PER525 & PER528: are they worth using, what bias etc?

[david winter]

Hi there,

I just got a nice number of tapes from a former radio engineer. Most are AGFA type PER525 and some are PER528. I also found a few PER428 and there are also some black tapes of unknown brand (probably Scotch as I have several scotch boxes as well).

Since most of the tapes are PER types, I wanted to know whether they will wear the heads more than other models, whether they can develop stickiness (so far, never seen), and what bias should be applied to the 525 type. Would 528 be compatible with 525 settings ?

Another question: at home I'm using a 2-track Revox B77MK2 with 7.5/15 ips speeds. How compatible is this machine with Nagra IV-S ? This is because a friend of mine has some rare records which I'd like to put on tape, and I need to know whether recording on the Nagra and playing on the Revox is compatible or not.

Finally: any of you knows how to estimate the duration of a used tape ? I only have a 4-digit counter on the Revox and this counter rotates as far as the take-up reel rotates. That means, using two tapes of same length and different thickness will never measure the same value on the counter. Any ideas ?


Thanks,

David.

 

[Beck]

Are the tapes used? If you're going to be archiving important material it's best to buy new tape. PER 528 is a tough broadcast tape made for repeated play and archiving. It’s not real smooth so will cause greater head wear. That probably won’t matter too much if you’re only using this tape for a small project, but it’s something to be aware of for long term use.

The main problem is if it was open when you got it you have to make sure the right tape is on the right reels. The old AGFA has a white backing so you can write on it. PER 528 is printed on the back. I don't know about 525. (By the way the new RMGI version of PER 528 does not have the white backcoating).

I can’t recommend a bias setting for the Nagra because I don’t know the gap length. Bias for the B77 @ 15 ips using a 10 kHz tone is 3.0 dB down from peak.

The only AGFA tape that has sticky-shed is PEM 469.

If you want to buy new tape, RMGI SM468 (formerly AGFA-Gevaert PEM 468) is a great tape for Nagra and Revox. It’s very good for archiving.

http://www.rmgi.nl

http://www.rmgi.eu

If your B77 is a half-track it may be compatible with the Nagra IV-S. The equalization must be the same on both machines (NAB or IEC1/CCIR). Also the Nagra is a lot hotter at 0 VU, 450 nWb/m (G510) compared to 250 nWb/m for the Revox. You can’t use the NagraMaster setting if you want to play back on a standard NAB or IEC1 machine.

Use an external stopwatch or digital cooking timer to determine tape running time. You can use the charts in the link below to determine thickness once running time is known.

http://www.richardhess.com/tape/timing.htm

 

[david winter]

Thanks for your reply. My Revox is a 2-track stereo model, like the Nagra IV-S. I have no idea whether my Revox is set for NAB or CCIR or IEC1. I guess NAB ? It was used at a radio station in Paris.

The PER525 are the predecessor of the 528. From what I've been told, the first two digits represent the thickness in microns, so 52 microns (0.052mm, so around 1.32mi if I'm correctl). The last digit is the oxyde generation, so 5 or 8 in my case. PER525 has pink-like backing and, as you say, PER528 has gray/white backing with darker oxyde. 5 oxyde looks like old cassette tapes and general consumer reel tapes.

I find these tapes quite pleasant but of course I have a limited knowledge in tape quality. All I can say is that those PER525 don't look as shiny as, for example, LPR35 tape made by RMG International.

My other concern is that I always fear some print-trough effects on thinner tapes. That's why I opted for PER 525/528 so far. I didn't have any trouble with the LGR, nor I had any trouble with MAXELL 35-90B UD and XL. Any opinion on those tapes ?


Thanks,

David.

 

[Beck]

RMGI LPR35 and Maxell XL 35-90B are both great tapes. They have no sticky-shed problems. I have new-old-stock Maxell going back to about 1980. It runs well no matter how old it is. Print-through is a concern with 1-mil tape in general, but I’ve never had a problem with Maxell at 250 nWb/m. Low print tapes like RMGI SM468 or Quantegy 478 are probably a better fit for the Nagra.

XL 35-90B is hard to find at a reasonable price in The States. Do you have a good source for it in Europe?

 

[david winter]

So far I visited a guy who put a small advert on a website to sell his stuff. He had over 200 tapes, with about 50%-60% Ampex 456 and 407 which I all trashed because they deposited so much and also generated some hiss on the rollers of my Nagra. They didn't stick, but were close to in my opinion. The rest were all XL 35-90B. Of the 50-60 tapes I have, half are not full, but perfectly usable. The rest is full but several have one or a few splits with green tape between. So far I recorded around 10 reels which were as new. I never tried to find other sources but I don't think there is the same demand here in France. The market for tape recorders is very low except for Nagra and maybe studio models. As for general consumer models, they are quite hard to sell at decent prices. Revox will always sell, but not as high as they used to. When I got my two B77MK2 I had them revised by a Revox dealer and sold the duplicate on eBay for 350 euros ($470 or so).

What's the general price for NOS XL 35-90B and used ones ? I didn't expect them to be expensive, if they are.


David.

 

[Beck]

What's the general price for NOS XL 35-90B and used ones ? I didn't expect them to be expensive, if they are.

NOS usually goes for between $20.00 - $35.00 US each, depending on how crazy the bidding is. I bought it for about $8.00 each a few years ago when Maxell was still making it. Used is very cheap... less than $15.00. I avoid used tape though since you never know what you're going to get.