monitors

Nola

Nola

Well-known member
hey guys.

i think i need some monitors. after a/b-ing more and more on different systems i'm seeing the problems.

what frequency response should i look for in monitors? do i need a sub? would i want active or passive?
what other specs are important?

is it worth getting monitors if i don't have a treated room?

thank you
 
Last edited:
Uh huh. Didn't you poo-poo monitors a while back? For like 50 pages of bandwith? Glad you're finally seeing the light. :thumbs up:
 
Get some monitors. Even if your space is untreated, go ahead get the monitors. For the kind of music you are doing, it's doubtful that you will need a sub-woofer.
 
Greg_L said:
Didn't you poo-poo monitors a while back?
Click to expand...

Haha. Sort of. I did say if I had a good space I'd have monitors in a second. But I might need them even in a bad space.
Live and learn!

I was doing pretty well on headphones, but as I get into more dense mixes I'm having a lot of problems, especially with the low end.

Do you guys have subs with your monitors? I see some desktop speakers that go as low as 42hz, but since I high pass around 30hz I'm not sure what to do (I guess I can high pass at 40hz instead...?). I know almost nothing about speakers. I have limited space, so I don't want a sub really.
 
Robus said:
Even if your space is untreated.
Click to expand...

Robus, one more thing: my desk is in a corner. So one speaker would be in that corner.

It's a pretty awful setup.

Would I do well to put foam in that corner with the speaker? Is a speaker in a corner a no-no?

Even so I might do it b/c I want to take strain off my ears.
 
If it's mainly the low end that you're having trouble with, then I have a feeling that bass traps would help you out more than monitors. Monitors surely won't hurt, but they won't fix the wacky low end that almost every small room suffers from.

I added a sub last year just because, and all it really did was exaggerate the low end problems in my room. I can't find a place to put it where it's both balanced and isn't in the way.
 
No need for a sub, really. Even 5" drivers sound good nowadays. My Yamaha HS5s are a little light in the bass but very detailed. My friend's Adam A5xs are superb.
 
Tadpui said:
If it's mainly the low end that you're having trouble with, then I have a feeling that bass traps would help you out more than monitors. Monitors surely won't hurt, but they won't fix the wacky low end that almost every small room suffers from.
Click to expand...

I can't really setup bass traps in the apartment. The landlord would freak out. I could probably put up foam, but not those big Corning type traps. :/
 
I'm no expert on room treatment, but I doubt adding foam is going to help much. What might help is getting used to how your monitors sound in your environment, even if that environment is not ideal. My environment isn't great, but I've got a pretty good idea of how it affects what I'm hearing and can compensate. And the Clinic gives me additional ears to check myself again. Don't forget, for all we talk about mixes, the far more important part is creating, writing, and recording. You can always go back and remix.
 
Forget foam (how many times has that been said here?)
You can make your own (or buy) 4" thick x 2ftx4ft traps (rockwool) - these are bass traps. Not as good as superchunks in corners, but still effective. Yon can hang them from hooks (ceiling or walls) - or if you can't put any holes in the walls at all, just stack them on top of each other.

Got a budget? The JBL LSR305 monitors are good down to 45Hz, which is probably all you will need on the low end at this point. Dont get 'computer speakers' with a sub.
Only drawback with the JBLs is that they have rear-firing ports, so you need to have trapping behind them.
Also get the monitor out of the corner - do whatever you can to rearrange the room to get get a better set up - you want sound to be even from left and right sides, bouncing off of walls, etc, evenly, otherwise you are going to be making bad decisions when mixing.
 
Get some monitors. Anything without a rear port.
Learn them
Listen to commercial tracks that you like and want to emulate.
Monitor at LOW volume levels

Not saying that room treatment is a bad thing, but by applying the above, you can get by without it.
 
RFR said:
Get some monitors. Anything without a rear port.
Learn them
Listen to commercial tracks that you like and want to emulate.
Monitor at LOW volume levels
Click to expand...

Interesting I was just going to ask mjb about low volume. Like say I do have to put them in a corner; it seems like with the speakers turned way down the bass wouldn't be as excited and bouncing off walls. Is that an accurate statement?

So I'd need a speaker that's accurate at low volume, has good bass response (~42hz) and without a rear port as you say. Can anyone recommend models that fit?
 
IMO, monitors will always be better than mixing with headphones only. Where the useful price point begins is up for debate. From my experience with under $300 pair of KRK G2 5's, they basically lied to me. It took learning them and using better that showed that to me. Then I got some KRK G2 8's. They were much better but I learned soon that they were also not giving me what I needed. It was way better though.

I realized that the pair of monitors I used only to compare mixes with the KRK's were actually WAY better to mix with. Event TR8's. Now I use them pretty much exclusively.

Keep in mind I have a well treated/large space to use these in. Also use a subwoofer but I do dabble in hip hop type recording where that is actually needed. Actually, I couldn't imagine mixing any genre if I was not able to hear/feel what was going on in the sub area. Especially when it comes to using compression. Just because you can't hear it does not mean it isn't there and a compressor will be grabbing the low end first if it is the strongest signal. I personally find having a properly setup sub to be a necessity for what I do. But that is not necessarily the case and likely not a good idea in a small untreated room.

Also, keep in mind what happens in a small room is that frequencies (especially under 200Hz) will bounce off walls and hit each other at different points in the room. There will be places in the room where certain frequencies will be cancelled out or built up. So you may think you need more 110Hz when it actually is your room that is not allowing you to hear that frequency. So you bring it to your car stereo and it sounds like shit. Or the opposite happens and you are cutting a frequency that your room is responsible for boosting, and it sounds weak in your car.

I am having an extreme repair of my foundation wall that requires me relocate my desk into a 8x12x8' room. I will be bringing in as much of my room treatment I can fit in there, but I will for the first time be able to hear how a small room affects what I hear. I will be sharing results of what I find there.

BTW, I would let my KRK G2 8's go for $300. Not that I recommend them tho... lol
 
Last edited:
Funny how this thread is turning into a sales pitch. :)
But I have an extra pair of equator d5 front ported coaxial monitors. Excellent condition and excellent monitors with quite good bass. Perfect for a small room.
3 bills plus shipping. I'm in california.
 
I agree...no sub.

Get like 6" speakers, active.
Check out the ADAM stuff...but I have no idea what your budget is.

The corner is always going to be a bitch.
Are you like wedged in so you're sitting facing the corner, and the speaker on each side....?...real bad.
LF tend to just fill up a room, long wavelengths...and in a corner, you could get build-up...and foam will do nothing.

You can get free-standing traps from GIK Acoustics: FreeStand Bass Trap
So you're not going to piss off the landlord because nothing will be mounted...and when you leave, you can take them with you....plus, you can put them in place when mixing, and move them out of the way when not.
 
I am always slightly taken aback by the almost universal statement that rear ports must either be well clear of a wall or not suitable in some circumstances at all?

At the frequencies we are talking about the speaker/port system is virtually a point source thus, if a wall is going to "upset" the radiation from a port (and it must to some extent) it will have an almost identical effect on the front bass radiation, emanating as it does just a few INCHES away from the port.

Naturally if it is desired to mount a speaker flush to a surface the port will be doing Jack but even a small air gap should be fine IMHO. For sure, a chunk of foam is going to do buggerall from 60ish Hz down!

Of course if there is any peer reviewed data on this matter I would be pleased to see it. (don't hear from Ethan much these days?)

As to subs? No, don't do it. A bad room (at LF) can only be made worse by pumping in MORE sound!

You (and I!) are on a hiding to nothing re bass in a small room. The wavelengths are such that you can never be in the right place for all the notes!

Re the landlord: Can you HIDE some bags of fibreglass? You can leave them in the plastic (pick ones with no splits) and stuff them out of site. Under stairs, beds, otterman. One company yonks ago disguised a sub as a round coffee table. Make one and stuff it!

Dave.
 
As I already had bass traps along my front wall, the rear ports on the JBLs were never a problem. Traps in front of me ensures that nothing bouncing back from the rear wall is now bouncing AGAIN towards me from the front )but I have trapping behind me and in corners too).

To Nola - even 'low volume' those pesky bass waves are bouncing back out of the corners. I started out with 3" M Audio 'monitors' (hah!), with no bass at all, yet, in the corner (and with a hard wooden shelf above, and to the corner, when I moved my head I could hear all these wonky bass things happening.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top