My thoughts on the RNP

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dot
  • Start date Start date
Well, I, for one, would be very happy if Dot posted some amendments to his comments on all the forums where he posted eroneous information about the RNP and stated it as facts rather than opinion.

For example, on Harmony Central, Dot said, "There are already a few functions that are being reworked by FMR Audio on the RNP, so that if you buy one now, you won't get them."

Now, this one remark really got to me. Dot is telling people not to not buy the RNP because 'it's being reworked and you won't get the added functions'. Well, his statement is a flatout lie; it's untrue, it's false, it's a fabrication, unfounded, period. Mark McQuilken is not reworking any of the functions on the RNP, and he has no plans to rework any of the functions.

Now, Dot has said that he didn't contact FMR Audio, so where did this bit of misinformation come from, that he states as absolute fact? See my problem? In rereading Dot's posts, I stumbled across this remark buried in his longer post. I missed it the first few times around. Guess what I did this morning after I read it?

Yup, I called Mark and asked him whether it was true or not. Know what Mark said? He said, "WHAT???". Then he went on to confirm that the remark was utter bullshit, and now he understood why people have been calling him up all week, worried about buying RNPs for fear it will be outdated when he makes "these new changes" to it. Mark was pretty pissed about that statement, since there are no plans to make any changes to the RNP in the foreseeable future.

But Dot's statement had the effect of killing or at least hurting sales for the FMR, based on totally false information, presented as "fact". It really pissed Mark off, and it pissed me off too.

Suppose I announced publicly that one of the SP preamps had shock hazard problems, people were getting fried, and Alan was reworking future units to fix the problem? Even though it's totally not true, think it might hurt some sales? Internet or not, you can't make statements like that without some proof.

You can't knowingly make up lies or quote unfounded rumours as facts to try to discredit or hurt sales of any company. It's illegal. That's why newspapers and most news programs try to get at least two independent sources to substantiate stories they run.

Would Alan have any recourse if I really made a stupid statement like that? I'd probably wind up changing the name from "Indian Trail Recording Studio" to "Alan Hyatt's New Recording Studio" after he took me for every thing I owned, and I wouldn't blame him.

So, was Dot trying to intentionally hurt FMR's sales when he said, "There are already a few functions that are being reworked by FMR Audio on the RNP, so that if you buy one now you won't get them."? Only Dot can answer that, since I don't know what his motives were for saying it.

I can only say that he's factually wrong, and statements like that are potentially damaging to a company. I hope Dot will publiclly retract that statement and several other errors in "facts" that he asserted, both here, and on all the other forums where he posted these statements as "facts", not "opinions".
 
I think that Dot should call FMR, and apologize personally to McQ through Beth who will almost certainly answer the phone.

Unresponsive, whatever. Try calling instead of emailing.

Dot, please don't compare yourself to Harvey.

Look I didn't know about the RNP because I don't own one. BUT, my RNC is most OBVIOUSLY not plastic, which if it shares a chassis with the RNP should have been painfully clear under the most cursory investigation.

Dot likes to play the big-shot and blows a lot of hot air. My biggest clue that he was illegit, was his expensive preamp theory, about pinpoints and panning etc.

Maybe instead of looking at hundreds of pre-amps and mics at once, Dot would do better to closely examine one or two at a time.

-Jett
 
Please Harvey

I want to see photos of the pre getting run over by your car!
Not really,the mental picture of you grinding it into the gravel is cool enough...
 
Dot said:
I think it's great that Harvey called Mark. The fact that the RNP is actually metal was not obvious enough to anyone over the few days of these threads.
Click to expand...
And that's one of my problems, Dot. There's a big difference between what something looks like (opinion), and what something really is (fact).

If you had stated that the RNP "looks like a fucking plastic toy", it would be clear that your statement was your opinion, nothing more, nothing less. But you said, the RNP "is a fucking plastic toy", combining opinion ("toy") with an erroneous fact (" is plastic"), and presented that as fact.

By stating it was "all plastic", you opened FMR up to all sorts of RFI and sturdyness questions, when in fact, the unit is all metal. That's the problem when you present opinion as fact. If you had just said, "it looks like it's an all plastic toy", I wouldn't have any problems with your statement, since that's your opinion.

As reviewers (although I never wanted the job in the first place), we both have an obligation to make sure we present facts as facts and opinions as opinions.

Example:

"I don't like the AKG C1000 because it has some large, narrow high frequency peaks (fact) and that makes it pretty unusable for anything I record (opinion)." It might be usable to some people for drum overheads (opinion), or for dark sounding guitars (opinion), but it wouldn't be my first choice (fact), when there are so many better, low cost alternatives available" (opinion).

"I hate the AKG C1000 - it's a crappy mic. It sucks, don't buy it." <-- All of that would be an opinion; I haven't presented any facts to support that opinion.
 
Tom Hicks said:
Please Harvey

I want to see photos of the pre getting run over by your car!
Not really,the mental picture of you grinding it into the gravel is cool enough...
Click to expand...
When I mentioned to Mark that I planned to run my car over the RNC, his only comment was, "Be sure to take pictures."
 
Harvey Gerst said:

Example:

"I don't like the AKG C1000 because it has some large, narrow high frequency peaks (fact) and that makes it pretty unusable for anything I record (opinion)." It might be usable to some people for drum overheads (opinion), or for dark sounding guitars (opinion), but it wouldn't be my first choice (fact), when there are so many better, low cost alternatives available" (opinion).

"I hate the AKG C1000 - it's a crappy mic. It sucks, don't buy it." <-- All of that would be an opinion; I haven't presented any facts to support that opinion.
Click to expand...

Hmmm... I would have thought both statements were factual! :D
 
jet wrote, My biggest clue that he was illegit, was his expensive preamp theory, about pinpoints and panning etc.

jet, when you know more about mic pres than Buzz Audio, you let me know.

Within hours after my article, To Pre or Not To Pre, was published I got the following email from Buzz Audio:
First off keep up the good work on a great mag, there is always
something in there of interest to me.

The reason I am emailing you is to request permission to re produce in
emails, and possibly on our web site and in printed publication
advertisements some parts of Dan Richards article "To Pre or Not to Pre"

Our companies pre is mentioned in the article and I agree with the
writers sentiments on what are at present a good and bad audio investment.

Thank you for your taking the time to read and I hope respond favorably
to my email.

Best Regards

Ted Barr
Sales and Marketing

--
Buzz Audio.
http://www.buzzaudio.com
Click to expand...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Harvey, the information on the RNP revisions come from Larry Crane's review in the recent issue of Tape Op:

My biggest complaint is the digitally-controlled invert and phantom power buttons revert to the off position when the unit is powered down, throwing me off during long tracking sessions. FMR is currently revising this however
Click to expand...

Tape Op just got to my door this week - and if FMR is getting calls about the revisions - that might have something to do with it.

Also, in his review, Larry echos my same thoughts:

The RNP's 6 dB stepped gain control and lack of an output trim knob sometimes make it difficult to set optimum levels to tape.
Click to expand...

I think setting optimum levels is pretty fucking important!!!

Harvey, I'd already planned on amending the threads on the RNP. Your prodding is not necessary. Keep in mind - this thread is titled My thoughts on the FMR. I am not stating ANYTHING as fact. I am stating what I THINK and MY OPINIONS about the RNP.

I am not apologizing to FMR or Mark for not being completely bowled over by the RNP. I tried repeatedly to contact FMR. I spoke with Beth on a few ocassions - but not once did Mark ever return my calls or reply to emails.

I have never said the RNP is not a good preamp. I have recommended it before and I will recommend it again in certain cases.

_____________

Dan Richards
Digital Pro Sound
The Listening Sessions
 
Last edited:
"jet, when you know more about mic pres than Buzz Audio, you let me know. "

Don't worry, I'll let you know. :rolleyes:

-Jett
 
Dot said:
The reason I am emailing you is to request permission to re produce in emails, and possibly on our web site and in printed publication advertisements some parts of Dan Richards article "To Pre or Not to Pre"

Our companies pre is mentioned in the article and I agree with the writers sentiments on what are at present a good and bad audio investment.

Thank you for your taking the time to read and I hope respond favorably
to my email.

Best Regards

Ted Barr
Sales and Marketing
Click to expand...

Dot, I hate to be the one to break this to you, but you do realize that the very fact that one of their marketing guys wants to use your statements doesn't exactly lend them a lot of credibility. I mean, honestly, when was the last time you've heard any really insightful, spot-on technically accurate comments about gear from their marketing literature?

I'm sure good 'ol Tedly from Sales and Marketing has his heart is in the right place, but come on, now. :D Remember, it's the sales and marketing folks that bring brilliant concepts like temporal harmonic alignment to life. :D Just about all marketing literature is about 99% bullshit.

By the way, do you still have that Ted guy's email? I'd like to forward him my resume.
 
Harvey Gerst said:
When I mentioned to Mark that I planned to run my car over the RNC, his only comment was, "Be sure to take pictures."
Click to expand...

I think it's an excellent idea, and can't wait to see the pictures. Go for it! (Or if you don't give it to mee, I need one). :)
 
ok dot,

all jabbing aside,

I think that a preamp with 6 db increments is like a resume sporting a 1.5 gpa. Both should be thrown out the window.

I am not familiar with audio math, but I am pretty sure I read somewhere that

every six DB increase doubles the volume of the audio

so it is pretty ridiculous to expect users to double the volume of the audio every single time they turn the gain knob.

that alone makes me think that they SHOULD have plans to redesign the pre in the near future.
 
Good point, chessrock. Point taken. : )

Look, if you guys just wanna' keep on hammering - bring it on! 'Cause every time this happens something really good comes out of it for me. : )

If you wanna' know who the big mover and shaker is, it's probably jslator. His input and attempt at character assassination - in the face of him actually not having much real info or having ever used most of the products being talked about - has lead to some good stuff.

My writing for Digital Pro Sound
My becoming a Contributing Editor for Digital Pro Sound

which lead to me reviewing more gear...

which lead me to get involved with Sea Note Recording
which lead to The Listening Sessions

which lead to hours of conversations with people like John La Grou of Millennia, Paul Wolff of API, John Hardy, Larry Villella of ADK, Elberg of Denmark, Great River, Speck, A Designs, Stapes Audio...

and to endorsements by Lakland basses and Larrivee guitars - and more on the way...

and to Studio Forums aka studioforums.com where Mojo Pie has a forum.

Steve/Oz has also commented that flames by jslator towards me was influencial in Steve starting Mojo Pie.

Boy, you should see what comes in weekly on UPS and FedEx trucks. Every day's been like Christmas for the past few months and there's no end in sight.

Good stuff!!!!!!! All in the span of a few months.

Bring it on, guys! Bring it on!! HA!!! : )

_____________

Dan Richards
Digital Pro Sound
The Listening Sessions
 
CyanJaguar said:
I think that a preamp with 6 db increments is like a resume sporting a 1.5 gpa. Both should be thrown out the window.
Click to expand...

I guess you'd have no use for a Langevin AM-16, then. Those have one increment - on or off. They sound really, really good though.
 
chessrock said:
Dot, I hate to be the one to break this to you, but you do realize that the very fact that one of their marketing guys wants to use your statements doesn't exactly lend them a lot of credibility. I mean, honestly, when was the last time you've heard any really insightful, spot-on technically accurate comments about gear from their marketing literature?

I'm sure good 'ol Tedly from Sales and Marketing has his heart is in the right place, but come on, now. :D Remember, it's the sales and marketing folks that bring brilliant concepts like temporal harmonic alignment to life. :D Just about all marketing literature is about 99% bullshit.

By the way, do you still have that Ted guy's email? I'd like to forward him my resume.
Click to expand...

Actually, FMR Audio is listed as one of the cool companies in Dan's "To Pre or Not to Pre" commentary. Buzz Audio is way cool. I got an interview with Tim Farrant I need to edit and put up. Geez, I'm running so far behind on stuff.

Anyhow... Recently, I kind of dogged the Sytek mic preamp on a couple of minor issues. I realized I was wrong so I posted this in the forum where I committed the sin:

This is primarily aimed at myself at my comments on the Sytek and a couple other people's comments on the RNP. In essence, we're absolutely full of shit.

People have shown these to be very capable mic preamps.

The vocals and guitars on "Fly" were tracked through a Sytek. http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists...id=1071&alid=-1

Everything on this project was tracked through an RNP.


The comments I made about the Sytek were just wrong. It'd be a great first choice for a quality mic preamp. My new rule for recommending mic preamps is to just get a quality channel or two and get busy making music.

Steve, Mojo Pie
www.piemusic.com
 
Dot said:
If you wanna' know who the big mover and shaker is, it's probably jslator. His input and attempt at character assassination - in the face of him actually not having much real info or having ever used most of the products being talked about - has lead to some good stuff.
Click to expand...

I still think I deserve one of those Larivee's for all my hard work.
 
Dot said:
Harvey, the information on the RNP revisions come from Larry Crane's review in the recent issue of Tape Op:

Ahh, that explains it. OK, you're still wrong. :) Larry was talking to Mark, saying he'd like the RNP to power up in what ever state it was in when it was powered down. Mark told Larry that was all in software and Mark could make one like that for Larry or modify his in about 15 seconds.

A few people (mostly live audio people) have also requested that the RNP power back up in whatever state it was, in case of a system power failure. It makes sense if you're doing live sound.

It doesn't make a lot of sense if you're doing recording, since there's a chance you'd shut off a condenser mic to go to a ribbon mic - I wouldn't want to turn the RNP back on and have phantom power come on automatically.

BUT, since those functions are in software, Mark can make any of those changes in about 15 seconds to any RNP, new or old, upon request, free. The RNP as it is now, is the way it's gonna be for a long time. It's an option, not a revision.

I think setting optimum levels is pretty fucking important!!!

More so to newer recordists than us old guys. Many of the old preamps we worked with (that are fetching big bucks these days) were either fixed gain (i.e., no damn gain switches or pots), or were in large steps (5 to 6 dB per step).

Harvey, I'd already planned on amending the threads on the RNP. Your prodding is not necessary. Keep in mind - this thread is titled My thoughts on the FMR. I am not stating ANYTHING as fact. I am stating what I THINK and MY OPINIONS about the RNP.

Telling people to "hold off or not buy an RNP because it's being revised and you won't get those features" goes way beyond your "opinion" - it's stated as "fact", except it's a fact which is not true. Stating the RNP is made out of plastic goes beyond your "opinion" - it's stated as "fact", except it's a fact which is not true.

I am not apologizing to FMR or Mark for not being completely bowled over by the RNP.

I never asked you to apologize to Mark, or retract your opinions in any way, just correct the things you stated as "facts" that weren't true.

I have never said the RNP is not a good preamp.

Quote from Dot's post on Harmony Central:
"If you get an RNP, Sytek or MP20, all you have is $700 gone and some half-assed pres that make little to no difference over even the Audio Buddy or any other cheap pre."

Maybe I'm misreading that quote.

At any rate, I think I've said about all there is to say about this subject, so I'll shut up now.
Click to expand...
 
CyanJaguar said:
... I am not familiar with audio math, but I am pretty sure I read somewhere that

every six DB increase doubles the volume of the audio ...
Click to expand...

Aaak! Okay, you preface it with a disclaimer, so you don't deserve to be jumped on, but ... if you read that somewhere, stop reading whatever it was!

A six dB increase is a doubling of voltage (and quadrupling of power). "Volume" is a somewhat more nebulous concept, but a 6 dB increase in voltage clearly is not double the volume! Try moving a fader by 6 dB sometime, and see for yourself. To most listeners, anything less than 3 dB (doubling the power) is not immediately perceivable; 10 dB (10 times the power) seems to be what most people consider "twice as loud."

Basically, part of the reason we even use the logarithmic scale in this application (for SPL, also) is because our perception of volume is logarathmic. Its also why you sometimes hear people saying a 50-watt amp is only twice as loud as 5-watt amp.
 
ozraves said:
Actually, FMR Audio is listed as one of the cool companies in Dan's "To Pre or Not to Pre" commentary. Buzz Audio is way cool.
Click to expand...

I agree. I was just giving Dot a little shit. :D I need to be nicer. I'm sorry dot. But you'e still kind of a wanker sometimes. lol. :D

So are we going to hear from the gear pimp any time soon on Mojo Pie?
 
Ozraves said:
I think a certain gentleman who frequents this forum made some comments saying how the Grace 101 was inferior to the Grace 201. Here I am evaluating
the Grace 101 for a review. I ask Michael Grace to explain to me the differences and to address the gentleman's comment. I get back an incredibly long, detailed email telling me some golden stuff about the Grace 101, 202 and mic preamps in general. His response boiled down to that he thought they were the same under most conditions. But, he said that under ideal conditions that he thought the 201 should sound just a smidge better.

well, at least you called me a gentleman! anyway, I'm guessing that's me you are talking about, as i have a vague memory of a similar discussion.

here's the facts: the 201 lists at $1995, while the 101 is listed at $699. (The 202 I'm not familiar with.)

That means that two 101's at list price cost $500 less than the 201. Now, we know that the 101 has a wall wart and the 201 doesn't. And that the 201 has rack ears and a somewhat more attractive exterior. But if they are otherwise identical, I would be very interested to hear why Michael Grace prices the 201 significantly higher than two 101's.

In addition, anyone can go to the Grace website and see for themselves that while the specs on the 101 are great, the specs on the 201 are spectacular.

Now, I agree that in practice, most people probably can't hear the difference. But most people probably can't hear the difference between a lot of things. (...like a C1 and a U87).

So, inferior power supply, inferior specs, inferior cosmetics, slightly inferior sound... where is the argument?

My intention was never to imply that the 101 was crappy. Only to point out that there might be a misconception that the 101 was simply a one channel version of the 201. And that is not the case. And Grace must know it, or they wouldn't charge almost 3 times the price of the 101 for the 201.

Am I wrong here?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top