I Now Have FOUR R2R Machines Here- I REALLY Gotta Get To Working On Them

S

stevieb

Just another guy, really.
They are:

Fostex R8- 8 track, 1/4". Needs rubber, at least.

TEAC 3340B- 4-track, 1/4" Pinch roller won't move into position on it's own, prob. other issues (this one was a gimmie.)

TASCAM 38- 8 track, 1/2". Needs rubber, I think that's all.

Revox A77- 2-track 1/4" (consumer type deck, so it's 2 tracks one way, then 2 the other.)

All except the R8 will take 10" reels.

I figure, now it's time to get crackin' on them all.

Is there a single source for parts for ALL R2R machines? I am thinking I could save some $, at least on shipping.

Any general advise on repairing them? I am a noob at R2R repair...

And advise on those particular machines? Any of them worth repairing, or NOT worth repairing, in general?

Tell me about alignment tapes, degaussing tools, and other specalized stuff for R2R- how important are those things? How expensive are they? Can I make my own? How often should they be used?

I know there are people/groups who can convert a machine to 2-track- can I do it myself? I am thinking I's want to make either the TEAC or the Revox into a 1/2", 2-track machine. Should I stay with 1/4" on that project? Etc??

I promise, I will take pics of the heads and post here, soon. Just gotta figure out how to post pics here. Advise on THAT?
 
Okay: Rubber.

A rubber refurb will take care of most transport related problems, in many cases. The belts will stretch and fail eventually with age. The rubber may have stretched out a bit, or worst case may become a gooey tarry mess that no longer resembles rubber or belts, per se. You don't know until you get under the covers.

Each unit would be specifically different to service, but I know for certain on the 38 the access to the belt would be by removing the front panel, then some minor mechanical disassembly. Another thing worth mentioning is the rubber washer on the head/load and hub-brake solenoids may become gooey and prevent either the tape loading to the heads/pinchwheel from engaging the capstan, or may prevent the brakes from releasing properly, or both. Either thing would be fixed by replacing the rubber parts. The solenoid washers may be removed and don't necessarily have to be replaced, as all they're for is damping of the solenoid mechanical sound. The worst part about actuating a machine where the brakes are locked on the hubs is overload damage to the reel motor, so beware. There's another scenario on the 38 where the reel hub itself becomes loose on the reel motor shaft. Been there & done that.

Any of these machines are worth repairing if you do it mostly DIY. Bench tech time for these units would be prohibitively expensive, and then I'd only recommended to use authentic TEAC repair in CA. Revox and Fostex you're kind of on your own.

A 2 track conversion of some decks might be feasible thru a professional outfit, but I'm not sure if any of these decks fall under the umbrella of retrofitting. Mostly what I've seen online about 2-track retrofits pertains to Ampex's, Otari's, MCI or Studer decks. Your Revox may be included in that family, but best to check yourself online. To DIY I suppose would be feasible, but would take a lot of ramping up of your expertise.

The proper alignment tools for R/R repair are invaluable, but will set you back a bit financially. It's a big commitment, especially for the no-experience newbie. Anyone who plans on doing this long term would be best to invest in the tools. They will pay for themselves eventually vs. the tech time charges you might incur over the long run.

To attach a photo to a post, they must be 64K bytes limit, plus you must have a few posts under your belt to gain the capability on the BBS.

/DA

PS: Is there any reason you got 4 junkers, eh,... I mean repair units? Is this just bad luck on eBay or did you seek out cheaper units that need repair?

On the positive side, IMO nearly every unit you have can be repaired, so it's not totally bleak.
 
All those units are far from junkers IMO. All are worthy of repair. They likely just need some TLC, rubber and lube, and perhaps a cap or two changed and you should be good to go. I would invest in a quality demag unit like the han d mag, and maybe an alignment tape. Good luck! :)
 
Got them all at different times, Reel Person:

Fostex- pawn shop. Inop at the time, seems to only need belts.

Ampeg 38- couple months ago, via Craigslist.

Revox- 2nd hand store. Might be completly good to go, have not tried it out, yet.

TEAC 3340B- freebie given to my son.
 
All worthy decks with the exception of Revox which is not unworthy, just not worthy like the rest. My 2p. No experience with it.

The 38 is the heartiest of them all, the 3340 second and the R8 a close third IMHO but what I've heard from an R8 sounded really great.

None of those decks are going to be easy conversions to 2-track. You'd be ahead in time, money and frustration to look for a decent half-track deck. Maybe a 32 or a 22-2.

Get the right degaussing tool. I've tried the cheapy ones on eBay. They don't work.. I have an Annis Han-D-Mag and it was worth every penny I paid for it. Like A Reel Person said, decide if you are in this for the long hual and if the answer is yes then it is time to invest in the right tools. And it'll cost, but it is indeed worth it. I invested in the tools while cutting my teeth refurbing my 58. That was time-consuming learning how to use them and follow the manual etc. But when it came time to refurb my 48 sold to lo.fi. it was a breeze. It was so refreshing and rewarding not to be monkeying with patchwork solutions and tools, but to have the right tools for the job and the setup and alignment procedures went smooth.

Do you have the operations and service manuals for all those decks?

You cannot make your own cal tape. You have to buy one and I recommend new. You can buy used but it better be from a known trusted source. I bought my 1/2 15ips IEC tape from Beck, who is of course a known trusted source.

Maybe start with just a 1/4" cal tape and focus on the R8 and the 3340. You could use the 3340 as a mixdown deck until you find a 1/2-track deck, just use tracks 1 and 3 I believe. It'll have the same track width as the Revox but better fidelity electronics and faster transport speed for mastering. You may be able to find a cal tape that'll do both the R8 and the 3340, like a basic tone tape with 7.5 and 15ips tones. The only trick will be if one of the decks is NAB eq and the other is IEC although there are ways around that.

I recommend just sourcing parts from Teac in California PARTS@teac.com (323) 727-4840 for the 38 and 3340...they'll be genuine Teac, new and probably cheaper than other sources. For the Fostex I don't know...
 
Whoa, there Sweetbeats- the Revox may be much better than you think. I found this site

that said this about the Revox:
The A77 tape recorder is perhaps the panzer of open reels. It is very heavily built and well designed. It is a 3 motor machine, with both capstan and reel motors being direct drive, so the only belt is a counter belt. These are large reel capable and record and play in only one direction. Revox strove for performance and reliability rather than bells and whistles like auto reverse and such. The A77 came in quarter track or half track and could be ordered with various speed configurations, the most common being 3 3/4 ips (9,5 cm/sec) and 7 1/2 ips (19 cm/sec), though machines with 1 7/8 ips (4,75 cm/sec) or 15 ips (38 cm/sec) capability do show up. These have very few electronic failures, so the most important components to be sure of on one of these is how much headwear there is and the condition of the brake hubs and bands. They have an optical auto stop which requires an incandescent bulb, which sometimes burns out. If an A77 is found with little wear, but with much time elapsed since last service, they need the usual restoration work minus the belt and tire replacement required by certain other machines. After such work is done, they are very reliable and perform beautifully. Parts have generally been expensive but available in our recent experience. This machine is a very good performer in home, and has the durability to put up with heavy or professional use if desired.

Doesn't that make it the 1/4", 2-track machine I want? If it does, I think I would not need a 1/2" 2-track machine, as
1/2" divided by 8 tracks (TASCAM 38) = 0.06" tape width per track,
and
1/4" divided by 2 tracks (Revox) = 0.05" tape width per track- almost the same.

Right???

Just found another site where a guy says basically the A77 is not the bee's knees:
http://palimpsest.stanford.edu/byform/mailing-lists/arsclist/2007/11/msg00172.html
 
When you said 1/2" 2-track, I assumed you meant you were going to acquire some 2-track heads - at colossal expense - and convert the deck, but from what you've just said it sounds more likely you're thinking of using just 2 tracks from the 8-track machine with its existing heads. If so, that's not really what it was designed to do.

A true 1/2" stereo deck will give the best part of 1/4" per channel. That's a lot of track width and the quality is likely to be superb if the machine is up to spec and properly adjusted to take the new heads. However, 1/2" tape is not cheap, and most classic albums were mixed to plain old 1/4" stereo so it's not strictly necessary to go that far.

The Revox comes in two basic formats, quarter-track and half-track. 1/4-track will give you a similar track width to the '38 in stock configuration or the 3340. In this format, you'll be able to record on both sides of the tape and flip it over but the quality won't be as good as a 1/2-track machine (1/16" per track).
1/2-tracks give you roughly 1/8" of tape per track, but you can't flip the tape over. This, at 15ips is/was the main standard for 2-track studio work.

I guess at the end of the day it all depends what you're trying to achieve.
 
Like I said regarding the A77 "My 2p. No experience with it" and "...not unworthy...". Basically take what I say with a grain of salt because I'm not experienced with them.

Look at the heads on your A77 and count how many tracks you see. That'll tell you if it is a 1/4-track bi-directional machine (meaning you flip the tape over to get 2 tracks in both directions) or a 1/2-track machine.

Just because the A77 is "capable of record and play in only one direction" doesn't mean it is a 1/2-track machine...just means you have to manually flip the tape over. Look at the heads.

I see absolutely no reason to go looking for a 1/2" 1/2-track machine. Relatively very expensive and hard to find. I would expect you to be very happy with the mastering quality of a 1/4" 1/2-track machine at 15ips in good repair. Countless hits have been mastered on that format. If it was good enough for them...
 
NOT planning on using only two tracks of the TASCAM 38...

Here's the plan...

Keeping the TASCAM 38 and the Revox 77A. Both will go to my son's recording/rehersal studio business in New Orleans (Studio 101.)

Fixing the other two, and selling them. Hope to gain both experience and some profit.

WHOOO HOOOO! It looks like the Revox heads have "only" two tracks, each (erase, record and playback heads.) So, unless they move, that would mean it records only two tracks per tape, on one pass, right? Record and PB heads have 4 colored wires on them, erase three.

But wait- it's VERY hard to get a little mechanic's mirror in there, but holding a tape measure next to the heads, it appears they are either 1/32" or 1/16" wide (very hard to be sure, soooo tight in there.)

Now I am really confused.
 
stevieb said:
WHOOO HOOOO! It looks like the Revox heads have "only" two tracks, each (erase, record and playback heads.) So, unless they move, that would mean it records only two tracks per tape, on one pass, right? Record and PB heads have 4 colored wires on them, erase three.

But wait- it's VERY hard to get a little mechanic's mirror in there, but holding a tape measure next to the heads, it appears they are either 1/32" or 1/16" wide (very hard to be sure, soooo tight in there.)

Now I am really confused.
Click to expand...

This isn't my field as I haven't done much on my reel to reel yet, but I would assume that if they made it so you have to flip over the tape, then it would only have 2 tracks and they would be offset to record/play one half of the tape...when you flip it over it would get the other half.

Thats my educated guess based on what you posted about your Revox.
 
stevieb said:
NOT planning on using only two tracks of the
Keeping the TASCAM 38 and the Revox 77A. Both will go to my son's recording/rehersal studio business in New Orleans (Studio 101.)
Click to expand...
Cool.

WHOOO HOOOO! It looks like the Revox heads have "only" two tracks, each (erase, record and playback heads.) So, unless they move, that would mean it records only two tracks per tape, on one pass, right? Record and PB heads have 4 colored wires on them, erase three.
Click to expand...
All A77 heads have 2 tracks. The question is whether they stretch the entire width of the head between them or are two narrower bands. The former is a half-track head (stereo, one direction) and the latter is a quarter-track, (stereo, either direction).
On a two-direction stereo machine you flip the reels over at the end - like a cassette, but a bit more hassle. Revox machines don't have a 4-track head or move it around like more modern domestic machines.

But wait- it's VERY hard to get a little mechanic's mirror in there, but holding a tape measure next to the heads, it appears they are either 1/32" or 1/16" wide (very hard to be sure, soooo tight in there.)
Now I am really confused.
Click to expand...

That would be consistent with a 1/4-track head. Best way to tell is probably the erase head. If I remember my Revoxes right the two halves of the head are staggered - you should easily be able to tell if they are spread over the width of the tape or only part of it. If not, try taking the end of some tape and holding it next to the head as a reference.
 
UPDATE:

Finally got busy on them.

TASCAM 38 only needed a belt!

Fostex only needed the belt put back on the flywheel!

TEAC only needed the decrorative cover on the pinch roller to be straightened- it had been wacked and was dragging on the roller!

Revox needed NOTHING!

I figured out that the Revox is a quarter-track machine. Hoping I can find some half-track heads for it, for a reasonable price.

thanks, everyone, for your help.
 
JRF Magnetics may have the 2 track head you need for the Revox. I don't know diddly about converting a 4 track stereo to 2 track stereo. I would assume that it would be simple L & R are L & R. I did look into this for a Teac A-3300SX and determined there were differences in electronics and the motors, so I bought a dedicated 1/2 track but I didn't pursue it that far.
 
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