how to compose songs?

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kudos

I love the two or three posts of yours that I have read, Mr. Honesty. Which is just another way of saying "I might have written the same thing."

You are from a very rare breed.. a person who truly can diagnose a topic and clear away the so-called arguments. Love it!

You have an uncanny, and very rare, ability to shred through all the hyperbole and put things back on point. Keep it up man! 6 billion people CAN actually be wrong! lol
 
Thing is guys, it doesn't matter.

Each to his own.

Those that are sure they have the answer, off you go and get on with it.

And those still searching, seek on!

:)
 
In my experience songs spring out of nowhere and come together very fast. I have loads of bits and pieces, loops, riffs and ideas but they mostly lie waiting in digital limbo for the next fase which usually doesn't come.

I also think sitting in front of all the equipment does your head in - so many options, possibilities, maybe try getting away with one instrument.

The best things I've done kind of wrote themselves. Then I recorded them straight away- bad singing, mistakes but it captured the moment. When I later tried to re-record, tidy up - the essence was gone.

If you can't finish something, just say it's finished and move on - Just like an artist's sketchbook.
Pehaps you wanna swap some loops riffs etc?
 
I found this thread to be an interesting read.



Here is my opinion..

but first, a story:
-I went on vacation with my gf and three kids a few weeks ago and brought two digital cameras and a 1080p video camera. I came home with 400 pictures and about 2 hours of video footage. When I got home and started showing some footage and pictures to my Dad, he asked me the question " Wow, with such a nice video camera, why did you take soo many pictures instead of movies?" I told him, "Well, it really just depends on what I feel like will best represent what I'm trying to show" If its catching a fish, teaching my kids how to surf, or chicken fights in a swimming pool, I'll be shooting a movie. If its someone looking at a bird, someone laughing at a joke, or sunset behind a palm tree, I'll snap a picture.


So, when I write a song, I try to focus on what will represent what I'm trying to share from my song. Is it more the melody, vocal line, power, intrigue, riff of the particular song? It's all important, but you just have to be aware of what you are trying to relay to your audience, and focus on working towards that. Additionally, I think to keep things interesting you want to bring the listener through a story, one way or another. Through lyrics, through melody, through chord changes etc. So if you have bits and pieces from songs, I would lay them out in front of you and decide where they would all go logically to tell the story. Then just fill in the gaps with supporting content to support up the story. A melody line is always key to hold together a good song.
 
"I guarantee you, whether someone has learned conventional songwriting method or not, their best most liked songs will always be the ones that conform to conventional techniques the most."
Under that prescription the Vengaboys & Milli Vanilli along with a million others win hands down - a convention/trend/fashion wins everytime. Now, let's all get out our autotunes & do some of those Cher yodels, or disc scratch rhythm, or ABABABBBBBB structure or insert rap after stolen breakdown, or the latest thang.
It boils down to:
a) one's aspiration;
b) one's ability to achieve a) given nature, nurture, socio economic circumstances, parental support, world peace, DIY instructional videos and access to technology
&
c) what works for the individual.
 
"I guarantee you, whether someone has learned conventional songwriting method or not, their best most liked songs will always be the ones that conform to conventional techniques the most."
Under that prescription the Vengaboys & Milli Vanilli along with a million others win hands down - a convention/trend/fashion wins everytime. Now, let's all get out our autotunes & do some of those Cher yodels, or disc scratch rhythm, or ABABABBBBBB structure or insert rap after stolen breakdown, or the latest thang.
It boils down to:
a) one's aspiration;
b) one's ability to achieve a) given nature, nurture, socio economic circumstances, parental support, world peace, DIY instructional videos and access to technology
&
c) what works for the individual.



This is all true, unfortunately.



Responding to a different post, or maybe even a different thread, ... while still acknowledging everything you just wrote, and is true,


... it's my sadness, or heart's contention, being in the smallest of subsets, ... that what passes for art in this industry, is not art at all. The art of making music, is something that artists should do. And true art, and therefore true artists, is rare indeed.

How often does a Rembrandt come on the world scene, or a DaVinci?

Likewise, how often does a Beethoven, or Beatles, come along?


So while it is true that everybody is free to think and pursue what they want (a statement not even worth making), the discussion as to what makes for a good composition is enjoyed most by those who understand composition.


One last thought before I go out for a donut - Even in songwriting, when discussing rules and formulae... had better results prior to 25 years ago. Something I wrote earlier. So, in the genre of songwriting, still, we lament over the lost culture and the individuals in the world who lack training, lack education, are not even aware of excellence, and then worse... become arrogant and consider themselves "stars" or "artists" because of a monetary or popularity achievement.

It's a conspiracy, I tell you.
 
hello..

I'm writing lyrics, riffs, loops but i don't know how to combine it to make a song.. every time I'm on my DAW I'm starting to write something but i don't know how and with what to combine it..

can you give me any tips or tutorials?

Ok, guys, lots of good, philosophical thoughts here, but what about this guy's true, earnest question? He's (I guess I'm assuming the gender) is looking for an answer about how to go about putting the stuff percolating about his head into something cohesive, like a song. What help can he find here for that?
 
hello..

I'm writing lyrics, riffs, loops but i don't know how to combine it to make a song.. every time I'm on my DAW I'm starting to write something but i don't know how and with what to combine it..

can you give me any tips or tutorials?

This is a bit like saying: "Okay . . . I've got a hammer, a packet of nails, a tube of glue, and assorted bits of wood. I want to make something . . . what shall I make?"

Well . . . that's fine. There are many times I've wanted to write a song . . . I've felt that insistent urge . . . but I've not known what to write about. It can be done that way . . . but it is a decidedly difficult way of going about it.

A far more straightforward way is to say: "I want to make a bookcase. Now what do I need? Ah, here's the hammer, the glue, the nails and the wood."

Now . . . I'm not sure what your main problem is . . . whether it is coming up with a tune, coming up with lyrics . . . or whether it is the more mechanical side of assembling musical bits into a coherent structure. Each of these is a problem with its own set of answers. The first two deal mostly (but not exclusively) with the creative content, while the third deals mostly (again, but not exclusively) with musical knowledge, experience and expertise.

For the first two, you could try letting your feet do the talking. Go for a long walk . . . let your footsteps set the rhythm . . . hum along to this rhythm . . . see if a tune forms . . . see if there is a pattern of words that will fit . . . see if a theme pops into your head . . . see if you can remember all of these bits by the time you get back.
 
hello..

I'm writing lyrics, riffs, loops but i don't know how to combine it to make a song.. every time I'm on my DAW I'm starting to write something but i don't know how and with what to combine it..

can you give me any tips or tutorials?

Yeah. Use your ears and your brain.

To write a good song, you need to listen to thousands of songs and styles you love and analyze them to death in order to find out what it is that makes them sound so good to you.

A person who has subjected himself to many hours of funk music will pick up his instrument and play something with the styles and structures of funk in mind. Same goes not only for each musical genre, but by listening to several genres, you subconciously superimpose phrases and stylings into your own playing.

Another way of saying it, is "learn everything you can and forget it". That's all the analysis you need. If Bach were alive he would agree, since that's who I just paraphrased.
 
Ok, guys, lots of good, philosophical thoughts here, but what about this guy's true, earnest question? He's (I guess I'm assuming the gender) is looking for an answer about how to go about putting the stuff percolating about his head into something cohesive, like a song. What help can he find here for that?

:/ I thought I did. Here.. let me get to my point "....So if you have bits and pieces from songs, I would lay them out in front of you and decide where they would all go logically to tell the story. Then just fill in the gaps with supporting content to support up the story. A melody line is always key to hold together a good song. "

I guess you didn't like my lead in story. :)
 
You're right. I like what you said, and agree with you, totally. There are actually a lot of good tid bits, advice, links to more information throughout this thread. Sorry to have sounded negative toward all that.:)
 
and also anyone else in this forum who wants to learn how to make better music... ignore Greg L's advice that dude is the cancer of music. People like him who encourage others to just slap down anything and call it beautiful just because it came from a human being are a dime a dozen in the world of songwriting. His advice is empty, its serves only his own laziness and guaranteed lack of skill/talent. Misery loves company. Never believe anyone who tells you songs are pure inspiration. Cause thats total BS.
.

Lol @ cancer of music. That's rich. Let's hear your stuff. :rolleyes:
 
Lol. This thread is silly. I really kicked some sand into "Mr Honesty's" vagina. What a tool.

Sorry boy, but you are wrong pretty much about everything. Writing phone-book sized posts doesn't make you right when it's filled with rambling opinion and nonsense. Your warped perception of me is hilarious though. Keep up the good work.
 
Lol. This thread is silly. I really kicked some sand into "Mr Honesty's" vagina. What a tool.

Sorry boy, but you are wrong pretty much about everything. Writing phone-book sized posts doesn't make you right when it's filled with rambling opinion and nonsense. Your warped perception of me is hilarious though. Keep up the good work.

I say "Mr. Honesty" should post a link to one of his "songs". Anyone can hide behind their computer criticizing someone else who has posted great music here.

Let's hear your "music", Mr. Honesty. Prove to us that you have 1/10 the talent Greg has, and then maybe we'll take you seriously. Put up or shut up, bitch.
 
It doesn't even really matter. I suspect this guy is an alias of someone who is too chickenshit to say these things under their real username.
 
young

It doesn't even really matter. I suspect this guy is an alias of someone who is too chickenshit to say these things under their real username.

There always seems to be some juvenile in the crowd who speaks his delinquency, and would attempt to ruin intellectual discussions.


Must be to match the juvenile songwriting of said youngster.



Signed,

Not a chickenshit. :)
 
proves nothing

I say "Mr. Honesty" should post a link to one of his "songs". Anyone can hide behind their computer criticizing someone else who has posted great music here.

Let's hear your "music", Mr. Honesty. Prove to us that you have 1/10 the talent Greg has, and then maybe we'll take you seriously. Put up or shut up, bitch.


Another immature statement.


Whether or not somebody can or cannot pick up an instrument and play it, let alone compose music on it, does not disqualify a person from being able to critique what they hear.

Thousands upon thousands would elect to sit in on one composer's concert in deference to another's. During the classical era, as an example, people had a much higher acumen for music than today's generation. Nevertheless, people can analyze music without being able to play, or write.

The discussion surrounding the OP's question was all good until the young kids, some acting like bully's, got into it.

Does it ever stop?
 
There always seems to be some juvenile in the crowd who speaks his delinquency, and would attempt to ruin intellectual discussions.


Must be to match the juvenile songwriting of said youngster.



Signed,

Not a chickenshit. :)

Still waiting to hear your brilliant music. :rolleyes:

And lol @ juvenile songwriting. You self-inflated douchebags are a hoot. :D

All I did was offer an opinion and encouragement to just write whatever comes naturally. It doesn't have to be deep or technical. Some of the most popular and respected music of the past 50 years has been neither deep nor overly technical. I still don't see why that's a bad thing, and none of you loudmouthed self-righteous long posters have proven otherwise. You crybabies just got mad and went on the attack over nothing.
 
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