Md4

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Andy Martin

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Hello fellow users of the MD4 and MD8

Here is a very simple question for the masters who know their MD4´s!

I have a song that has the backing tracks on 3 & 4 and the vocals on 1 & 2.
Listening back to the track, I think its too long so I need to cut some parts out and then rejoin it together. Sounds like a simple cut and paste!

But I just don´t know how to do it. And the splice has to be accurate of course or the join won´t sound natural!

If anyone would be kind enough to tell me how to do that in easy to understand steps, I would be really grateful for the assistance.

Thank you very much - why are manuals so initimidating and hard to understand!? In the old days of tape, I would get the razorblade out and some splicing tape....those were the days..:-( Does anyone want to swap their Revox B77 for my MD4! :-)

Andy.
 
:D

YO Andy:

I used to use the MD8 a while back. But, as far as cutting & pasting....I don't know if that will work with that unit. With a PC backed program, I'm sure many things can be done....but I don't use a PC backed program--I use the Yam 2816--and I think it has editing stuff but not like the PC programs.

Maybe you can punch in and out but it's not as easy as it sounds.

I really did some good stuff on the MD 8 so keep working at it and you will have fun.

Green Hornet :D
 
Hey there Green Hornet,

This is the MD4 "confusion reigns" rumour control. I have looked at the manual and there is a section on "song divide" and then how to put it all back together again in a different order. But the problem with "Japlish" as we all know, is not written in a way that Western logic or thought processes can easily grasp.

I do believe that with a machine like this, basic editing and copying like cutting and pasting, should be very easy to do. Somewhere out there is the knowledge I seek. I also have an Md8 that I haven´t even started to use yet! I have loads of discs as well for it. Would anyone care to make me an offer I can´t refuse for both units - as they are both for sale! I am based in Germany - 30 minutes from the Dutch border. I have every confidence in the MD format but I´m not getting far with the manual!

All I need to know is: Do I use the song divide function, the part copy function or some other variation. My hope is to cut a piece of the song out and then to stitch the track seamlessly together again (sob...)

Thank you fellow users, it´s good to see that people respond and it is appreciated. If my meagre knowledge is worth sharing, ask away...
 
The MD8 is the black model and the MD4 is the silver one - both for sale!

The technology is marvellous I have to say and its a pity the manual doesn´t take you step by step through the method of "examples"!

Where have I gone wrong ? I managed to record without any undue hassle
 
I know this isn't going to be substantially helpful,...

but the MD8/MD4 should be able to do the type of editing you want to do. All the directions should be in the manual.

I'm sorry I can't add anything of substance.;)
 
WE HAVE SEEN THE LIGHT - it was as of a laser...

Dear fellow MD4/MD8 users.

May I ask you to recall the film we all loved: "The Blues Brothers". Now fast fwd to the point where Jake and Elwood are standing in a Church and James Brown is coaxing his flock into a frenzy of gospel handclapping and tumultous voices etc...

Jake and Elwood stand there absorbing the scene and suddenly, Jake is illuminated by a strong shaft of sunlight. He cries out "I HAVE SEEN THE LIGHT!"

Digital brethren, at 4am this morning while you were all sleeping and agonising over your MD4´s and MD8´s, your faithful new leader was deciphering our enigma machine. Lo and behold, thanks to my efforts, we can now a) repeat sections b) repeat whole lines c) zip and whizz to all sorts of points within a song at our arrogant whims d) make even single words repeat forever and cause the weakest of chorus´s to play so often that we convince ourselves and long suffering neighbours/loved ones/dog/etc that we have written the next mega-hit.

How then is this possible? The first essential step is to ignore the hated "Japlish" manual - ponder no more over the EDIT SONG section - it will confuse and baffle until Doomsday. The patience of Job himself would be tested to breaking point - locusts and boils would be a relief in comparison...

The blast of the last trumpet (a digital sample with midiverb set to "Cathedral"?) would ring in our ears. Whole civilisations will rise and disappear...

Throwing the manual nonchalantly to one side with a snort of disdain, now reach for a piece of "virgin" (love that word) A4 paper and a ballpoint pen with some ink left in it. Feel suffused with happiness and inner peace as what I am about to reveal will allow you to sleep at nights and make you look less like Mr. Hyde under those bloodshot eyes..those dark circles will be a thing of the past...

THERE ARE 36 STEPS TO EDITING HEAVEN:

1) "Rewind" to the start of a song - the display will obligingly read 000 00 00

2) For our crafty purposes, these zeros do NOT denote the "start" of the
song - ignore them!

3) Press PLAY

4) As soon as some sound happens press PAUSE

5) Get into track mark mode by looking at and pressing the track MARK
button

6) Mark this onset of sound as MARK 1

7) Play on to the next point you would like to set as an END point

8) Press PAUSE and make this MARK 2 - it will be so, believe me. Have faith!

9) Carry on doing this in my example which I decree as FOUR MARKS* to
keep it quick and easy

10) Now your masterpiece has 4 track MARKS and the machine needs to have
those in memory! The next step in our advance into editing nirvana is
blindingly simple - and guaranteed. I only ask that you deposit the sum
of 250 Euros into the Swiss bank account number you will recieve later...

11) We must not think of song divide or edit track or song/part copy - these
are false prophets!

12) Obstinately, now press the UTILITY button and rotate to CUE LIST - no,
it has nothing to do with Billiards or Snooker...this a cue of a very
different kind! Put that chalk away

13) As this is our first CUE LIST, we need to concern ourselves only with a
NEW List

14) Press ENTER

15) Display should read "EDIT List"

16) Gleefully press ENTER

17) The display now looks like this: a: s - e n=0
Explanation: "a" is the first action we are taking in assembling MARKS
into a sequence of events
"1" is the start of the song so enter a value of s1
Now, proceed to "e", which means END - enter MARK 2
n=0 BEWARE!! - this must not remain at 0 or we will not get the machine
to do a thing - the value must be at least "1"

18) Look at the display and it should now read thus: a 1 - 2 n=1

19) Now advance to step b - rotate the alpha dial to the right and the
display will advance automatically to "b"

20) Now enter at "s" the number 3 - it is the new start point MARKER

21) Now enter at "e" the new END point, which is MARK 4 and then, HA! -
n=1

22) NOTE: the last MARK - in this case 4 - is the real "end" of the music, not
where the counter says it is the end of the song - this is the TOC and is
not in a sense meaningful to us song cue list perverts. We are of higher
intelligence and know that this is a falsehood!

23) We should have stopped at the end of the music and in PAUSE mode,
made "4" our final TRACK MARK - remember that!

24) Now we enter the heavenly realm of LIST PLAY

25) Press the ENTER button

26) We should see the display ask innocently : "List PLAY"

27) Now then, place a finger into the recess on the alpha dial and rotate to
the right. If you have rotated instead, turn around and start again!

28) Our humble slave now asks us "List COPY" and is waiting deferentially for
our next command...

29) Dressed in a white robe and smiling benevolently but authoritively, we
now press ENTER with feelings of vast superiority over a mere machine
that is no match for our mega intelligence. Spitting out a grape seed...

30) Press ENTER

31) All of a sudden and with no warning "beep" or other sign of obeyance,
the MD4/MD8 will start whirring and the display panel will go ape-shit
with some form of alien symbols which only confirms to us what we
already suspected - that Area 54 is indeed an underground research
facility where flying saucers have been dismantled and digital technology
exposed to human examination and replication - yes, it is of alien origin
after all! (From the Dog Star of course) Ask any Dogan.

32) At last, - why did it take so long? - but you had a smoke of something
while you were wating didn´t you! - admit it...! - and although you
don´t know why or how it did it - the Md4/8 has digitally reproduced
your song into a new one called SONG 2 or whatever it has decided to
call the blank space it did it in...

33) The title is the same as its un-edited predecessor but this is NOT the
same song brethren!

34) Light a cigar ( or ?) and now press PLAY of the new creation!

35) Listen to the result with orgasmic feelings of bliss and inner calm and the
milk of human kindness, compassion and benevolence to all cosmic
matter be it inert or living. Hug a tree. Place crystals around the MD4/8

36) NIRVANA has been reached - we are now listening to the edited version
which is playing the song as was directed by our mortal commands. Parts
we hated are no longer heard, as if by trickery, they have disappeared!
We are zapping and whizzing to the sections we really wanted to hear -
- hated passages of musical hideousness have been silenced forever...

Now then, the only thing that might disturb our benign expressions is the occasional sonic hiccup - why? Because we did not specify an accurate enough TRACK MARK so we must now return to the TRACK MARK adust - ! Do not pass GO, do not collect $200.00 - NO CIGAR!

Press ADJUST LOAD and with microscopic nano movements of our hand, listen to the soundbyte as we decide if what we are hearing is causing the glitch! If it sounds "early" we must advance the track mark by some frames, or even retard it (who are you calling a retard??) and now when satisfied with our
"edit" we press ENTER. Then we must re.assemble our markers into another "new" song.

Brothers and sisters, we have seen the light. You are all invited to a ritual " manual burning" at the usual place this Saturday night. You know the place, where we burned the DX7 manuals...The wearing of hooded robes is advised. Undergarments at your own discretion...

Our rite of passage is over - I acknowledge your genuflection and smiles of gratitude.

Chill...PEACE...Andy.
 
Dude,... I mean Sir,...

Andy Martin said:
I only ask that you deposit the sum
of 250 Euros into the Swiss bank account number you will recieve later...
You are my hero!!! :eek: ;) :cool:
You have earned my everlasting respect and gratitude.
The check is in the mail! ;)

Your notes are invaluable,... & are herewith copied to my hard drive for posterity!

MD4/MD8 users stand up and proclaim youselves as worthy!

All hail the tiny 2.5" shiny jacketed disc!! :eek:
 
From my inner sanctum....

Dear Atracs, digital brethren!!!

(Minutes of the last meeting):

To all who attended the ritual "manual burning" last Saturday - can the member who pissed over the ritual stone please own up? - as when coals were lit around and upon it, a vile pungent aroma threw a yellow "cloud" over the first 15 minutes of the meeting...some of us are still coughing and many robes worn by disciples in the front of the circle - including my own with the purple silk lining and snake head emblem on the rear of the hood - will now have to be sent to the dry cleaners...

Several hundred manuals or if not, pages, were ritually read out, laughed at (some wept in memory of hours wasted etc), ridiculed, shat upon in some instances - and then commited to the flames. My own minidisc with the first perfect and seamless song was placed on the alter afterwards as members filed past it with heads bowed. Then it was placed in an "ark" where it can be worshipped at the inner sanctum. Some members were seen "fidgeting" beneath their robes as they passed by the minidisc and altar and I can only hope that this was due to nervousness..

The taste of the burgers and sausages was somewhat tainted due to the first action mentioned in paragraph 1 and some members were leaving before the bbq got fully underway. Fortunately, my own abstinence (being vegan of course) was prudent.

As the leader of our movement, I must also deeply criticise those of you who enacted orgies of the most vile nature and scratched their names into trees, describing their transgressions. These actions cast a pall over what was mean to be a hallowed day for our Atrac movement. Whilst I can easily understand the feelings of joyous celebration and happiness, over which I presided, I feel there should be more restraint shown at the next revelation of my work and alchemic decipherings.

I have now placed an Md4 & Md8 on suitable pedestals in my inner sanctuary and am secretively continuing to decipher more of the hated, blasphemous "Japlish".

As usual, decrees will be placed here in the Md4/Md8 rumour control proclamation boards. Questions will be answered at my own discretion, subect to the earlier "law" concerning my Swiss bank account.

Peace and atrac.

Andy - Atrac Leader and oracle.
 
You shall henceforth be known as...

Lord Atrac! ;)
 
Lord Atrac speaks to the brethren...

Brethren and fellow Atracs,

For your further edification:

As per my decrees about the method of creating a *newly edited song* in the CREATE LIST mode:

I urge you all to take a piece of paper and just as you would when using a sequencer, make a series of blocks and columns. The reason is clear -and this will make the whole process much more simple as I will now demonstrate.

First *a newly edited song* is no more than just a re-assembling of our hit record (well, mine anyway) into a new "version" that might feasably begin with the 1st Chorus or indeed, the outro if one wishes to be unfeasable.

Although many permutations are possible - we must remember that all we are trying to achieve is some form of non-destructive edit and by this, we must not enter the realm of confusion! WE ARE ONLY RE-ARRANGING THE SONG AS A WHOLE brethren. If we say the order of play is A B C D E F G, we can arrange the piece to play back as B B E D A C (half of F!!) a few frames of G and then, enable the whole thing to play again in reverse order. Or perverse order.

Those of us with nothing better to do and masochistic tendencies can even make a sequence play until the sun becomes a red giant, or at least, until the neighbours have long since moved out...

But to make this sonic Frankenstein come to life, one must write down the steps. Follow my instructions:

Draw a series of lines - how tiresome that I should have to illustrate this:

-----------*----*------*----*----------------*----*--------------------
Intro * s1 * e2 n=1 FRAME NUMBER * e/END could be MK 3 etc
-----------*----*------*----*----------------*----*--------------------
Similarly s1 (track Mark 1) could be 2

Carry on with seperate lines for visual reference and input the start and end points as you would wish them to be heard/played back. The * symbols above are only illustrating where you might wish to draw in a downward North/South line, dividing East to West ones into neat boxes. In the blank space where I have written FRAME NUMBER, you may wish to make a note of that.

But regarding frame numbers, I advise when shuttling back and forth and trying to aurally locate the "cut", we use a seperate piece of paper for notes!

Locating a cut point is not a simple task! So begin with a rough idea by playing the intended section and then add a track mark. Make a note of the frame, MARK number & part of the song it relates to! Next begins what promises to be a very great challenge indeed. You must advance or retard this MARK by loading ADJUST by pressing ADJUST and then ENTER. Only what seems like a million playbacks later will reveal the true cut point! This process must be repeated for every MARKER where we wish a section to Start & End. We shall call this process "Setting start and end points". You will throughout this listening process write down the different frame numbers, crossing out those which sound obviously wrong/out of time. There will be so many of these, that you will soon realise why it is a LAW to write down the frame numbers :-)...my benign smile...

When the edited song is finally complete and has been assembled into a new song - we can listen back to the resulting edits. Did it work? If "yes", you may approach me in the inner sanctum where I shall listen to it and declare it worthy. If the answer is "no", then you may not approach me or touch my garment!

If you should approach me, remember that the snake head emblem on the underside of my upper foreskin shall be exposed and my helper, the eunech brother of Green Hornet, will place hot coals around your vile minidisc and you will be forced to watch it melt. My trusted helper, known as REEL PERSON will then escort you to the rear of the sanctum and the gnarled and stinking remains, carried in bbq tongs (until the committee has enough in the kitty to purchase a more suitable icon) will be tossed into the great pit as I watch with the gravity this demands of me.

During this ceremony, you shall repeat to me from memory (in a voice one unmodulated octave lower than usual), our mantra: (repeating this one octave higher like the brother of Green Hornet (who cannot help it) - is forbidden!! and will result in hot coals being placed around the offenders testicles, causing permanency of pitch and tone. Therefore:

"ATRAC: An acronym for adaptive transform accoustic coding. This is the compression technique used to fit the same amount of data as that of a 120mm CD on a 64mm minidisc. Atrac uses established psychoaccoustic principles to compress audio data to approximately one 5th of its original size, with virtually no loss in sound quality. The "threshold of hearing principle" states that the sensetivity of the human ear is frequency dependent. Two tones of the same level but at different frequencies will not be heard at the same loudness. Another principle used is the "masking effect". That is, softer sounds become inaudible when louder sounds at similar frequencies are present"

LORD ATRAC.
 
Last edited:
Lord Atrac´s New Year Message

This is rumour control and here are the facts:

As some of you will have correctly concluded, it is the year 2006.

Various worries that circulated and caused great anxieties in the previous year were not completely put to rest. For the benefit of those who are still agitated I would like to clarify the following, regarding MD8´s and MIDI.

A basic function of the MD8 is its "midi-thru" capability. Through this portal, midi time code is output. Hooking up an MD4, which recognises incoming data in this form, will allow you to create 12 track recordings. Stopping and starting is likewise recognised by the "slave" MD4. If you keep using the midi thru function on the slave device, you can hook up another MD4 and the Holy Grail of 16 track "bounceless" recordings will have been attained!

Some of you will now be fidgeting beneath the lower frontal regions of your cassocks and this is forbidden! Some may even have raised the rear portions of the said gown for other purposes and this is a most henious crime, punishable by public "whipping by midi lead" VERTICALLY and INSIDE the rear cheek "cracks" of the offending posteriors, whilst repeating the ATRAC mantra, backwards. The souls of offenders I shall personally curse and commit to Midi Hell. I shall not repeat this warning again!

*Due to previous unintentional attendant injuries as seen in the case of Brother Gonad, I have attenuated this punishment slightly be decreeing that a data disc be sellotaped across and over the back of exposed shaven scrotums so as not to recieve any mis-aligned cord lashes.

NOTE: The single stroke downward whiplash from my own riding crop to the top of shaven heads for other offences shall however, continue throughout 2006.

If I may continue...thank you!...

Digital data transfer via optical or usb/midi connection so one can transfer sound files to a computer/PC:

The MD8 is fully midi compatible and can be sequenced with a computer.The MD8 does not record music as midi but as an "audio file" so recording onto a computer is the same as recording a cd onto your hard drive, via your soundcard in realtime (as for example, an MP3 File, or as an audio file on your sequencer programme). I believe you can do this in stereo so that the music goes onto your programme as two audiofiles, alongside your midi tracks.

It seems clear that the MD8 would not transfer tracks as individual data!Usually, you would sync the MD8 to the computer, record your audio on the MD8 and your midi on the PC, then, when its mixdown time, send both recordings out through a mixer. A useful feature is that you can actually send the MD8 tracks AND the PC recording (as a stereo out) through the MD8's mixer.

In a previous decree, I stated:

The MD8 will not run in sync with another MD8 because the MD8 does not recognise incoming midiclock, although it sends it. Therefore, another MD8 would not receive incoming time clock.

You CAN directly connect the MD8 to an MD4 as I have stated. In this simple scenario the MD8 sends MMC that the MD4 can read. This gives you 12T operation. For some reason, Yamaha did not include Time Clock recognition on the MD8 but it CAN be linked via a sequencer, using the midi thru function!

My guess as to why a recognition signal function was not included between MD8´s directly, is simply that the Yamaha design department became confused themselves when attempting to read their own Japlish manual or to linguistically incorporate the function. The lateral thinking this required was defeated by the language barrier itself it seems - as no-one, ourselves included, can understand it either. Which is as you know, why I have been appointed the decipherer of the Japlish code, with occasional help from lesser brethren, who normally only prepare tea for me during times of overwhelming stress.

Further tea gifts are not necessary, as the adjoining cave is now full and has forced Brother Testicleless into co-habitating with Brother Bent-Dong.

That is all. Everyone will now return to a state of inner calm and their normal routines.

Lord Atrac.
 
All Hail Lord ATRAC!!

......................... :cool:
 
Lord Atrac speaks to the Brethren

Silence!!! There WILL be SILENCE!

This is rumour control. Since my posting yesterday on the proclamation board, I have had little sleep and am most irritated by the celebrations that immediately commenced outside the dwelling of Brother Gonad after "lights out".

Raising from my place of sleep, I was greeted by my trusted helper Brother Reel Person at the entrance of my cave, who was busy brewing mildly sedative tea - the pungent aroma of which helped restore my own sense of inner calm and balance.

Together, we proceeded in the darkness towards the dwelling of the aforementioned brother. A rather large throng had obviously been in attendence for some hours, as Brother Gonad could not have made so much noise alone. Although, we are all aware of his nocturnal habitual problems of the past, involving several Md4 units, suspect midi cables and general confusion...and obvious lack of any musicality whatsoever...

...it appears the object of interest was the appearance of an ancient Roland MC500 sequencer hooked up to the MD8´s of Brothers Green Hornet, Bent-Dong, Testicleless - and, I am sure I recognised in the dim lighting Brothers Kris Pissedoffersen, Brother Hulio Doubleglasiarse, Brother Domestos Roussos and Brother Inglenook Fireplace - as I say, the lighting was inadequete due to my own earlier decrees about harsh lighting after the allotted time.

However, there was so much broken glass from shattered drinking vassals in the vicinity that I did not dare approach barefoot further in the dim lighting. Therefore, I expect to make some announcement quite soon that should have far reaching conseqeunces.

Following my proclamation yesterday, it appears that my comments have caused much disquietetude as well as mass encouragement, which in a way pleases me. However, these nocturnal rituals must cease within earshot of my own dwelling and I summon those named and responsible to my cavern where all shall appear before me for ritual slaps to the top of the head with my riding crop. The wearing of protective helmets will not be permitted and I shall administer the punishments personally, in view of my disturbed sleep patterns. As you all know, I cannot concentrate fully on the Japlish codes unless I am fully rested. Why I should need to state the obvious, so often, is another annoyance in itself.

That is all.

Lord Atrac.

Note: Messages of achievement are now invited to be submitted to the general noticeboard and I shall read them all with the assistance of Brother Green Hornet.
 
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