warm Overhead mics, don't like a "sharp" sound...?

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earworm

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hi there,

i've spent lots of time recording my drumkit without Overheads,
well, i mean, i got an AKG c414 that i often use for overheads,
but then i don't have a nice stereo image

now the time has come to spend money on two extra condensors,

tried to do some searches here, but where on earth did the SEARCH button go?

what i'm looking for are condensers (matched pair would be great)
that don't sound harsh on the cymbals, of course, depends on lots of stuff,

but i'm into dark, warm sounds, don't like loud hihats or cymbals,
but thats just me

so what about......whats THE nicest pair of Overheads you can get (money isn't an issue),
and what about ... just a nice pair (money is an issue ;) )

and well,,,,now that i started i'm just gonna fire another question,
if i get me two pencil condensers, would be great if they sound nice on accoustic guitars too, but that's not my main goal,

drums is what i'm born for :)

cheers!!
 
If money isn't a problem, the AEA R84 ribbon mics are wonderful for overhead mics. The Oktava MC012 are also pretty neutral. While some people may disagree with me, I also like the Behringer ECM8000's as overheads.
 
For a warm sound there's but one solution: ribbons.

You should try a pair of ribbons like the Beyer M160 in an ORTF or DIN placement some 2' above the drumkit and be amazed about the stereo image.
 
Shure KSM32's will fit the bill perfectly. I use them on most albums I record regardless of budget for the same reason you mentioned. The have a nice neutral sound that sounds great on overheads and they do not get ugly when a cybal is pretty harsh. Also what I love about them is that they EQ well, so if you decide later you want to crank up some high end on your overheads, they will not get ugly and harsh like a 414 or cheap LDC.

It does not matter if I am recording a 15 year old loud as hell punk drummer of a more nuanced drummer like Terry Bozzio, the KSm32 is almost always the first mics I put up.
 
I use two studio projects b1s they kick ass. They bring in a warm full sound, plus work kick ass on vocals and guitars.
 
well condensors for drums...ok. place them well! it depends how you play.

they should do well for acoustic too..depends what gear you use after the mics....
possibly youll need them to sound fatter! again it depends...how you want them to sound.

i play the drums for 18 years..i was 7yrs. when i started... personally i used standart drum mics you can easily clip-on plus an overhead mic. then mixed it together. fat!
like this you can set the vol. to each unit...snare tom hihat...separately.

greets y.
 
Warm ... not sharp ... sounds like a call for ... AKG C1000S :eek:
 
I've heard good things about the Marshall MXL603 for budget warm SDC.
 
<< I've heard good things about the Marshall MXL603 for budget warm SDC.>>

hmmmmm.....

.....you must be hearing different things than i'm hearing. i like my 603s plenty, but "warm" and "dark" are certainly NOT 2 adjectives i'd use to describe them. in fact, quite the opposite. they're definitely not what i like to use as overheads in my room. they work great on my acoustic, but they about kill me as overheads.

on the contrary, i've been having some real good success with using my MXL V67 as an overhead. plenty dark (well, at least "not overly bright" like most of today's chinese-made dreck), nice wide pickup and plenty of "thwack" from the snare without killing me on the cymbals. i've been recording with it in mono--need to pick up a second for stereo, but i'm lazy.

lately, too, i've been combining the V67 with my SP B1, and have gotten some very nice sounds--put the B1 on the hihat/snare side of the kit and the V67 on the ride side. they complement each other quite well.


anyway, if dark is what you're looking for, don't look at the 603's. of course, like i said, "dark" these days tends to mean "just not extremely hyped in the highs", rather than truly "dark"......


cheers,
wade
 
I have to agree with the 603 comments. As over heads, I actually find them quite bright. I have used them with pretty good results as over heads but had to put a little more effort in the EQ to get them to sound right. Great for acoustic guitar though.

As for the cheap LDC...I've experimented using two MXL V69's. It turned out a lot better than I was expecting.
 
find an old pair of AKG 451's... great on high end stuff without being harsh, imo.
 
thanx alot for the comments, real helpful,

now i'm gonna start checking out prizes and search some more reviews,

gonna buy them around newyear, but i alwas invest some time in research

:D

ribbons... sounds exciting , i worked with a bunch of condensers but never with ribbon mics
any other suggestions than the Beyer M160 ?

cheers!
 
I agree with the others re the 603's. I recently posted a similar question at a different forum. I like the 603's as overheads, but they are too bright & detailed for some of the more 'rock' stuff I've done. Dan Richards recommended groove tubes GT44's, or for a cheaper option oktava 319's. Personally, I didn't like the v67's as overheads when I tried them, but maybe I'll give them another shot. I'm also curious how ADK Hamburgs do in this application if anyone has any experience with them.
 
Han said:
For a warm sound there's but one solution: ribbons.

You should try a pair of ribbons like the Beyer M160 in an ORTF or DIN placement some 2' above the drumkit and be amazed about the stereo image.
Click to expand...

+1 Beyer M160's...fantastic mics...

The R84 will give you a bigger sound though, but both have a sweet ribbon-y high end.

War
 
I'm just a bit curious... the folks who are advocating the AKG and Studio Projects stuff... have you ever heard something like a Neumann SM-69? ...or a Royer SF-12? ... or anything else besides the AKG's/Studio Projects stuff?

I'm just curious if there is something here with a point of reference or if it's just the minor miracle that sound can run through a wire that is influencing your endorsement...
 
Fletcher said:
I'm just a bit curious... the folks who are advocating the AKG and Studio Projects stuff... have you ever heard something like a Neumann SM-69? ...or a Royer SF-12? ... or anything else besides the AKG's/Studio Projects stuff?

I'm just curious if there is something here with a point of reference or if it's just the minor miracle that sound can run through a wire that is influencing your endorsement...
Click to expand...
Fletcher, I assume you mean the MXL/ Studio Projects stuff, and the answer for most folks here would be no, they haven't heard a Neumann or a Royer or a Brauner, or any of the high dollar mics.

A lot of people on the homerecording boards have bought into the "hype" that anybody can make a good "commercial-sounding" recording in their home with just a few hundred dollars worth of the new "flavor of the month" equipment, and no experience.

And it's kinda true as far as the equipment goes - if you happen to be Bruce Sweiden, Al Schmitt, George Massenburg, or Fletcher. Given those tools to work with, I'd bet any of the four people mentioned could turn out acceptable "quality product" almost anywhere. The equipment may slow them down a bit, but it won't stop them. I watched Paul rothchild do magic things with a Tascam Model 10 board and an 80-8 recorder.

So, where's the problem? In most cases, it's a lack of operator experience, not just in recording, but in musical abilities, the arranging, and the actual recording environment. They haven't reached the level of sophistication required to turn out the kind of product they're dreaming about. Unlike Bruce Sweiden, Al Schmitt, George Massenburg, or Fletcher, they haven't been doing this for a living for 8 million years; they haven't yet learned all the tricks and work arounds that only comes with experience.

With a limited budget, they hafta look at low dollar items that will do what they think they need. When they perceive a problem, often the easiest (but wrong) conclusion is to throw more money at the problem.

I lnow that most of the people here ain't ever gonna hear a great Neumann U67 or even a Royer 121, so I spend most of my time here explaining mic positioning and how to get the best out of what you already own.

Most of the stuff recorded here will never see the light of day, or reach the charts, but for many people here, that's not their goal. They just want something to have that is a good representation of what they hear in their head. That's not a bad thing. The MXL/Studio Projects stuff can help them get there; in the right hands, some of it is pretty damn good.
 
Good post Harvey.

Fletcher, that was kind of funny. Not the best I have seen you post, but pretty good! ;)

I always found Shure SM 81's to be somewhat smooth, although they aren't exactly "detailed" either. Also, at the studio, we quit using a pair of AT 4033's in favor of a pair of Neumann KM 184's after we worked with some tracks we got from another studio that used them. The difference was huge! A MUCH warmer mic than anything we had tried before, and they didn't break the bank too bad.
 
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