mastering in SF

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Bruce,
I'm gonna let you and Chess decide.

-But- I downloaded 3 of mixmkr's trax, none of which is on your short list :( .

Queue
 
OH! Well, I just followed mixmkr's recommendation of his stuff at http://www.mp3.com/theupperroom and chose from there! He recommended it, so I figured it was what he wanted to have "processed"...

If Chess has different picks, I'll listen to them -- I don't really think the actual song matters much... I mean, if mixmkr was a client, the engineer would have to work with what was given....

Bruce
 
if mixmkr was a client, the engineer would have to work with what was given....
Click to expand...

As always, a valid point. The counterpoint being, he's not a client, and considering you're doing this for nothing, you should get the liberty of picking a song you like. (You're gonna have to listen to it enough...)

Perhaps, being that you are a professional, you can be more ...removed... from what you are working on. I'd have a hard time putting a lot of time and effort into a song I hated, or one from a genre that I hated...

Queue
 
Well, personally, I prefer secular to Christian music, but again, I don't see this as any different as if I were dealing with a client.... I'd be happy to let Chess pick it......

Also - I still feel the need to re-iterate that this little exercise WILL NOT prove my point about mastering needing to be done at a professional facility to be effective. We are really only comparing what each of us can do to a final mix with the gear at hand - kind of a "pre-mastering" stage. Blue Bear Sound's own gear list is about as relative to proper mastering gear as a Fostex cassette 4-track is to serious studio recording.

I just want us to be clear about exactly what this exercise will accomplish - and it has nothing to do with the mastering process.

Bruce
 
I won't have access to a computer with sound until after the weekend. I'll give them a listen monday or tuesday. If any of them really stand out to me, then I'll mention something then.

I'm looking forward to this challenge. It's going to be great fun, and probably a good a learning experience as well.

Thanks to everyone for their efforts in getting this thing going. Have a great extended weekend, all!


- Chess
 
MY best friend's band, Rewake, just had thier mix mastered in a pro mastering studio in l.a.. My suggestion is I'll get a hold of the original mix and chess and bruce can use that to master, then I'll post the real master. and the common folk on this thread can vote between the pro, chess, and bruce. That would be cool!
Adam
www.rewake.com
 
BUT CHESS AND I ARE NOT MASTERING!!!!!!!!!!
I should hope the pro-mastered version would sound better than both our versions..........

It would be a cool experiment though.....

Bring it on.....

Bruce
 
I know you're not mastering, however it's the easist way to communicate what we all know you're doing and that's why saying mastering is good enough.
rad, I'll get the unmastered cd from my buddy and send it to Queue, if he wants to email me his address.
Adam
 
Yo Queue
I talked to my friend in rewake and he's going to have thier singer send you 2 cds, the mixed and the mastered.
Adam
 
I'll keep my eye on the mailbox, and let you know when they arrive.

Queue
 
"Your wanting to let average listeners judge is all wrong." (Shailat)

"The 'average' listener may not be critical enough to judge." (Bruce)

Bruce is right - the contest isn't about mastering, it's a mixing comparison.

But for me, the above quotes are the really contentious issue in this thread. It's not that I don't see how trained ears can and do hear things I don't or can't hear. It's the way the whole thing is so open to bullshit:

"The first mix is better."

"I don't think so - I like the second one."

"Well, that's because you're an average listener, you don't know what to listen for, and you're not qualified to judge."

I really want to have both a pro and a homer give their views on the two mixes, because I sure as fuck am going to be listening and making up my own mind about how big a difference there is between them. This is great! Chessrock, you're overconfident, irritatingly provocative and really uninformed, but this whole thing seems to be turning out interesting. Most flame threads are just pissing matches. Let's see if we can keep this one on the tracks long enough to learn something.

dobro (modest, winningly engaging and really dedicated to learning something useful :D)
 
:eek:

Dobro.... I think that's the first time I've seen you use the word FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!

*yikes!*

:D :D

Bruce
 
My fuck! You obviously haven't read many of my posts, then. :D

I'm fond of 'sure as fuck' and 'go like fuck', and of course, 'fuck you' just sums it up sometimes, doesn't it? And not just linguistically, either. :D Don't take it personally, though. :D
 
My dear friend, Dobro,

This thread has never been about pissing matches, boasting, or posting insightful reading material.

Try putting things in context. When I originally posted here, I was trying to impart some help to someone who had some questions about Sound Forge, a popular PC-based music editor from Sonic Foundry. And in proper context, I was doing so in the Sonic Foundry forum. Much to my IRRITATION, someone else who apparently knows very little about this forum's topic decided to stroll on in and chip in their 2 cents about how our methods of mastering and sound editing were inferior, and could never measure up to what can be done professionally.

Talk about irritatingly provocative, doblow. This about the equivalent of a trained chef visiting a "home cooking" forum, and telling all the housewives how their silly recipes could never compare to what can be done by a trained chef at a five-star restaurant. Thanks for the info, Chef Tell, but I'm still wondering if I should add 1 or 2 tablespoons of butter, or if I should set the oven to 400 or 500 degrees.

In this example, Chef Tell's remarks were not inacurate. But they were out of context.

I can appreciate your thoughts on how misinformed I supposedly am. But if I am so misinformed, as you say, why is it that I am the ONLY ONE IN THE SONIC FOUNDRY FORUM WHO HAS HAD ANYTHING TO SAY ABOUT SONIC FOUNDRY? I'm still waiting for yourself, Bluebear, Shailat, and others to offer any insite at all about this forum's actual topic. What types of plugins do you recommend, and how do you feel about the spectrum analyzer and multi-band compressor contained within the Soundforge pack as opposed to those supplied by Waves and other companies?

Next time you want to call me misinformed, over-confident, or provocative, why don't you wait untill I show up to your forums on mixing and mastering, and start shooting my mouth off. I have always been nothing but courteous when visiting other sections of the forum with questions. I would only hope others would do the same in return.

That being said, I am still looking forward to the continued friendly spirit of this competition. With every passing day, I am becoming more and more impressed with all the "utensils" I have in my "kitchen," and can't wait to put them to the test against the pro chefs.

YOU GUYS ARE GOING DOWN ! ! !
 
Hmmm... why did I respond to the mastering post in the Sonic Foundry forum????

Well... a couple of reasons...
1) I list the new posts by date, so I don't really see which forum it is under, and if it's a topic I can offer info or comment on, I do so..........

2) The broader topic of mastering is beyond the scope of a particular forum and it is a pet peeve of mine to see the craft being put down as extraneous, irrelevant, or useless.

And Chess.......... B R I N G I T O N!!!!

:)

Bruce
 
Chess, this thread got hijacked by the 'contest'. Why not repost your Sound Forge questions in a new thread, and let this one carry the 'detour'? Any way you play it, the detour's wa-a-a-a-y more important to me. It would just confuse things to try to start a new thread about it in the mixing forum or mp3 forum.

As for 'overconfident, irritatingly provocative and really uninformed' - well, it's true - no reason to take it personal just cuz I pointed it out. :D

overconfident: you're willing to take on pros as their own game. I'm looking forward to this. I'm hoping you do a really good job of it, because all along, it's been my opinion that there's not as much distance between a pro mix and a well-done home mix as some pros would like you to believe.

irritatingly provocative: the baiting and name-calling (eg 'doblow') - you like mixing it up, admit it.

really uninformed: I might have got that one wrong. I think you don't know what mastering is, though. But that's just a concept. What's important is getting the best sound you can with the music.

You know what I think would be the coolest 'contest'? To take the raw recorded tracks and do the mixes, then compare 'em.
 
That would be interesting.

But we should save that one for another challenge. Mastering, IMHO, is a necessary but over-rated step in the chain. Mixing is a whole different beast.

Not sure if a do-it-yourselfer would be capable of hanging with the big boys in a mix-off, but I do agree that it would be very interesting.

After the master competition, I'll be taking on any challengers for a mix-off. Dobro (Aregato, Mr. Roboto) will be taking applications. :) Who wants a piece of me?
 
Mixoff...

Ed -Sonusman- is in the early, early stages of starting a mixoff over in the MP3 clinic. Look at the "Just finished this today..." thread.

Queue

btw, chess, didya listen to mixmkr's stuff or are we waiting until I get the rewake stuff?
 
Thanks, "Q " . . .

I'll be sure to check that out.

I listened to Spanish Nights a few times, and I gotta' tell ya . . . even though I'm not normally in to that kind of music, that is one great-sounding mix, imho. Excellent work!

From some of the other posts, it looked like someone else wanted to get in the game, too, though. That one sounds a bit more intriguing, actually, since they've got both the pre-mastered and post-mastered versions. For this reason alone, this entry would be my first choice. It would be very interesting for the "judges," as they would be able to listen to the pre-master, the post-master (no pun intended) professional version, the post-master Blue Bear version, and the post-master Chessrock version. I would be interested in hearing those, even if they don't make it in to the First Annual HomeRec Mastering Challenge Y2K+1. :)

BTW, wouldn't it be funny if, after all of this, the pre-mastered version came out on top?

peace
 
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