mixing doubled guitars

[mountain animal]

Hello folks,

I'm mixing down a project and I have an phase issue with clean doubled arpeggiated guitars. I've been dealing with it somewhat successfully by panning each hard right and left, but they still tend to phase weird. I've been reading on other mixing techniques such as full and partial wash panning, which make the guitars in the mix sound really full but make the phasing issue much worse. Any ideas? Thanks!

 

[kubeek]

How can you have a phase issue with two different tracks? Phase issues happen when you have two mics on one instrument or when there is excessive bleed. How does that happen with two separate tracks?

 

[mountain animal]

ok, sorry, my terminology is not nearly up to par. What I should have done is posted this in the "newbie" section. What is happening is I'm not getting definition between the two guitars parts, they give off this really terrible chorus like effect and sort of "melt" together. How do I get them to compliment each other in the mix, but still hold their own? I've tried to seperate them with some careful EQ nudges, but I haven't been able to find the right formula. Any suggestions?

 

[kubeek]

If the guitars "argue" with each other, I suggest retracking them and trying them to be as same as possible rythmicaly and dynamicaly.

 

[Freudian Slip]

The flange chorus effect is pretty normal. You can panning one guitar 20% or so while panning the other pretty hard and dropping the volume on the hard panned guitar so there is not as much interaction.

Good Luck

F.S.

 

[Ironklad Audio]

your problem doesn't lie with the EQ or panning, it lies with the discrepancies in the performance. the only way to properly fix it is to do more takes until it's right.

 

[Atom Bomb]

your problem doesn't lie with the EQ or panning, it lies with the discrepancies in the performance. the only way to properly fix it is to do more takes until it's right.

i second this. i have done this a bunch of times and guitar doubling sounds stellar but ...... its twice the work.

when the actual performance of each track is almost exact but not quite, the fullness and natural chorus sounds incredible. Especially if you use two different amps, mics or whatever.

That might be part of your problem to? Did you switch up any gear?

Whenever i do doubling ill use a 100% different set up, mic, amp, guitar, amp model whatever. Then pic the one i like most and mix it around 25 to 30 l or r and the one i like least and mix it hard left or right and tweak it till it sounds amazing.

Mind you, punk rock guitars seldom sound amazing. but its up to your ears to find a mix that works for you.

 

[Booda]

What is happening is I'm not getting definition between the two guitars parts, they give off this really terrible chorus like effect and sort of "melt" together.

Another thing to consider if it sounds "terrible"... the guitars might be slightly out of tune with each other.

B.

 

[Freudian Slip]

Another thing to consider if it sounds "terrible"... the guitars might be slightly out of tune with each other.

B.

Yep. You pretty much want to tune up pretty often when doubling guitar. Especialy if there is any tempeture fluctuation in the room.
Best to tune up play a little while and tune up again before the first take.

F.S.

 

[Bulls Hit]

Also make sure the tracks are lined up properly. If one happens to be a couple of ms ahead or behind, you can get comb filtering

 

[Rusty K]

I too am learning how to track acoustic guitars properly. In my opinion it's tough even when you are not trying to double. Tuning is a huge problem. It's critical and difficult to have your performance peak at the same time the guitar is in tune. I tune to start then tune again after the guitar has been next to my body (warmed) and yet again if I have to do several retakes. If you put the guitar down you have to recycle the whole mess.

Tuning is especially problematic when using a capo and here I'd appreciate any feedback on how to tune with a capo. If the guitar needs any tweaking (intonation, setup), then when you slap a capo on it it's not going to be in tune. I've taken to tuning with the capo on. In some of these situations the ears can be more valuable than a tuner.

Now if someone can tell me how to get a full rich acoustic sound tracked into my session I'd really be in business...

Rusty K

 

[blueroommusic]

rusty, I like the over-the-shoulder MDC, and the LDC out-in-front aimed at the 12th fret method...in case you wanted some thoughts..

 

[Rusty K]

blueroommusic,

I do want your thoughts. I'm already hip to the 12 fret position but the over the shoulder I'm not. You mean mic positioned over the shoulder? I've used an MXL 2001 condenser for recording my acoustic but I've not been happy with the results so far. I know there are better "job specific" mics out there but the MXL was a general all purpose one that I could afford.

Please forgive my lack of knowlege about gear(mics) but what are the MDC and LDC?

Rusty K