shop in islington. Ive also managed to bag a cheap 26" LCD TV, which also has a PC input, so that'tl be handy for not only amusing clients, but also video editing work.

Does anyone know what a decent ratio of wall foam covering would be for the booth? I know too much will suck out all the highs, but im sure a small amount will deaden the reflections.

Its a; very exciting, this has been planned for 4 years =]

 

[technominds]

Oh, and also...

Im building a storage unit in the shape of a basstrap on the rear corner of the room. It will be corner shelves, with framing and doors. The unit will be filled with clothes.

Even though it will be made from rigid material, will it be beneficial for bass trapping? Also reflections?

 

[Pughbert]

The storage unit will help to a reasonable extent depending on what’s inside. The low end will pass straight thought the shell and therefore be absorbed by the fabric and things inside. Plus as the fabric will hang loose it will help absorb bass energy that way.

The canvases will be almost useless at the high end if painted and less than ideal if not as canvas is quite thick and hardly breathable. Also canvases are no where near thick enough to do a good job. Ideally you want to bring the panels out from the wall a touch to as this helps with bass absorption.

Why not do what I did and simply pick out an interesting fabric to cover your traps in? That way you can alter depth, what’s inside, how much of an air gap you use etc.

What are you planning fit the booth out with in the way of acoustics? Do you read Sound on Sound? – they did a great article with a friend of mines booth about a year ago.

 

[technominds]

The storage unit will help to a reasonable extent depending on what’s inside. The low end will pass straight thought the shell and therefore be absorbed by the fabric and things inside. Plus as the fabric will hang loose it will help absorb bass energy that way.

The canvases will be almost useless at the high end if painted and less than ideal if not as canvas is quite thick and hardly breathable. Also canvases are no where near thick enough to do a good job. Ideally you want to bring the panels out from the wall a touch to as this helps with bass absorption.

Why not do what I did and simply pick out an interesting fabric to cover your traps in? That way you can alter depth, what’s inside, how much of an air gap you use etc.

What are you planning fit the booth out with in the way of acoustics? Do you read Sound on Sound? – they did a great article with a friend of mines booth about a year ago.

I scrapped the idea of the canvas as I spoke to the builders and they said they will be able to throw out the panels for me in no time at all.

The booth will have either a front and/or back wall or covered rigid rockwool, and then some foam lightly spread around to remove reflections. I wont be overkilling on either, because I know too much will give it a very 'I recorded this in my closet' sound.

I do read Sound on Sound, but not often, ive seen a few of the 'Save our Studio' articles they do and have taken some advice on building traps from there. I was also impressed to see Ethans site mentioned aswell =]

 

[pandamonk]

I scrapped the idea of the canvas as I spoke to the builders and they said they will be able to throw out the panels for me in no time at all.

The booth will have either a front and/or back wall or covered rigid rockwool, and then some foam lightly spread around to remove reflections. I wont be overkilling on either, because I know too much will give it a very 'I recorded this in my closet' sound.

I do read Sound on Sound, but not often, ive seen a few of the 'Save our Studio' articles they do and have taken some advice on building traps from there. I was also impressed to see Ethans site mentioned aswell =]

Nonono. If you don't add enough absorption, it will give the "'I recorded this in my closet' sound", because the reflections.

In a space that small, you really have to avoid all reflections, except the floor, because it is the reflections from the walls close to you, that give the "'I recorded this in my closet' sound". If you add absorption, then it makes the walls disappear acoustically, and then you can add them later, further away, with reverb.

It's good to leave the floor reflective though, because even in a big room the floor is always that distance, but everywhere else should be absorption, as thick as you can get it.

I don't think you need to cover the whole booth, just around the mic. But if you have enough foam, why not? But make sure you use the rockwool at the mic end, and space it as far from the wall as you can. 1ft should give optimal performance down to 300Hz, which is as low as a voice should get.

 

[technominds]

Nonono. If you don't add enough absorption, it will give the "'I recorded this in my closet' sound", because the reflections.

In a space that small, you really have to avoid all reflections, except the floor, because it is the reflections from the walls close to you, that give the "'I recorded this in my closet' sound". If you add absorption, then it makes the walls disappear acoustically, and then you can add them later, further away, with reverb.

It's good to leave the floor reflective though, because even in a big room the floor is always that distance, but everywhere else should be absorption, as thick as you can get it.

I don't think you need to cover the whole booth, just around the mic. But if you have enough foam, why not? But make sure you use the rockwool at the mic end, and space it as far from the wall as you can. 1ft should give optimal performance down to 300Hz, which is as low as a voice should get.

Ah ok then. I have enough foam to cover the entire room, so I guess I will cover the whole room. I was under the impression that using too much foam would suck out all the high's and make it sound damp in the room. As im making a computer monitor flush to the wall, il surround it with rockwool, cover it up and then the rest of the room will be foam. Could i cover the rockwool with plywood or something or is it better to be fabricated?

 

[pandamonk]

Ah ok then. I have enough foam to cover the entire room, so I guess I will cover the whole room. I was under the impression that using too much foam would suck out all the high's and make it sound damp in the room. As im making a computer monitor flush to the wall, il surround it with rockwool, cover it up and then the rest of the room will be foam. Could i cover the rockwool with plywood or something or is it better to be fabricated?

plywood would make it act as a membrane absorber, absorbing bass and reflecting highs/mids. You don't need this, so no, just fabric. Remember to space it from the wall as much as you can. With 4" space 8" from the wall(reflective surface) if you can. This'll absorb well down to 300Hz(roughly 1ft 1/4 wavelength).

If you covered with just 2" foam, then yeah it'd suck the highs and mids leaving the lows to make the booth dead boomy. But if you add the rockwool to absorb the lows too, then you'll get a dead booth at all freqs, meaning no boominess.

 

[Pughbert]

Nonono. If you don't add enough absorption, it will give the "'I recorded this in my closet' sound", because the reflections.

In a space that small, you really have to avoid all reflections, except the floor, because it is the reflections from the walls close to you, that give the "'I recorded this in my closet' sound". If you add absorption, then it makes the walls disappear acoustically, and then you can add them later, further away, with reverb.

It's good to leave the floor reflective though, because even in a big room the floor is always that distance, but everywhere else should be absorption, as thick as you can get it.

I don't think you need to cover the whole booth, just around the mic. But if you have enough foam, why not? But make sure you use the rockwool at the mic end, and space it as far from the wall as you can. 1ft should give optimal performance down to 300Hz, which is as low as a voice should get.

To be honest I disagree with you a little there. I think to cover the entire booth with suck all the high end and life from the recordings. It's commonly said that vocal booths are over done - sure you want to avoid those early reflections that color the sound but you certainly don’t want it completely dead and that to will leave an unnatural coloration. My advice would be to use a good size, thick panel behind the singer - a reasonable sized panel left and right, same on the calling above singing position and in front of singer, but not coving the entire walls. The panel behind the singer and thus in front of the mic is the most important of all.

 

[pandamonk]

To be honest I disagree with you a little there. I think to cover the entire booth with suck all the high end and life from the recordings. It's commonly said that vocal booths are over done - sure you want to avoid those early reflections that color the sound but you certainly don’t want it completely dead and that to will leave an unnatural coloration. My advice would be to use a good size, thick panel behind the singer - a reasonable sized panel left and right, same on the calling above singing position and in front of singer, but not coving the entire walls. The panel behind the singer and thus in front of the mic is the most important of all.

Nono, it'll only suck out the highs if you only use thin material. You wanna suck out all frequencies, then you can add the reverb later. In such a small room, you'll never get a good sound, so dead is best. Obviously it'll sound unnatural, but this is only until you add the reverb later.

 

[Pughbert]

He's a link for the SOS article on Paul's booth. It pretty much gives you the instructions!!

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar06/articles/studiosos.htm

 

[pandamonk]

By the way, I don't think a totally dead room is a good idea, but when it's this small, i don't think any reflections can be benificial, cept the floor. So it really has to be dead.

 

[Pughbert]

Nono, it'll only suck out the highs if you only use thin material. You wanna suck out all frequencies, then you can add the reverb later. In such a small room, you'll never get a good sound, so dead is best. Obviously it'll sound unnatural, but this is only until you add the reverb later.

Hmmm, still not for me. I think its a balance - sure you want to absorb right across the spectrum, but I disagree with saying that you want to have a 'dead' room. Although I agree you don’t want reverberation on the recordings as that’s to be added later - you don’t want to take it to the point of having to resort to EQ etc because the high end has vanished.

It’s one thing to use enough absorption to avoid reverb but another to take it to the point of being dead. The booth on that SOS link sounds great!!

 

[pandamonk]

Hmmm, still not for me. I think its a balance - sure you want to absorb right across the spectrum, but I disagree with saying that you want to have a 'dead' room. Although I agree you don’t want reverberation on the recordings as that’s to be added later - you don’t want to take it to the point of having to resort to EQ etc because the high end has vanished.

It’s one thing to use enough absorption to avoid reverb but another to take it to the point of being dead. The booth on that SOS link sounds great!!

The high end only vanishes if you only absorb high end. If you absorb across the spectrum, then in my opinion everything vanishes, so no need for eq.

Also, that booth on the SOS link is much bigger than Technominds'.

 

[Pughbert]

The high end only vanishes if you only absorb high end. If you absorb across the spectrum, then in my opinion everything vanishes, so no need for eq.

Also, that booth on the SOS link is much bigger than Technominds'.

I still feel even absorbing across the full audio spectrum will leave a noticeably unnatural amount of high end loss which would have to be rectified. I agree with you in that the small the booth the more harmful the reflections become - and that for that reason a greater ration of absorption should be used - but I don’t feel the first thing to do should be kill the room 100%. I think starting out with something similar to the SOS article and take it from there based on your listening tests.

 

[pandamonk]

I still feel even absorbing across the full audio spectrum will leave a noticeably unnatural amount of high end loss which would have to be rectified. I agree with you in that the small the booth the more harmful the reflections become - and that for that reason a greater ration of absorption should be used - but I don’t feel the first thing to do should be kill the room 100%. I think starting out with something similar to the SOS article and take it from there based on your listening tests.

Yeah, leave the floor. I think if you want your tiny booth to seem like a big room, then you have to remove the walls and ceiling acoustically. Then you can add them later. You only lose more high end than low if the material is too thin, or not good at absorbing bass frequencies.

This is why i suggested spacing the 4" absorber 8" from the wall. This should give good absorption down to 300Hz. I'm sure you know that the quater wavelength of 300Hz is just under 1ft, so this is the best thickness of material to use, but to save on cost bringing the panel out from the wall will affect in the same way, although not as well(still very good though).

Obviously you can't lose 1ft off every wall in this size of room, so having one panel, and then having thin absorption elsewhere will suffice. I think Technominds would be better off using a 4" panel behind the mic, then either side and above have a 2" placed an inch or two from the wall, and the same behind where he'll stand. But he already has a lot of foam, so he could use this instead.

I'd build 1 4'x2'x4" panel placed behind the mic 8" from the wall, 3 4'x2'x2" panels placed at the sides and behind spaced 2", and 1 2'x2'x2" placed above and spaced 2". This would leave a little wall, but not a great deal, and would probably give good full spectrum absorption.

 

[pandamonk]

These are two options i think you could go for. Both of these include a 2'x2'x2" spaced 2" cloud. The second uses less materials, and I think is actually the better option.

 

[Pughbert]

I'd go with the second to as angle the traps like that will give the most effect use of them.

 

[technominds]

I'd go with the second to as angle the traps like that will give the most effect use of them.

I know the second would be best, but the first is much easier and leaves me with alot more room in the booth.

Im going to to the wall behind the mic entirely from fabricated rockwool and then the wall behind me the same.

The side walls and ceiling im going to tile with foam.

Im going to have to add rubber seals on the door and caulk up a little more because isolation seems to be minimal at the moment, im guessing once the rockwool is in, that may help also.

 

[technominds]

Todays little update:

I bought my fabric for my absorbers and vocal booth walls, £2 a meter, breathable, in white and red.

 

[technominds]

started building the right corner soffit