Led Zeppelin now in court over Stairway
- Thread starter ido1957
- Start date
Maybe that was the whole idea.
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
Speaking of copyright lawsuits...
Mike Huckabee just paid out $25k for misusing "Eye of the "Tiger" at an event.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/mike-huc...424f6c496&bcmt_s=u#mediacommentsugc_container
Mike Huckabee just paid out $25k for misusing "Eye of the "Tiger" at an event.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/mike-huc...424f6c496&bcmt_s=u#mediacommentsugc_container
MrUserNameIV
SenselessActsOfCreation
I agree with everyone in this thread.
it seems that piece is a public domain written in baroque era by harpist O'Carolan
The Celtic Baroque roots of Stairway to Heaven | Music Tales
The Celtic Baroque roots of Stairway to Heaven | Music Tales
witzendoz
Senior Member
Stairway to heaven was defiantly influenced by this stye of music, but it's drawing a long Bow saying this is a copy. A lot of folk tunes are almost the same just in the same way 1950's rock and roll and blues was very much the same structure.
I agree it is a heavy influence.
Alan.
witzendoz
Senior Member
I actually bought Spirit's album with Taurus after reading the article some years ago.
Alan.
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
Nope...Led Zeppelin is still making the money off "Stairway to Heaven".
I thought that whole Taurus thing was a real stretch. I mean, if that's the measure of copyright infringement...then much of Blues/Rock music would be liable.
Chord progressions alone don't count...and there's not much of a melody there in the Taurus song...not to mention, Spirit and the actual writers never had intentions to sue LZ when they were still alive...this was all done by the "trust" people, looking for a payout.
CoolCat
Well-known member
Oh but....Yes...the lawyers are making a fortune off the case....they dont work for free.
A simple Divorce lawyer makes $350 hr around here. This is much larger than that.
I dont doubt Led is still rolling in the cash far from hurting by this lawsuit...but theres probably a lucky law firm for Led Zep.
They arent going to hire a $350 hr Divorce lawyer. Maybe $3500 an hr?
Doesnt seem like Zep is going to pay the trust-funders law firm to go away.
Around here Ive personally seen several divorce lawyers wipe out $180,000 on one side, and this is average joes I know.
I cant imagine gazillionaires like George Harrison, Led Zepplin, McCartney etc... big buck lawyers.
Zeps lawyer wants $800k ? So Zep gets sued by their own lawyers? lol dang
Led Zep lawyers want $800k for defending “Stairway to Heaven” lawsuit | Ars Technica
A simple Divorce lawyer makes $350 hr around here. This is much larger than that.
I dont doubt Led is still rolling in the cash far from hurting by this lawsuit...but theres probably a lucky law firm for Led Zep.
They arent going to hire a $350 hr Divorce lawyer. Maybe $3500 an hr?
Doesnt seem like Zep is going to pay the trust-funders law firm to go away.
Around here Ive personally seen several divorce lawyers wipe out $180,000 on one side, and this is average joes I know.
I cant imagine gazillionaires like George Harrison, Led Zepplin, McCartney etc... big buck lawyers.
Zeps lawyer wants $800k ? So Zep gets sued by their own lawyers? lol dang
Led Zep lawyers want $800k for defending “Stairway to Heaven” lawsuit | Ars Technica
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CoolCat
Well-known member
this is one of the firms involved. some heavy clients...
Kulik Gottesman Siegel & Ware’s attorneys are experts in the entertainment industry.
Our practice areas include: breach of contract, license agreements, defined net proceeds (previously known as “Net Profits”), employment disputes, non-compete disputes, trust funds for minor actors, first-look deals, option contracts, writer contracts, Writers Guild of America “WGA” compliance, producer contracts, screen actor contracts, Screen Actors Guild “SAG” compliance, director contracts, Directors Guild of America “DGA” compliance, motion picture distribution, television distribution, music deals, 360 deals, publishing rights, synchronization rights, master use license, digital rights, trademark and copyright.OUR CLIENTSWe have represented well-known actors, musicians, and writers in high-stakes litigation. Some of our clients include Mike Myers, Diane Keaton, William Shatner, Elizabeth Taylor, Barry Manilow, Sharon Stone, Michael Eisner, Martin Ransohoff, the musical groups Electric Light Orchestra (ELO), Play, and Boom Town Rats, science fiction writer Harlan Ellison, and true-crime reporter and author Aphrodite Jones.We have handled disputes involving well-known films and television programs such as Shakespeare in Love, Platoon, Stigmata, Liar Liar, Raging Bull, Boys Don’t Cry, Waterworld, John Q, Made In America, This is Spinal Tap, Frequency, Star Trek, The OC, Northern Exposure, My Two Dads, Baywatch, The Simpsons, Las Vegas, In the House, The Two Coreys, Love Decoys, The Pick Up Artist, and many others.
not get off topic of Zepplin case, but it reminds me John Lennon got sued for using only two lines of Chuck Berrys song, so how little does it take to win or be sued?
Every song Ive written uses some chord progression used by someone before and its even more extremely possible someone unknown copyrighted something that sounds like someone else in a very similar way, especially in Rock and Rap and all that?
The Van Halen and Rap sample case too is only a short guitar riff...actually a sample I think, but still only a few notes.
Led Zepplin has to fight the accusation again it looks like. This time the jury is going to hear the music of Spirits riff and Zepplins in court.
But if Zepplin loses, their lawyers will appeal.
Lawyer Who Sued Led Zeppelin Suspended From Practicing Law | Hollywood Reporter
How much is at stake I wonder?
Is it $10 million, $50 million
$100 million?
Kulik Gottesman Siegel & Ware’s attorneys are experts in the entertainment industry.
Our practice areas include: breach of contract, license agreements, defined net proceeds (previously known as “Net Profits”), employment disputes, non-compete disputes, trust funds for minor actors, first-look deals, option contracts, writer contracts, Writers Guild of America “WGA” compliance, producer contracts, screen actor contracts, Screen Actors Guild “SAG” compliance, director contracts, Directors Guild of America “DGA” compliance, motion picture distribution, television distribution, music deals, 360 deals, publishing rights, synchronization rights, master use license, digital rights, trademark and copyright.OUR CLIENTSWe have represented well-known actors, musicians, and writers in high-stakes litigation. Some of our clients include Mike Myers, Diane Keaton, William Shatner, Elizabeth Taylor, Barry Manilow, Sharon Stone, Michael Eisner, Martin Ransohoff, the musical groups Electric Light Orchestra (ELO), Play, and Boom Town Rats, science fiction writer Harlan Ellison, and true-crime reporter and author Aphrodite Jones.We have handled disputes involving well-known films and television programs such as Shakespeare in Love, Platoon, Stigmata, Liar Liar, Raging Bull, Boys Don’t Cry, Waterworld, John Q, Made In America, This is Spinal Tap, Frequency, Star Trek, The OC, Northern Exposure, My Two Dads, Baywatch, The Simpsons, Las Vegas, In the House, The Two Coreys, Love Decoys, The Pick Up Artist, and many others.
not get off topic of Zepplin case, but it reminds me John Lennon got sued for using only two lines of Chuck Berrys song, so how little does it take to win or be sued?
Every song Ive written uses some chord progression used by someone before and its even more extremely possible someone unknown copyrighted something that sounds like someone else in a very similar way, especially in Rock and Rap and all that?
The Van Halen and Rap sample case too is only a short guitar riff...actually a sample I think, but still only a few notes.
Led Zepplin has to fight the accusation again it looks like. This time the jury is going to hear the music of Spirits riff and Zepplins in court.
But if Zepplin loses, their lawyers will appeal.
Lawyer Who Sued Led Zeppelin Suspended From Practicing Law | Hollywood Reporter
How much is at stake I wonder?
Is it $10 million, $50 million
$100 million?
CoolCat
Well-known member
Did you google it?
Zep won...then it was appealed and Zep lost and its going back for a retrial.
The higher court told the lower to re-trial and this time allow the jury to hear both parts while watching Jimmy Pages "demeanor" or something...lol
the Ninth Circuit also suggested another reason that the songs should be played to the jury; specifically, that there could be probative value in the jury merely observing the reactions of the parties while the songs are being played.
So it aint over and the Lawyers love cases going on for 10yrs because they suck everyone for cash....in the end no one wins but the lawyers.
Oct 1, 2018
Led Zeppelin Must Face a New Trial as Stairway to Heaven Verdict Gets Tossed
Im not a lawyer but its popcorn worthy....so the 9th is the higher court and they determined the lower court didnt perform the trial perfectly so they sent it back for a 're-do".
Now if Led Zep wins again...its most likely the 9Th-higher appeals court will say "ok done!" and then the Taurus Trust Fund have to appeal to the Supreme Court (I think)...
the Supreme Court is so overloaded they only take 1 case of 100,000 from what I read...anyway, those arent real numbers but its highly unlikely the Supreme Court will take it. Then its pretty much toast, done, kapuut, stick a fork in it...
What I predict happening is the retrial will include the Taurus Spirit riff and then the lawyer will play the Zep riff over and over and over for the Jury so they can hear it and look at Jimmy Page and Robert Plants faces to make some totally subjective witch hunt like judgement because maybe Jimmy wipes his eye brow and a juror sees that as GUILTY!! lol..... its insane.
in the meantime the Lawyers run up the bill to another $1.2 million....for their kids trust fund.
Zep won...then it was appealed and Zep lost and its going back for a retrial.
The higher court told the lower to re-trial and this time allow the jury to hear both parts while watching Jimmy Pages "demeanor" or something...lol
the Ninth Circuit also suggested another reason that the songs should be played to the jury; specifically, that there could be probative value in the jury merely observing the reactions of the parties while the songs are being played.
So it aint over and the Lawyers love cases going on for 10yrs because they suck everyone for cash....in the end no one wins but the lawyers.
Oct 1, 2018
Led Zeppelin Must Face a New Trial as Stairway to Heaven Verdict Gets Tossed
Im not a lawyer but its popcorn worthy....so the 9th is the higher court and they determined the lower court didnt perform the trial perfectly so they sent it back for a 're-do".
Now if Led Zep wins again...its most likely the 9Th-higher appeals court will say "ok done!" and then the Taurus Trust Fund have to appeal to the Supreme Court (I think)...
the Supreme Court is so overloaded they only take 1 case of 100,000 from what I read...anyway, those arent real numbers but its highly unlikely the Supreme Court will take it. Then its pretty much toast, done, kapuut, stick a fork in it...
What I predict happening is the retrial will include the Taurus Spirit riff and then the lawyer will play the Zep riff over and over and over for the Jury so they can hear it and look at Jimmy Page and Robert Plants faces to make some totally subjective witch hunt like judgement because maybe Jimmy wipes his eye brow and a juror sees that as GUILTY!! lol..... its insane.
in the meantime the Lawyers run up the bill to another $1.2 million....for their kids trust fund.
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CoolCat
Well-known member
yeah, its nuts.
John Lennon got sued for singing Here come ol flatop, he come movin up slowly....from Chuck Berry song....
the lawyers worked out a deal and they played together or somerthing and he included chucks songs on his next album or something.
I dont.....its up to the Jury and usually the Jury is a bunch of untrained normal people who havent a clue what the law is. lol
No matter who wins this round it will be "appealed" again, thats just the process. Unless they settle out of court....of course the Lawyers dont want it to end because thats their income.
I mean the small riffs sound the same? the songs nothing like each other?
Does it come down to who has the best lawyer?
John Lennon got sued for singing Here come ol flatop, he come movin up slowly....from Chuck Berry song....
the lawyers worked out a deal and they played together or somerthing and he included chucks songs on his next album or something.
I dont.....its up to the Jury and usually the Jury is a bunch of untrained normal people who havent a clue what the law is. lol
No matter who wins this round it will be "appealed" again, thats just the process. Unless they settle out of court....of course the Lawyers dont want it to end because thats their income.
I mean the small riffs sound the same? the songs nothing like each other?
Does it come down to who has the best lawyer?
Chili
Site Moderator
The key point that seems to be missed is the riff is signature to the song. When you hear the first three notes, you already know it is Stairway. And you know it's Stairway, not the Taurus song. That's plagiarism and yeah, LZ should pay for the right to use the riff. I willing to bet that the reason the original song writer, Randy Somebody, didn't sue was because he voiced his concern when Stairway first came out and somebody got to him. Shut him up. "We know where your mudder leaves" 
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
Only problem with that view is that there is NOTHING *signature* about it in the Taurus song...it's just a descending line that was used in other songs before Taurus. It's a common progression, and I believe that's been demonstrated.
To say that Spirit used a common progression, and LZ heard them using it and also used it in their song...and now there's copyright infringement by LZ...is a stretch.
That's like hearing some band do a typical 12 bar blues progression...then you do the same...and then they claim copyright infringement.