Tips for a bass newbie

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thebigcheese

thebigcheese

"Hi, I'm in Delaware."
When I say "newbie", I really just mean new to the bass. I've been playing drums my whole life and guitar for the past several years, so I've got the basic music stuff down (sort of). What I'm more interested in are any bass-specific tips some of you more veteran players might have for people like me who are just starting out on the instrument. For instance, the bass is obviously a different animal than the guitar, given the larger strings and the fact that most bass players pluck rather than picking, which is a big change for me because picking is still a lot faster and more accurate for me.

Some background: I picked up a bass because I started to realize that I belong in the rhythm section. In my band, I was almost always playing the rhythm guitar or what amounted to a bass part (except on guitar), so I figured I might as well try it. That, plus we need one for recording. I found that I like the sound of a bass better, and for me it's like a less annoying version of a guitar because there are fewer strings and I don't usually have to deal with all sorts of chord forms and what not.

I also have a few questions. Is there really any difference between bass effect pedals and guitar pedals? More specifically, I'm interested in how to get different distorted bass tones. I really like the sound of the bass in "Two Tabs of Mescaline" by Glassjaw, or in "Hysteria" by Muse (which sounds almost like a synth). Also, my impression is that a lot of people record bass with a DI. I know that there's no "right" way to do things, but I could use some tips on recording bass, too...

Thanks!
 
thebigcheese said:
When I say "newbie", I really just mean new to the bass. I've been playing drums my whole life and guitar for the past several years, so I've got the basic music stuff down (sort of). What I'm more interested in are any bass-specific tips some of you more veteran players might have for people like me who are just starting out on the instrument. For instance, the bass is obviously a different animal than the guitar, given the larger strings and the fact that most bass players pluck rather than picking, which is a big change for me because picking is still a lot faster and more accurate for me.

Some background: I picked up a bass because I started to realize that I belong in the rhythm section. In my band, I was almost always playing the rhythm guitar or what amounted to a bass part (except on guitar), so I figured I might as well try it. That, plus we need one for recording. I found that I like the sound of a bass better, and for me it's like a less annoying version of a guitar because there are fewer strings and I don't usually have to deal with all sorts of chord forms and what not.

I also have a few questions. Is there really any difference between bass effect pedals and guitar pedals? More specifically, I'm interested in how to get different distorted bass tones. I really like the sound of the bass in "Two Tabs of Mescaline" by Glassjaw, or in "Hysteria" by Muse (which sounds almost like a synth). Also, my impression is that a lot of people record bass with a DI. I know that there's no "right" way to do things, but I could use some tips on recording bass, too...

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Well, I'm not exactly a veteran, but I started playing bass about 5 years ago after playing guitar for mumbledy mumble years.

The biggest difference in technique I have found is having to mute unplayed strings. Basses are much worse than guitars about open unmuted strings just kind of starting up on their own from vibrations through the bridge and nut coming from played strings. You pretty much have to keep a finger touching every open string all the time (or at least visit them frequently) the whole time you are playing.

As to effects, many distortion units that work well for guitar are highpassed in such a way that they will cut all the low end out of your signal on bass. Some other effects will do the same thing. You just have to try them, but listen for that specifically.

Playing bass is a gas, innit? I still play guitar, too, but I spend 75% of my time on bass now, just 'cause I dig it.

Play on.
 
I've been playing bass off and on for many years, and recently spent a couple of years gigging on bass in a local honky-tonk band.

You don't need effects. I played a Fender Precision through an Ampeg B100R and everybody loved it. The bass ain't supposed to be complicated, at least in 99% of the music that I've played. Stay in the pocket and stay in tune, and you'll do fine.

The single piece of advice is, get a good sounding bass and amp. That's pretty general, but if you are near a good music store where you can try things out, you'll find pretty quickly what's what. Stay away from bells and whistles and go for the tone. One tone that makes you sound good is worth any number of perhaps equally good tones that don't suit you.

I started playing a P when I discovered (to my surprise) I didn't need two pickups, I didn't need active electronics, I just needed an axe that would shove the dancers' butts around.

Good luck. Bass is fun and gratifying and essential to music.
 
If you are a decent drummer, then you have half of it already. The bass usually(but not always ) follows the bass drum. Pay attention to the relationship between the two, and you'll find "the groove". The drummer and the bass player really lay down the foundation for the music. The rest is all just window dressing. As far as effects go, don't bother. I see a lot of guys with pedal boards and stuff, and to be honest, It usually sounds like ass. The effects you hear being used in the studio don't transfer well to the stage. Think of it this way...what kind of effects can you put on a kick drum? How about just having a sound that's slamming and leave it at that. Any more and it just clutters up the tone.
 
As far as using a flat pick versus finger picking, go with whichever feels more comfortable to you. Using a flat pick gives a sharper, more pronounced note attack, while finger picking gives a mellower, less pronounced note attack. Finger picking an electric bass (which is what I came to prefer) is a carry-over from the days when bands used stand up/double basses. There's also slap bass, which you'll see used quite a bit in funk (Parliament/Funkadelic), where the strings are slapped (popped) with the side of the playing thumb. You'll also see a combination of slap and finger picking used with funk.

I'm with everybody else, when it comes to using effects with bass...unadulterated thump. Since I prefer "set it and forget it," when it comes to the bass amp, if I want to alter how my bass sounds, that's what the volume and tone controls are for. I do have an Epiphone EB3 SG Bass, so I can chose between one of three switching positions and two pickups.

Matt
 
I started on bass in 1974. I've remain a bass player but have learnt a little guitar etc since.
Picking is fine on bass - not as high brow or as tonally round as fingers or thumb but it works just fine. Many use a pick to get some attack in their tone to help fight through the band mud. I swap from pick to fingers dependant on the requirements of a piece.
DI'd bass blended with mic'd bass is the KILLER tone but hard to capture well.
As for pedals ... this may draw some flak but the Behringer Vtone Bass BDI21 DI box is GREAT - gives a range of tones and sounds as well as passive DI and mine, at least, seems quite solid. As my main bass has no pu selection & simple passive vol & tone, and the Marshall only has Presence, Bass & Treble I do occasionally use a signal modifier. Live I just plug straight into the Marshall.
Every company and it's subsiduary seems to be bringing out bass pedals at present. I'd suggest take your bass to a store and trying them.
Behri have a range of specific bass pedals from wah to synth and they're cheap but I've not tried them so I can't give a recco.
I often use a presonus BlueTube as a pre for my bass - fattens the sound somewhat.
Oh & the last piece of bass gear before the amp that i use occasionally & for recording is an OLD Yamaha FX500 unit that has some great bass presets - the fretless in it is great as is the trad bass & it's VERY tweakable.
Finally, I'm old so I have a 100w Marshall Superbass MkII into an massive single cone Etone box.
It's loud enough for rehearsals and small gigs but I use a "tube cube" at home - an attenuator so I can run the Marshall hard for that saturate valve sound but not at extreme volumes.
Oh, don't be shy of a short scale bass if you don't have a long reach - there are some terrific ones out there and, as I found when starting out, much, much easier to play. I moved onto a full scale bass after several years but that was due to lack of options in the early 80's rather than dismissing the shorty (which was stolen and therefore had to be replaced).
 
A bass player I played with gave me this cool trick to mute the sound and give the bass a consistent output and tone from string to string. Put a piece of plastic foam just before the bass bridge, as shown in the picture, and you're playing will sound and record much smoother.

Bassmute-1.jpg
 
Anfontan has pointed out a good, simple and effective tweak.
I use the described mod on my big fat semi acoustic bass though not the solid one.
 
Anfontan said:
A bass player I played with gave me this cool trick to mute the sound and give the bass a consistent output and tone from string to string. Put a piece of plastic foam just before the bass bridge, as shown in the picture, and you're playing will sound and record much smoother.

Bassmute-1.jpg
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Awesome. That's the kinda tip I'm looking for :) Things I wouldn't learn any other way... What exactly is that, and where might I get some?

As for effects, I was mostly asking out of curiosity. As rayc points out, there are a lot of bass pedals these days, and I couldn't figure out why there should be any difference between them. I really just want to be able to get a cool distorted sound out of my bass from time to time. My band tends to play a mix of mellow and heavy stuff, so it's good to be able to fill in with the right sound (for instance, in a song we have right now I have about 3 parts of my own, but most of them could be covered by just the bass if I had a good distorted sound to use).

I already took care of the buying a good bass part. I've learned to never buy something cheap just to save a couple bucks. I went right for the guitar that was nice to play and sounded like what I want a bass to sound like. Oh, and looks cool. I got a Schecter Stilleto Custom-4 in natural satin.

@goldtopchas: I figured that, since both of those are rhythm section, there would be a lot of interplay. Unfortunately, right now I'm both of those sections, so it's a little harder... Maybe one day we'll actually have a gig and can recruit a drummer instead of only having the two of us.
 
With a song I'm working on at the moment I needed a very growly, toppy bass sound just for the chorus. I tried all sorts of tweaking - mostly too subtle - from extra drive from the BDI to an octave added below with an octaver to peaks in EQ. In the end I put a fuzz box in the chain and dialled in some, not much fuzz, to punch in for the choruses. It worked a treat - lifted the bass away from the verse with the distortion and the extra treble boost that came with it. Give that I whirl.
 
rayc said:
With a song I'm working on at the moment I needed a very growly, toppy bass sound just for the chorus. I tried all sorts of tweaking - mostly too subtle - from extra drive from the BDI to an octave added below with an octaver to peaks in EQ. In the end I put a fuzz box in the chain and dialled in some, not much fuzz, to punch in for the choruses. It worked a treat - lifted the bass away from the verse with the distortion and the extra treble boost that came with it. Give that I whirl.
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Dang. I think that's the one type of pedal my Distortion Factory doesn't model. Ah well, time to play around at Guitar Center.
 
I run my bass through a tube pre-amp, and then direct. Then I just use tone to define the sound, depending on what I'm playing.

For me, learning to play bass was a LONG road that could have been made alot easier. I started when I was 15 by picking up a bass at the local music shop. I loved that thing.

But I didn't hook it up to anything. Just played along to songs, and believe me brother, I had to play HARD in order to hear my bass as I played along to Iron Maiden, Dio, U2 and others. I'd just put on an album and play all the way through.

I should have been hooked up to at least a small amp. I was playing way too hard.


BUT, it conditioned my fingers like you wouldn't believe (I didn't use a pick when I learned because I wanted to be like that dude from Iron Maiden, Steve Harris. Anyway, he had this Galloping Bass sound. Iron Maiden's songs were 4/4 times, but he played the bass in triple-time, sort of. It's hard to explain, but it was like, "bud-a-bump, bud-a-bump". Just like horses galloping.


So, once I had that down I just kept playing along to albums.


Now, the way I do it (and am loving it), is I import drum loops from my library (I usually buy drum loops from Beta Monkey) and lay down a three to four minute drum track. I start with one loop (a drum beat) and then play along with it, inventing bass riffs until I find one that sounds good. I have a lot of fun with it.

The groove everyone is talking about is when the drums and bass work well together, and you can not only hear the groove, but feel it. It's unreal.

I play guitar everyday too, but I've always been a strummer. I cannot play lead any better today than I could 25 years ago when I started. I simply do not enjoy playing lead guitar and never wanted to learn how to go fast. I am a strummer and a bassist. I like the groove.

I love guitar solos (by others), but a lot of time, as the solo is screaming, I'm focused on listening to the rhythm guitar and bass.

My best work, which isn't anything to brag about (but I'm proud of it), is this:

Saskatchewan (I have no idea why I titled this song by that name). I made a song using drum loops downloaded, and then made up a few bass lines. Then, after the drums and bass were finished I added guitars. As you can tell, the guitars aren't technical in the slightest. Anyone could play it. The bass on this song is actually played using a pick. I jam with my fingers, but occasionally use a pick (medium guage) while recording. This song might be a heavy pick, but I don't remember.

http://soundclick.com/share?songid=6695565
 
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thebigcheese said:
Awesome. That's the kinda tip I'm looking for :) Things I wouldn't learn any other way... What exactly is that, and where might I get some?
Click to expand...

I think it was a piece of packing material from a computer that I assembled a few years ago. It has the stiffness of styrofoam but is sturdy and will not shred apart like styrofoam.
I use a Johnson J-Station for recording the bass direct and there are some great amp and cabinet simulations for bass and for guitar as well-it can be found on Ebay for around $100 or so and I recommend it.
http://search.ebay.com/johnson-j-station_W0QQfkrZ1QQfnuZ1QQfsooZ2QQfsopZ32
The bass is an Ibanez Jazz bass copy from the mid 70's-their lawsuit era where the copies were sometimes better than the Fender and Gibson guitars they were copying. In the 30+ years I have owned it all I have ever done is change the strings.....and as you see there is some rust on the bridge from loaning it out to a friend that was not as careful with it as I wished he would be....:mad:
 
If picking is more accurate for you, then by all means, pick. You can roll off some tone knob to remove some brightness. Or try using your fingers either nearer to the bridge or the neck, different voicings at either position, and you may find different times to use either approach. I occasionally use a Wooly Mammoth fuzz for bass, typically kicking it on for a specific section of a song. But it is way fuzzy and not an every day pedal. Keeps the bottom end in, though, as it's designed for bass.
 
It's also easier to find a spot in a band when you're a bass player, especially if you have a good amp setup.

And without all the goofy pedals, your job setting up is easier. Just roll your cabinet (s) in, set the head up, plug in, and blast off.

The less equipment you have, by the way, the better your signal.
 
If a pick feels good, use one. I played with a 1.14mm Tortex pick (pretty stiff) back when I played bass with a pick.

Then, after a long layoff, I had a gig on bass and when the big day came, I put down the pick and used my fingers. Haven't played bass with a pick since, and it's been 5 years.

I use a pick for electric guitar and plastic fingerpicks for Dobro. All those little gubbinses exist for a reason.
 
lpdeluxe said:
If a pick feels good, use one. I played with a 1.14mm Tortex pick (pretty stiff) back when I played bass with a pick.

Then, after a long layoff, I had a gig on bass and when the big day came, I put down the pick and used my fingers. Haven't played bass with a pick since, and it's been 5 years.

I use a pick for electric guitar and plastic fingerpicks for Dobro. All those little gubbinses exist for a reason.
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I figured it'd be best to at least learn how to not use a pick, even if I end up using one later. That way I can decide which technique to use later, depending on the song. I guess the Distortion Factory actually does have a Big Muff Pi setting on it, and Chris from Muse uses the Big Muff, so that's good. How do you get the really crunchy sounds like Glassjaw has, tho? To me, that is the most badass sound ever...

Anfontan: thanks again for the recommendations :) I've just been playing out of my Crate guitar amp for now (because it's big and bassy anyway, so it still sounds good to me), but having a DI or something to record into would be great. If I want distorted sound, should I just reamp the DI, or just run the pedal into the DI? Or just mic an amp and do it that way?
 
I don't enjoy using a pick. I enjoy the sound it produced when recording, but you can get a similar sound with the right tweaks. Like I said, using a tube amp (or tube preamp) helps to get that top end AND bottom end through.

But I like playing with my fingers because it feels good, and I have better control of all four strings (because I pretty much have a finger on each string.

I don't really use all my fingers. I mostly just use my index and middle finger, and occasionally the ring finger and thumb. I just like to play riffs, walking bass so-to-speak, like blues and jazz riffs that climb and decent scales slowly. I'm not a fancy player and never will be. I go into Guitar Center sometimes and hear guys just going off on bass, and it's quite impressive, but I just like to cruise. Think of it like surfing. There's shortboarding (high-performance), and longboarding (style and control). That's my thing (the longboarding).

A lot depends on the guitars too. If you're playing loud rock or metal with two guitars, well, you're there to lay the foundation. People aren't going to really be able to hear the individual notes of the bass. They'll only notice when the bass is NOT present, so-to-speak. You're building a wall of sound to support the bottom end of the guitars.

However, if you're playing rock and the guitars are only lightly distorted, your tone is more important.

If you're playing jazz or country you'll really want to be heard. You'll be playing more melodically in jazz.

A good bass and a really good bass amp with plenty of power will be all you need. Like I said, I like to add a tube pre-amp. They're relatively cheap and much easier to deal with than tube amps. Just plug your bass into it, then run it to the bass amp.

Let the guitarists stress out over their sound (and the drummer). The bassist might not get the girls, but he has the easiest gig. Set up is easy, playing is less stressful, and breakdown is quick. Sure, the equipment is a little heavier sometimes, but not that much.

And besides, all the guys fighting in the band are usually the guitarists and vocalists.

Just my opinion.

By the way, playing with fingers is good to learn because you won't worry about buying and keeping up with picks.

My favorite bassists of all time (for style and playing ability) are Michael Anthony, Flea, and especially Geddy Lee.

I don't really listen to Rush anymore. It's been years, but Rush was amazing in that each player was off on a tangent, doing his own thing, and yet it worked. Geddy Lee was all over that fretboard.

There's a song by Rush Called "Digital Man." It's not one of their more popular tunes (because it's synth heavy), but on the bridge there's a bass line that I think is just incredible. It wasn't hard to learn, but it felt so good to play along to that riff. He hits each note twice as the riff goes UP, and then winds back down, over and over. Very deep, high, and melodic.

And I think he was putting a little distortion in there to give it some punch. He plays with his fingers live.
 
Check this out. It works great.

Run your bass through two channels and have a different tone on each:

"Bass guitar amplification
Lee's amps in the early days were arena-ready Sunn and/or Ampeg models. By the late seventies, his backline had evolved into a unique configuration of Ashly preamps and BGW power amps, which were run in stereo with his 4001 bass. The neck pickup was sent to one amp and set for a clean, bass-heavy tone, while the bridge pickup was sent to the other amp which was set with an exaggerated treble boost, and extra gain in the preamp. This defined Lee's bass sound from 1977 to 1982. Though he would change basses, the amplifier setup remained constant through 1991."
 
MikeTheSurfer said:
Check this out. It works great.

Run your bass through two channels and have a different tone on each:

"Bass guitar amplification
Lee's amps in the early days were arena-ready Sunn and/or Ampeg models. By the late seventies, his backline had evolved into a unique configuration of Ashly preamps and BGW power amps, which were run in stereo with his 4001 bass. The neck pickup was sent to one amp and set for a clean, bass-heavy tone, while the bridge pickup was sent to the other amp which was set with an exaggerated treble boost, and extra gain in the preamp. This defined Lee's bass sound from 1977 to 1982. Though he would change basses, the amplifier setup remained constant through 1991."
Click to expand...
Flea is awesome. I'd rather not rip up my new bass to get the pickups going different places, though...

Is that J-Station kinda like (or better than) the POD thing Line-6 sells? They seem like they'd be similar, though I imagine one has to be better than the other.
 
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