The New Tone Thread

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That's not too bad to me miner. I am missing the chunk and power though. Maybe I'm just used to your previous clips. These seem kind of flat, a little too gainy, and scooped. I hate to say it because I know you're dealing with volume limitations now, but it sounds like a little amp turned down. Lots of preamp fuzzy gain and not enough power. It's not terrible though. I just don't think it's quite as good as your previous stuff.
 
Okay here's the results of my senseless single coil swapping test. Well, it's not totally senseless. I like to actually try things. I did learn something. I probably didn't use the best amp setup to showcase the nuances of these pickups, but I'm not a nuanced player and this is how I roll.

This started as just an A/B/C with the Hallmark 60 Custom. But I threw in the P90 SG and a Strat too because why the fuck not? So the guitars are..
Hallmark 60 Custom
Gibson SG Special w/ P90
Fender Strat

Marshall JCM 800 2203
Presence - 5
Bass - 5
Mid - 7
Treb - 7
Gain - 8
Master vol - 7
Marshall 4x12 1960B - Celestion Vintage 30
SM57 on axis, on grill, halfway to edge
No EQ or FX
All clips through same settings, cab, mic, and mic placement

Hallmark 60 Custom - SD P-Rails P90 mode
Hallmark 60 Custom "Fat Pig" - one of a kind made just for me
Hallmark 60 Custom original Mosrite spec pickup
Gibson SG P90
Fender Strat stock bridge pickup

So, I have my favorite, see what you think.
 
well ... the strat sc sucks just like all strats so let's toss that out right now

Of the others my favorite is the SG ...... flat out the fullest sounding of them all.

Next I like the original Mosrite and very close to that is the fat pig.
But the fat pig is a bit mushier than the original which has more note definition.

For the feedback the p'rail and the SG seem to do that best.

I pretty much like 'em all but to my ears, and on these speakers ... for my taste the SG is a clear winner with the two Mosrite p'ups running second place .... the p'rail in last place and I have nowhere to put the strat but in the discard pile.
 
For me and my taste in tone, there's no doubt about it...
I like the fat pig clip the best.
I will say this though, the bridge pickup on a strat is always very thin sounding. The middle pup would be more in the ballpark tonewise.
 
Greg_L said:
Hallmark 60 Custom - SD P-Rails P90 mode
Hallmark 60 Custom "Fat Pig" - one of a kind made just for me
Hallmark 60 Custom original Mosrite spec pickup
Gibson SG P90
Fender Strat stock bridge pickup

So, I have my favorite, see what you think.
Click to expand...

Here's my favorites, in order from best to worst (they all sound good to me, just different, so there's really not a bad clip here dude):

SG: Sounds the chunkiest & fullest of them all to me, the clear winner IMO...
Original Mosrite spec: This one is pretty close to the P90 in the SG to my ears...
Fat Pig: Again, close to the P90, just not as much body/"oomph" IMO...
SD P-Rails: Sounds good, but it's a little thin in the low end....
Strat: While it isn't bad, it just doesn't have the balls & growl any of the others have...

All these clips could be used in a mix though dude, & with some amp tweaking for each different p'up could probably sound even better....



On the clips I posted, the volume was down pretty low compared to my other clips. It was actually on "1" for all of 'em, & 1/4 power mode. While it's not terribly loud at that level, that's about where this amp starts "waking up". I'm sure I can squeeze some loud clips in here/there, & since I record my di's for my songs, I should be able to re-amp everything with better sounding clips...I could probably just flip the power switch to 15w, & give the vol knob a little small twist, & it'd sound a lot better, but I'm trying to keep it down for a little while...

Those high fill clips were on the red channel, & it does seem to be scooped a little compared to the blue, but it's got way more gain (which is the reason I used that channel). The red channel also seems to be a bit brighter, so I'll have to adjust the tonestack from now on when I use that channel. I still like the hell out of this amp, it just needs to be opened up like any other amp to give up the goods...
 
Thanks fellas. Here are my own thoughts....

First, yes, the Strat just needs to be thrown away. Or at least put back on the stand on the corner where it belongs. Yuck.

Second, I love the P90 SG too. It's great. To be fair, I just love P90s. You could put one in a shoebox, string it up, and I'd probably like it. The vol pot in the SG is, off the top of my head, a 300k linear. So it's roll-off is not as good as the 500k audio taper pots in the Hallmark. But it's full power snarl, it just kicks ass. I really love that stripped down simpleton SG now with the P90 in there.

This really just started as a shootout for the Hallmark. I threw the other two in there for shits and grins.

So for the Hallmark, I like the Fat Pig the best, and it's already back in the guitar. I like the more aggressive upper mids of that pickup. Must be the ceramic magnets, and it's kind of hot for a single coil. It measures 12.9K. That's pretty hot for a single. That's starting to get hot even for a humbucker.

But I like the slightly more robust low end of the original Mosrite spec pickup when the vol is rolled back some. I don't go down there often though. I spend most of my time full throttle and the Fat Pig does that better to my ears. If I were more cleanish more of the time, the original spec Mosrite pickup would be my winner. Both the Mosrite style and the Fat Pig beat up on the P-Rails IMO. It's funny, the P-Rails took the place of the Fat Pig several years ago, but that was when I had less killer amps and I was enamored with the idea of having a P90, humbucker, and single rail all-in-one. It's still a cool idea, but I found myself only using the P90 mode. And at that time, the Fat Pig was too fat for me. But, I hadn't yet changed to the aforementioned 500k audio taper pots. The Hallmark originally had 250k pots, which sound darker. So I bet those 500k pots, along with now having my favorite amp, makes all the difference to bring my custom made Fat Pig back to action. :)
 
Greg
Hey thanks! I've splurged several times lately on gear, and the JHS and EHX pedals have been worth every penny. Sometimes you need a real diamond instead of a cubic zirconium :)

that pedal layout app is amazing! Dang, wish I'd found this a few years ago! This might be my new favorite toy for a while.

miner
I really like those tones. And the toms on the drums sound awesome :)

I think that the cocked wah sound is a little distracting when blended in with the other guitars, it simulates bad phase, I think it does more harm than good in this context.

I like the thin Strat sound, I think it's a good contrast of texture to the other sounds.

And speaking of the other sounds, I think they're great. I don't recall what your last tone before this sounded like, when you could crank things up more. But these don't sound overly compressed. They're high gain, that's for sure. But I think that they sound good. especially all blended together, it sounds full.
 
Greg_L said:
Okay here's the results of my senseless single coil swapping test. Well, it's not totally senseless. I like to actually try things. I did learn something. I probably didn't use the best amp setup to showcase the nuances of these pickups, but I'm not a nuanced player and this is how I roll.

This started as just an A/B/C with the Hallmark 60 Custom. But I threw in the P90 SG and a Strat too because why the fuck not? So the guitars are..
Hallmark 60 Custom
Gibson SG Special w/ P90
Fender Strat

Marshall JCM 800 2203
Presence - 5
Bass - 5
Mid - 7
Treb - 7
Gain - 8
Master vol - 7
Marshall 4x12 1960B - Celestion Vintage 30
SM57 on axis, on grill, halfway to edge
No EQ or FX
All clips through same settings, cab, mic, and mic placement

Hallmark 60 Custom - SD P-Rails P90 mode
Hallmark 60 Custom "Fat Pig" - one of a kind made just for me
Hallmark 60 Custom original Mosrite spec pickup
Gibson SG P90
Fender Strat stock bridge pickup

So, I have my favorite, see what you think.
Click to expand...

Nice Johnny Thunders riff there. We played this song at my former bandmate's funeral last year.

The P-rail didn't sound appealing to me at all until it was full-bore. Then it sounded amazing.

The Fat Pig sounded good at the not-quite-full dial setting. And maybe a little too much at full-bore.

I loved the Mosrite original at full volume. It just sounded like it was "home" with that amp.

The SG P90 sounds great. It obviously likes being at that volume when you're playing something, but not when you stop playing. Squeeeeeeeee!

I actually like the mid-volume Strat pickup. It'd work great in a mix. But that pickup's character just doesn't jive with the full-on breakup. Well, actually I do like it, but it'd work better with a different amp. Something more Fender-y.

I think that my favorite is the Mosrite spec pickup at full bore, then the P-rail at full-bore, then kind of a toss up between the mid-volume settings on the Fat Pig, the P90, and the Strat.
 
Tadpui said:
miner
I really like those tones. And the toms on the drums sound awesome :)

I think that the cocked wah sound is a little distracting when blended in with the other guitars, it simulates bad phase, I think it does more harm than good in this context.

I like the thin Strat sound, I think it's a good contrast of texture to the other sounds.

And speaking of the other sounds, I think they're great. I don't recall what your last tone before this sounded like, when you could crank things up more. But these don't sound overly compressed. They're high gain, that's for sure. But I think that they sound good. especially all blended together, it sounds full.
Click to expand...

Thanks Tad, those are the toms I mentioned from the Made of Metal EZX. Only processing I put on 'em is a little reverb, but there's no eq or compression on 'em. That's how they sound when you load 'em up, I like 'em...

On the wah sound, I could just completely drop it until the chorus starts, in the original, there's a wah during the chorus, so I'm gonna try to keep it there anyway...

I'm still not sure about the strat tones on this song though, while they do have reverb, they're just missing something. I might try a little dirt on 'em, & if that doesn't work, I'll just re-track with another guitar...

It's very easy to go over the top with gain using this amp, & it's sensitive to the slightest turn of the knob, but, I do like high gain, I just need to find the right spot for this particular song...Maybe once I get the vocals & lead guitar parts in it, it will all blend/gel...maybe...thanks again dude!!!
 
I do like those toms. I wouldn't have thought of a metal pack, much less an EZD metal pack. I might have to look that one up...

One thing you could try with the Strat is to compress it on the way in (either a pedal, or a VST on the way out if you're reamping). With my single-coil guitars, a little compression does wonders on clean tones. Not enough to completely crush or squash it, but something to tame the wild spiky peaks can really fatten it up. That's exclusively what I use that Keeley 4-knob compressor for, and that's why I have 2 compressors on my pedal board. One for clean single coil tone, and one for all-out armageddon sustained ride-the-lightning lead tone (the only thing that the CS-3 excels at for me).
 
Tadpui said:
I do like those toms. I wouldn't have thought of a metal pack, much less an EZD metal pack. I might have to look that one up...
Click to expand...
I agree, I wouldn't have thought an EZX would sound this good, I figured the SDX's would always sound better, but not in this case. It may be where they've overhauled/re-worked EZD2, not sure. The whole kit sounds good to me, hi-hats & cymbals too, & that's rare for me, I usually hate Toontrack's hats/cymbals, but these are actually pretty decent. You could probably find this pretty cheap if you shop around dude...

Tadpui said:
One thing you could try with the Strat is to compress it on the way in (either a pedal, or a VST on the way out if you're reamping). With my single-coil guitars, a little compression does wonders on clean tones. Not enough to completely crush or squash it, but something to tame the wild spiky peaks can really fatten it up. That's exclusively what I use that Keeley 4-knob compressor for, and that's why I have 2 compressors on my pedal board. One for clean single coil tone, and one for all-out armageddon sustained ride-the-lightning lead tone (the only thing that the CS-3 excels at for me).
Click to expand...

I'll have a go with a vst compressor, I've got quite a few to choose from, & see if knocking off a little of the peaks helps it any. I'll most likely run the compressor through the amp & see how it does....I'll post some more clips tomorrow....thanks again dude....:)
 
I'm gonna break ranks with the masses.:D
I dig the strat. Something about a strat marshall combo that's always been magical to me. But.....I would have used the neck or the neck/middle pups.
Bridge pickups are always a bit spikey.

2nd, SG with p90.

3rd, Mosrite

Last place is the p rail. Yeah, they kind of do it all, but not well. Jack of all trades, master of none.

Now what would have KILLED it, would have been a late 50s Gold Top with original p90s. :D

But not in the lineup..

:D
 
Greg,
Being a power pop/Flamin' Groovies fan I LOVE the 2nd section of the Hallmark SD P rail mode.
The Fat Pig came close in the second section as well.
Original spec jobbies were less broken up in the 2nd section and sounded like it needed a littl more juice but not as much as the third part.
The SG in the second section isn't bad at all.
The Strat sounded passable in the second section but awful in the third.
For me it's P Rails then original spec + a little more juice then the fats.
 
Last edited:
rayc said:
I came ever so close to buying the EXH MEL-9.
I only buy cheap knock off pedals, (except for a Jimi Hendrix Dunlop Wah and a Boss overdrive), but the EHX Hammond pedal had me very interested and then the Mel had me excited as i LOVE Mellotron.
BUT it's ever so expensive so I declined.
Click to expand...

I've got this in as a birthday request.... if I bought it myself I'd think "well that was a waste of money, what did I buy that for?" but if it came as a surprise (!) gift, that's another thing entirely... come on October 6 .... :D
 
rayc said:
Being a power pop/Flamin' Groovies fan I LOVE the 2nd section of the Hallmark SD P rail mode.
The Fat Pig came close in the second section as well.
Original spec jobbies were less broken up in the 2nd section and sounded like it needed a littl more juice but not as much as the third part.
The SG in the section section isn't bad at all.
The Strat sounded passable in the second section but awful in the third.
For me it's P Rails then original spec + a little more juice then the fats.
Click to expand...

I have import vinyl of Teenage Head, speaking of the Groovies... from waaaaay back when. From Rocking Horse in Brisbane, if I remember correctly. :D

I just hauled it out to see if I still had it - sometime in the 80s I hit hard financial times and sold a lot of vinyl at a market to get some cash - this baby has the princely price of $2.50 on the sticker that's still there, and NO-ONE BOUGHT IT. Philistines....
 
I saw them in Sydney when they recorded One Night Stand and oother bits for AIM. I have most of their early stuff but much prefer the post Roy Lonely stuff, (LPs & CDs for the most part). He was great but they were superb once they embraced Beatles & Stones roots. It's a good LP. Fortunately I've not sold any LPs. I did GIVE (more fool me) my original Oz pressing of the full bit's'npieces Physical Graffitti to a friend who was going to give me the CD in return. Didn't see the friend again. Silly me.
Now, david - PLAY the bloody thing! Particularly the title track.
I look forward to hearing your tracks become well Mel later in the year.
 
Greg_L said:
Okay here's the results of my senseless single coil swapping test. Well, it's not totally senseless. I like to actually try things. I did learn something. I probably didn't use the best amp setup to showcase the nuances of these pickups, but I'm not a nuanced player and this is how I roll.

This started as just an A/B/C with the Hallmark 60 Custom. But I threw in the P90 SG and a Strat too because why the fuck not? So the guitars are..
Hallmark 60 Custom
Gibson SG Special w/ P90
Fender Strat

Marshall JCM 800 2203
Presence - 5
Bass - 5
Mid - 7
Treb - 7
Gain - 8
Master vol - 7
Marshall 4x12 1960B - Celestion Vintage 30
SM57 on axis, on grill, halfway to edge
No EQ or FX
All clips through same settings, cab, mic, and mic placement

Hallmark 60 Custom - SD P-Rails P90 mode
Hallmark 60 Custom "Fat Pig" - one of a kind made just for me
Hallmark 60 Custom original Mosrite spec pickup
Gibson SG P90
Fender Strat stock bridge pickup

So, I have my favorite, see what you think.
Click to expand...

The P rails - sounds good on clean but as you crank it the bottom starts to get mushy.
The Fat Pig - really like the tone of this one; dunno what it is but it just had character. While it was beefy at the bottom end - didn't think it was getting mushy like the P rail.
The Mosrite pickup seemed really thin when clean, got better when the vol was turned a bit (more bottom comes in) but then as the vol was cranked to full too much bottom came in for me - it didn't quite mush, but I don't think you'd palm mute that tone well!
Like the P90 immediately on clean. There's just a lot more going on. Seems to generate more gain than the others as the vol is turned and while its thick and has a really rich tone it doesn't mush - would love to hear this in a mix.
Jesus, the clean strat sounds terrible clean. Better as the vol is turned halfway, actually quite like it to be honest.
 
Lots of varying opinions. Awesome. Thanks for chiming in yall. :)

I think I'm gonna stay with the Fat Pig for a while and run it through my variety of amps. I still need to dial in the height adjustment too. I set all of the pickups about the same height...which is pretty close to the strings.
 
Oh, and on the fried EQ pedal....I contacted Dunlop and they say for 50 bucks they'll diagnose and fix and return the damn thing. Sounds good. I can't get another one for 50 bucks so this bitch is going in the mail today.
 
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