Dogman
Unkle Ticklefingers
I tried to read this, but couldn't. Not enough pictures. Sorry.
gbondo9
p3n
Dogman
Unkle Ticklefingers
It all makes sense now....Excellent sir....gbondo9 said:
MISTERQCUE
Not Just Anutha Brutha
This thread is sooooo gay!
T
tonypgl
New member
vestast
Gassy Member
Wow this is like Dejavue or something.
cominginsecond
Decentralized Media Mogul
N-track is like $50 and it works. Audacity is free. There are alternatives.
fraserhutch
Flypaper for freaks
All over gainvestast said:
B
BadAE
New member
I too do not have a lot of money and do not buy the software I use for recording. There are a lot of free programs to choose from. And when I need something features that my free programme do not support I download a demo version that I know have those features.
There is no need steal.
There is no need steal.
legionserial
New member
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Minimum wage is no excuse to steal. The minimum wage in the UK sucks to me also. Yet I still pay for my software. And you know how? I got off my arse and made sure I earned more than minimum wage. Simple as that. You don't like your salary, get a new one. If people weren't stealing software in the first place they would probably be able to afford to buy it, but as it happens I paid half my monthly wage to buy cubase.
Now the way I see it, it costs that much because of people stealing and pirating software. So technically, I'm not just buying myself a legit copy of cubase, I am also paying for a whole bunch of pirate fuckers to have cubase too. Technically I have bought them a copy of cubase.
So tell me, (and this is directed at any pirate reading this) why the hell should I buy you a copy of cubase. I don't know you. You wouldnt dream of walking me up to me in the street and demanding that I buy you some music software, because I'd probably flatten you, as anyone would. So why the hell should I pay my hard earned cash for you to get it for free.
I have some 'friends' that refuse to buy software. That is my attitude to them. The way I see it...they owe me money. I'll happily pay out £500 for me to use cubase. But what the hell makes you think I should pay for you.
Get a better job, work harder, earn more money, or do without. Simple as that. Stop bludging a free ride off everyone else.
Now the way I see it, it costs that much because of people stealing and pirating software. So technically, I'm not just buying myself a legit copy of cubase, I am also paying for a whole bunch of pirate fuckers to have cubase too. Technically I have bought them a copy of cubase.
So tell me, (and this is directed at any pirate reading this) why the hell should I buy you a copy of cubase. I don't know you. You wouldnt dream of walking me up to me in the street and demanding that I buy you some music software, because I'd probably flatten you, as anyone would. So why the hell should I pay my hard earned cash for you to get it for free.
I have some 'friends' that refuse to buy software. That is my attitude to them. The way I see it...they owe me money. I'll happily pay out £500 for me to use cubase. But what the hell makes you think I should pay for you.
Get a better job, work harder, earn more money, or do without. Simple as that. Stop bludging a free ride off everyone else.
jgourd
New member
Let me see if I have this correct? Poor people think that stealing is OK. Is that right?
How about stealing software is never OK? If you can't afford Cubase, buy N-Track Studio.
End of Discussion.
How about stealing software is never OK? If you can't afford Cubase, buy N-Track Studio.
End of Discussion.
G
gordone
Well-known member
Of course I agree that piracy is wrong, both legally and morally/ethically/whatever, but just wanted to comment on piracy is the reason why the software costs so much. I believe that the lost revenue from piracy might have some effect on the price of software, but 1)I think it's really hard (if not impossible) to quanity exactly how much this effect is and 2)Even if you could quantify it, it wouldn't be that much.
I develop software for a living so I have a pretty good idea as to what is involved in developing really big software. From design, to implementation (the actual coding), to testing, to deployment. You have engineers of varying disciplines involved in all these aspects - software, systems, human factors (ie people with PhDs), etc... These folks' salaries aren't cheap! And then you have all the support staff to keep your desktop PC chugging along, as well as the development systems. Then y ou have to keep the copy machine working. You have to pay for the electricity, the printer paper, the pens
The nice lady upstairs who schedules conference rooms for us. Then double all of this for support/maintenance of the product once it's out there. All of this costs alot, say $20 million (I have no idea how much development costs are for Cubase, but that number is in line with my field). Now you have to price your software/support based on how many people you expect to buy the software/support. If there is one customer, they pay $20 million (not unheard of for customized systems). If there are 500 customers, they pay
$40,000. Alot of Software Development software costs this much.
My point is that relatively speaking, music production software really doesn't have that much of a market, so the fixed development costs have to amortized over a fairly small market segment.
My post in a nutshell, Software costs alot to (properly!) develop and IMHO I don't think that piracy (ie lost revenue by folks who pirate) has much of an effect on the final price (not including developing copy protection)
Now back to debugging Makefiles for a system which must compile on both Unix and Linux systems at the same time
I develop software for a living so I have a pretty good idea as to what is involved in developing really big software. From design, to implementation (the actual coding), to testing, to deployment. You have engineers of varying disciplines involved in all these aspects - software, systems, human factors (ie people with PhDs), etc... These folks' salaries aren't cheap! And then you have all the support staff to keep your desktop PC chugging along, as well as the development systems. Then y ou have to keep the copy machine working. You have to pay for the electricity, the printer paper, the pens
The nice lady upstairs who schedules conference rooms for us. Then double all of this for support/maintenance of the product once it's out there. All of this costs alot, say $20 million (I have no idea how much development costs are for Cubase, but that number is in line with my field). Now you have to price your software/support based on how many people you expect to buy the software/support. If there is one customer, they pay $20 million (not unheard of for customized systems). If there are 500 customers, they pay $40,000. Alot of Software Development software costs this much.
My point is that relatively speaking, music production software really doesn't have that much of a market, so the fixed development costs have to amortized over a fairly small market segment.
My post in a nutshell, Software costs alot to (properly!) develop and IMHO I don't think that piracy (ie lost revenue by folks who pirate) has much of an effect on the final price (not including developing copy protection)
Now back to debugging Makefiles for a system which must compile on both Unix and Linux systems at the same time
legionserial said:
R
Robert D
New member
gordone said:
I'm having a hard time correlating these two statements. You point out the market size, but in such a small market with such high development costs, and with a user group that is not typically Christian soccer moms (high percentage of technically capable, young, and not yet fully morally developed), there is going to be a huge hit on already slim margins, which has to affect selling price.
G
gordone
Well-known member
Yeah, I see your point. My arguments were based on the premise that the actual market segment were folks that were actually buying (ie paying for) the software, and not the dweebs who download cracks.
So from my point of view, the pirates really wouldn't have any effect on the pricing (except for them being the reason to add in annoying copy protection).
Of course, pirating is still wrong. So in the end, hopefully we can all agree on that!
So from my point of view, the pirates really wouldn't have any effect on the pricing (except for them being the reason to add in annoying copy protection).
Of course, pirating is still wrong. So in the end, hopefully we can all agree on that!
gbondo9
p3n
But.....what if you're in a desert...and you are thristy...and you admit that stealing is wrong.......and you don't make as much as other people...and you hate americans.....gordone said:
what then? is it OK then? Can a steal Sonar 5 Producer edition then?
legionserial
New member
gbondo9 said:
Only if you have that rare illness that some posters seem to imply that they have....you know...the one where you will die slowly and painfully if you don't have a copy of a certain bit of software. I've heard people liken it to hurricane katrina. Jeez...there must have been a real shortage of food for people to want to steal a copy of cubase and then eat it. I mean, all those little shards of DVD-ROM could really screw with your digestive system....and whats the dongle for? An appetizer? A side dish? Or do you have to plug it into your ass to be able to digest the DVD?
...at least thats what I guess these people mean when they liken the 2 things....
V
ver1ver2
New member
Hi,
Just one comment:
Although I bought most of my software stuff including cubase, I believe that those free warez versions DO have a positive effect (next to the negative ones) on the sales in the long term. People who wouldnt even consider spending 700 Euro on a software program now get to use, experience and get addicted to this software and many of them will buy the product as soon as they treat music production more seriously and for example start to make money out of it.
Tell me, honestly - how many of you did try out a cracked version before you bought the software? (f.e cubase)
Anyway; I believe that anyone who uses the illegal version of the program for commercial purposes is stealing
Bye
Tom
Just one comment:
Although I bought most of my software stuff including cubase, I believe that those free warez versions DO have a positive effect (next to the negative ones) on the sales in the long term. People who wouldnt even consider spending 700 Euro on a software program now get to use, experience and get addicted to this software and many of them will buy the product as soon as they treat music production more seriously and for example start to make money out of it.
Tell me, honestly - how many of you did try out a cracked version before you bought the software? (f.e cubase)
Anyway; I believe that anyone who uses the illegal version of the program for commercial purposes is stealing
Bye
Tom
apl
Stand Up Comity
ver1ver2 said:
I didn't.
ver1ver2 said:
Anyone who uses copyrighted software without the owner's authorization is stealing.
V
ver1ver2
New member
haha I know these definitions, just wanted to relativate it -
but what do you think about the main point? That is illegal downloads of software might contribute the sales in the long term? (appart from damage them in the short term)
I think that is one of the reasons that steinberg for example still hasn't come up with better solutions ...
but what do you think about the main point? That is illegal downloads of software might contribute the sales in the long term? (appart from damage them in the short term)
I think that is one of the reasons that steinberg for example still hasn't come up with better solutions ...
apl
Stand Up Comity
ver1ver2 said:
When I was a kid I'd shoplift Snickers candy bars. Now I pay for them. So I guess it's OK.