stupid question about tape returns...?

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fire.is.real

New member
...i'm thinking about upgrading to 16 track 1" & a new board. for years i have been using a tascam 688 8 track and have been spoiled by the fact that the unit is all-inclusive.

i have seen many great reviews of the mackie 1604vlz pro on this forum, but doesn't it lack tape returns? and it only seems to have 8 direct outs.

can anyone clarify how one would use this board to record 16 tracks?

any other suggestions for boards in the same price range?

thanks,

fire.is.real

Walking Man Sound
 
In looking at the rear panel picture - it appears that this unit has both tape outs and ins:
http://www.mackie.com/Products/VLZ_PRO_Series/1604VLZPRO/1604PRORear.jpg

Also, while there are direct outs only on channels 1-8, there appear to be channel inserts on all 16 channels. These would be unbalanced connections, but they can be used to output a signal from the channel. If the runs are short, I don't think the unbalanced issue would be that big a deal.

You can also make use of the buses for submixes.

All in all, a pretty flexible unit.
 
ok i'm not disagreeing with you - i just think i dont understand...

when you say tape in/outs, are you referring to the RCA connectors?

wouldn't i need 16 sends and 16 returns to effectively record to a 16 track tape machine? and yes, i could use the inserts as sends by doing the old "half insert"... but what about tape RETURNS??

thanks again,

fire.is.real

Walking Man Sound
 
I'm not familiar with multi-tracking with tape - all of my recording is done digitally on PC. However, when I work with the PC, I only use 2 returns (a left and right stereo signal).

In other words, for recording I want each track recorded individually (sends). But for playback (returns), I only need to hear the entire "mix". I don't need playback of each track individually. So I assign the output of each track to the same identical stereo pair of my soundcard, and route that pair to my mixer.

Not sure if you have that flexibility working with tape, but I would think you do.

Also, C7sus, is correct. Each channel does have a "line in" connection along with the XLR's. You won't be able to use them simultaneously, but you could switch between the XLR and 1/4" line as needed (might be a little inconvenient, though).
 
ok so here's what i gather:

i'm going to have to re-patch everything everytime i want to hear what i've recorded?

i know that there are other options... is it just that one needs to get a big ass expensive console in order to playback and record w/o re-patching? what about a board with "flip/flop" switches - the ones that switch between tape return and mic/line input? is that big bucks stuff that is out of reach of the homerecording realm?

thanks for your input everyone and keep the thoughts coming!

fire.is.real

Walking Man Sound
 
Downside and C7 are right!

Look for a second hand 24 trk/8 buss console. A Soundcraft Spirit Studio or a Mackie will do what you want. The Soundcraft is usually regarded as having better/nicer sounding "pre's" and EQ than the Mackie, as well as being designed as a dedicated recording console. The Mackie 8 buss were a compromise between recording and live use. BUT the Mackie has a meterbridge available, Soundcraft doesn't. There are pros and cons each way.

I'm running a S/craft 24/8 into a Fostex 16 trk H/disk recorder, all hard wired so there is no re-patching needed and I have the extra channels available to run effects back through as needed.

:cool:
 
If you chose the 1604vlzpro you could connect the insert sends to the input of the 16 track and the returns from the 16 track back in via the insert returns.

That would send the mic pre direct to tape and the 1604 fader would monitor the tape return. levels controlled by the mic pre pot. So you can monitor the tape input when recording and then hear the recorder back on replay.

I'd geta patch bay so you can overide it when you want to group things out the group outputs.

cheers
john
 
ok that makes sense.... thanks!

so if i wanted to track with like a gate or something... i would just put it in the insert loop ahead of the tape machine right? and my levels to tape would be controlled by the trim pots...?

ok i can deal with that so far... thanks. so a board with 16 tape outs and 16 tape ins will be out of my league you think?

anyone???

fire.is.real

Walking Man Sound
 
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