Tentelometer

[SwanSong]

I was wondering, is there anyway to adjust the tape tension, accurately without a tentelometer? I've got a tascam 388 that plays and records fine, but to rewind and fast forward you've got to manually pull the tension roller down slightly till it goes. I've bid on a Tentelometer on ebay, and looked into a new one from Tentelo.com but they're around $400-$700 new and I can't spend that kind of money. So my question is, can I just adjust the tension until it fast forwards and rewinds fine, or is that impossible to do, or just strongly recommended not to do. Any help/advice would be much appreciated thanks.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

I suppose you could just "wing it" without the meter but you'll end up with a course adjustment that may end up eating or stretching your tapes so the proper answer is to try to use a Tentelometer unless you're willing to gamble on damaging your tapes?

You should also keep in mind that Tentelometers were offered in several different models for different machine and tape formats and some ebay sellers might try to pass off ones used for VCR's, for audio where the calibration of the meter itself could be out of range for accurate measurements.

I bought one off an ebay dude a few years back and he pulled a fast one on me, claiming it was exclusively designed for open reel audio decks when in fact, it turned out to be a model designed for U-Matic decks.

A trusted technician with the proper gear might be your best bet in the long run.

Cheers!

 

[A Reel Person]

Nay, it's a DIY'er's adjustment & you don't need a tentelometer.

On the 388, there's the Reel-Servo card, & on this card is the L/R Tension arm position adjustments. You need to adjust so the left and right tension roller's centerline is aligned with the bottom of the left and right idler rollers, respectively. When you adjust by eyeball for this 'geometry', by some miracle of science the tension is right and the FF/RW performance is renovated. If your tension arms are riding high, there's too much tension, which decreases all transport functions.

Check the manual for the pot # adjustment for Left and Right Tension Arm Position. I believe if you adjust properly there, you probably won't need any further adjustment for your problem.

Good luck.

 

[SwanSong]

I really appreciate the quick replys from you guys. Reel Person, I adjusted the little things in the servo-card and it works perfectly now. I just adjusted R112 and R212 a little tiny bit and that got everything working perfectly. I can't thank you guys enough.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

On the 388, there's the Reel-Servo card, & on this card is the L/R Tension arm position adjustments. You need to adjust so the left and right tension roller's centerline is aligned with the bottom of the left and right idler rollers, respectively. When you adjust by eyeball for this 'geometry', by some miracle of science the tension is right and the FF/RW performance is renovated. If your tension arms are riding high, there's too much tension, which decreases all transport functions.

Check the manual for the pot # adjustment for Left and Right Tension Arm Position. I believe if you adjust properly there, you probably won't need any further adjustment for your problem.

Good luck.

I'm sure you're right about this as I don't have a 388 and was basing my answer on my experience with my MS-16 which documents using a Tentelometer in the manual for setting up those things.

The Meter I have is the T2-H15 UM which is listed as 3rd from the top of recommended models for audio work. Tentelometers came in 7 different models and each one was designed to read tension in different ranges of grams or ounces. Mine has a range of 0 to 15 ounces with the middle of the scale's range being in the 3 to 4 ounce range which is suited more for 1/4" and 1/2" decks.

The meter can also be a useful tool to determining things like warped reels, bad pinch rollers, out of round capstan shafts and bad servo circuits based on the oscillation speed of the meter pointing to various service issues...all of this info coming from the manual which came with my meter.

Cheers!

 

[A Reel Person]

It's just convenient, that...

When you set that 'geometry' with the rollers, the tension is about right.
I'm sure it's in the 'numbers' (of the design).

 

[MCI2424]

I was wondering, is there anyway to adjust the tape tension, accurately without a tentelometer? I've got a tascam 388 that plays and records fine, but to rewind and fast forward you've got to manually pull the tension roller down slightly till it goes. I've bid on a Tentelometer on ebay, and looked into a new one from Tentelo.com but they're around $400-$700 new and I can't spend that kind of money. So my question is, can I just adjust the tension until it fast forwards and rewinds fine, or is that impossible to do, or just strongly recommended not to do. Any help/advice would be much appreciated thanks.

Spring scales will do it. Order from a good supplier and know what ranges you need. This methos is recommended from every pro manual I know of and it how the tension was set at the factory.

 

[A Reel Person]

Yeah, true.

'Cept it's a bit harder to get the tension set on the 388 with a spring scale, due to it's inset deck arrangement. For standalone reel/reels, the spring scale method is the ticket.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

The tension is so thick in here, you could splice it with a razor blade!

It sounds like the moral of this story is that there's more then one way to skin a cat and adjust tape tension.

Cheers!

 

[Beck]

Unfortunately some of the later generation dynamic servo controlled transports like on the TSR/MSR and 388 are tricky to measure with a spring scale because they are constantly adjusting tension based on info from sensors. The tape really has to be threaded and rolling, which leaves the Tentelometer as the only choice.

With a spring scale one trick (for TSR/MSR) is just measuring the back tension in dump-edit mode. You have to keep the scale in motion while reading the gauge. If you hold the scale in one place the reel motor will freak out and you can’t get an accurate reading. Plus you have to find out what the tension should be while using a spring scale instead of a Tentelometer. The manual may not give procedures for a spring scale.

 

[A Reel Person]

Where can you get one? They aren't made anymore, are they?

 

[Beck]

They still make 'em, but they are so expensive they might as well not.

http://www.tentel.com/prod01a.htm

 

[The Ghost of FM]

They still make 'em, but they are so expensive they might as well not.

http://www.tentel.com/prod01a.htm

I'm very glad and fortunate to have found a used one on ebay for considerably less then what they go for new!

I got mine for 8 bucks! True story; The guy I bought it from had it for sale in the auction for around $150 when he stopped the auction because he dropped the unit while inspecting it to answer a question about the model number that I had written to him about and because he didn't know how to test it and didn't know if he killed it or not, he offered it to me for just shipping alone which was 8 dollars. Long story short; it works 100%.

Cheers!

 

[ausrock]

The T2-H20-ML "Audio" model is about as easy to find (on ebay) as rocking horse shit, it took me months of watching before I managed to find a decent one with a seller prepared to ship to Aust. I can't recall the cost but it wasn't too much compared to the new price.

The Tascam ATR-60 manuals lists required equipment for servicing, this includes both spring scales of two different ranges and the Tentelometer.

 

[ron-e-g]

Knucklehead question. How do you read the scale? numbers above the line? what are the numbers below? Can I assume my meter (shown below) will only read to 140 grams?



Thanks,
Ron

 

[mdainsd]

Ounces.

 

[ron-e-g]

Thanks mdainsd. I was afraid of that. Not going to measure 500 +/- 30 grams with this. What model is good. The T2- H2 -ML?

 

[Krakatowa]

Just curious, but could one fabricate a roller to a "coat hanger" shapped bracket, allowing the tape to pass over the roller, supported by one hand, then pull the common point of the "hanger" to the spring tension meter with the other hand.
If it sounds feesable, Ill draw out my idea.