Studio Projects and Neumann

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Budget gear is cheaper for a reason, so one certainly can't expect the same level of quality. On the other hand, a skilled enginner can probably produce a better sounding recording with a SP mic than someone less skilled with a Neumann.
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There's that N word again. I'm not a big Neumann fan since Sennheiser took over. Neumann has their share of crappy mics that "fart" out.

Here's the scoop, it's also about getting things done quickly. When you are recording someone, you really don't have time to fiddle about with EQ settings for hours on end trying to get a track to sound "right" and we all know the "right" sound is a bit subjective. Also you don't want to lose the flow by constant equipment changes with artists. I'm really open to the idea of cheap mics and I'm always buying them in hopes of finding that "silver bullet" for low cost. Some mics are just great on most sources and some or just ok on some sources. Personally I don't have time to put a C1 up for vocals just to take it back down 75% of the time. I have by the way heard some incredibley perfect guitar tracks done with a C1 on a Martin d28, the type of track that makes you say "wow". But then when he tried it on another highend guitar it was pretty mediocre and the vocal track just sucked.

If I were a carpenter I wouldn't want dull saw blades either.

By the way Brent I get great recordings, I scarcely use SP mics and that works great. I can use SP mics (C1 or B1) and get a "good/acceptable" recording but I don't want acceptable I want stellar and great. The 2 mics I own from you won't do that often enough to make it worth the hassle.
 
acorec said:
I agree with you 100%. The only place where the high-end mics shine is in the studio where you build up like 24 tracks. Then you WOULD hear a big difference between a high-end mic and a budget mic. BTW, this goes for pre-amps too. There is definitely a reason some equipment costs $$$ and some does not. It does not mean you can't get great results with the RIGHT budget equipment. The problem comes when the home reccer decides to put their mix against commercial recordings. This is where the difference is night and day. In that situation, it is the equipment, the room, the monitoring facilities AND the experience.
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Well said. Anyone can buy hardware if they have the cash... talent and experience can't.
 
These kinds of circular arguments are the reason I refuse to EVER buy ANY condenser mics. Regardless of the country of origin :mad:
 
Wow, five pages of Neumann spam?

I bet most of you guys never worked with a Neumann microphone, maybe a TLM103, but no U47 or M49 or M149.

Here's the bottom line: there is not a single mic of Chinese origine that can match with a big Neumann. The MXL V69 en V77 comes somewhere in the same room, but that special Neumann mid is only heard from well.......Neumanns. The high end is smoother and the lows are more tight.

That doesn't mean that the SP mics aren't great mics, considering the price they're great mics, but recording a trumpet by a big Neumann sounds awesome, while recording it by a B1 it sounds pretty mediocre or even bad.

But when I recorded an upright bass (very rough player) with a Neumann and a B1, the player went for the B1 and I must say it sounded awesome.

The C1 is not a harsh sounding mic, it just sounds very bright, much too bright to my taste, but I can imagine it'll do just fine on acoustic guitar in a dense mix.

I agree with some posters that the very high prices on mics like Neumann are no longer justified and if I was the owner of the Neumann company I would be worried about that.

I wonder how the Chinese mics will sound ten years from now.

Peace.
 
I just realised I own a couple of ECM8000s.

But, they're electrets. So they don't count :p
 
asulger said:
I'm surprised how obvious the difference sounds on my new 8.2 wharfies. There's the Neumann, sounding very smooth, and every other clip sounding either bright or harsh in comparison.
But that's what most of us have, so hey, we learn to live with brightness :-)
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Now here is a very interesting post. You compared the recordings of both mics and hear an obvious difference on fairly (by this board) higher end monitors. Some have not heard enough of a difference using most likely lower end monitors.

I contend it is those *more* expensive monitors that *allowed* you to even hear any difference at all.

Would you agree that the higher end monitors were better monitors and decidedly needed to properly evaluate these recordings?

That would be my point.
 
slobbermonster said:
and they sound just like a Neumann or Studio projects don't they? :D
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Erm, yeah, sure. :rolleyes:

Maybe I should sell them. I feel like a hypocrite now saying I don't have any condensers, electret or otherwise, when I had those all along.

I could put the money towards another M101 :cool:
 
acorec said:
Now here is a very interesting post. You compared the recordings of both mics and hear an obvious difference on fairly (by this board) higher end monitors. Some have not heard enough of a difference using most likely lower end monitors.

I contend it is those *more* expensive monitors that *allowed* you to even hear any difference at all.

Would you agree that the higher end monitors were better monitors and decidedly needed to properly evaluate these recordings?

That would be my point.
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While I love my own Wharfies, I wouldn't say they're considered by many to be "higher end" (although you did say "fairly"). They do sound good, though, very flat and clean. And, you're right, they DO help you look at the comparison more objectively.

If you're using home stereo monitors or something worse, there's a pretty good chance you're not hearing what you need to hear.
 
Han's post is great! Everyone who's really interested needs to read his post until it melts into your head... There is simply no "best" mic for everything - not even when you have top-of-the-line Neumanns.

I also understand slobbermonster's point of view and he makes a very good point. When you're working against the clock, you don't have time to screw around trying to see what works and what doesn't, so you go with what you know will work 95% of the time.

However, if you are like me and do have some time, you may discover like Han that a $99 mic smokes a $4K mic on a source or two. :)

(ok, so I really don't have time, but I'll make some to keep from spending $4-5K. ;) )
 
It was the Harvmaster who said: there aint no such thing as a mic that will do great on any application (or words with the same meaning).

BTW Flatpicker, thanks for the kudos!
 
Tim is right ... as usual ... and so is Han. Also, why can't people just deal with the fact that they disagree with each other? Pretty much everyone - with the usual exceptions - has made cogent points in this debate, yet all we end up with is the boring steaming pile of whatever that this has become!

I'm still going to buy some SP mics ... just because I can't afford to miss out on the chance of decent mics in this price range. Maybe in a few years I'll put my C414s or Bottle on one side because actually this guitar/voice/maraca sounds better in my mix through a B1. Can you afford to take that chance?
 
Noise, don't worry, there are many occasions that I prefer another mic over the Neumann. I prefer a Beyer ribbon for trumpets and Tbones and you'll be surprised about a Sennheiser MD441 on alto or soprano saxophone.

As a vocal microphone though, the Neumann M149 is superior on almost any voice, but on some voices you will prefer a mic like MXL V69 or a SP T3.

Besides that, it's the indian, not the arrow, remember?
 
Yes indeed! I like your attitude. I'm intending to meet up with the PMI guys when they're in the UK in April so I'll be looking at my bank balance then. April will be the month of new mics chez Noisedude!!

Nik
 
I know this thread is C1 related, but I'm anxious to try the new Studio Projects offerings. Do you think it would be ok if one of us started a new thread and invited Brent to talk about them, or would that be spaming? I sure would like to hear his take on them and I bet other's here would too!
 
I know this thread is C1 related, but I'm anxious to try the new Studio Projects offerings. Do you think it would be ok if one of us started a new thread and invited Brent to talk about them, or would that be spaming? I sure would like to hear his take on them and I bet other's here would too!
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I'd be interested. Maybe they got something cool?
 
what the example tells me is neve preamps rock big time, as does a nice guitar.

sd
 
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