Just Getting Into Home Recording

[ecc83]

RC

You need to understand that the forum gets a lot of people who join, buy some gear based on popular lore of the various forums, often ask a bunch of fairly basic questions, and then vanish, never to be seen again. Likewise, we get a lot of new students who are taking "audio production" courses at a recording school (LA Film School is very common), and never check in again.

It looks like you've got a really solid background in audio and I suspect you're far more advanced that most people would have guessed.

Once you get everything setup and sorted out, we'd appreciate your comments, some audio samples, and opinions. Some of your equipment is less common than the typical home recording enthusiast. It might just fit the bill for someone else, something that they would have never considered!

I quite agree Rich, this is hardly your struggling, impecunious teenage bedroom wannabe! Don't really understand why the post is in the newb section? But no, no one means to be negative but there are different [points of view regarding sound recording. I belong to the "hi fi" school if you will in that I feel it is best to capture as accurate a take as possible of the instrument. Post tracking one can eff it about to death if you like!
Others want some "mojo" going in. Both techniques are valid.

Dave.

 

[rob aylestone]

I'm really interested in our very different views on 'quality'. I have never been able to produce a quantifiable link between price and quality, probably because we don't have a worldwide standard for audio quality at all. Up till maybe the end of the 70's, 'quality' was the avoidance of noise and distortion. Back then we were struggling with tonal shifts that people were starting to link (wrongly, I personally think) to 'quality'. So some of the historic mics - the Cole (STC) 4038 being a great example were deemed quality because their tone was more neutral for a ribbon - and the HF roll off was sort of kind - if you used one on something bright, you got the harmonics and then they gently tailed off. They didn't 'sizzle' - which meant some people went off them. Mics like the U87 became workhorses, not really special - but if you worked for a bigger budget organisation like our BBC, then they were the sort of thing you used for certain things - the things they did well. They were also NOT used for other sources as as I discovered when I bought one, they either flatter or hinder. Unlike the 414 which rarely does anything badly.

My mindset is still on accuracy, no noise or distortion and the ability to reveal, not create. This is why none of the items on your six grand shopping list are on mind. I'm absolutely not saying you have made a poor choice, but what you are looking for is some kind of magic I cannot treat in any positive way. I suppose I could - if I had the spare funds - buy a specific set of kit like yours, and for maybe 25% of my work, use it. That's just economically reckless for me. In fact my mic collection features 3 414s now - I bought more, when you got rid of yours to go for the Ear Trumpet. I'm sure you're really pleased with it - but I just cannot imagine me adding one to my collection. Many of the reviews for it are sufficiently odd for me to be wary. One review said it was nice for male vocals but less so on female. That concerns me - because that swing between good/bad is something I don't want to get into. I'm guessing the frequency response is just a bit odd to start with - but many boutique audio products are a bit odd and very succesful.

So we just have very different views on what we actually want. I hope the guitar builders will love what your kit produces. Interesting quest, I have to say.

 

[Rampant Colt]

Morning lessons start early here, 8:30AM sharp, so excuse me for not replying.

This won’t be a long post because I have more students beginning at 1:00PM.

Five or six months ago one of the luthiers called around 4:30 in the afternoon, knowing I was in the middle of lessons. He asked if there was any way I could record a short clip of one of my guitars (he had built two which were identical….this is not uncommon). I told him the only thing I could do would be a raw iPhone clip of something I’d just throw together. He said please do.



It’s awful, but he sold the guitar. Just on the fly, seat of your pants, playing that demonstrated flatpicking, fingerstyle, and strumming. The iPhone is ancient, and was placed about 18” from me. Anyway, it’s abysmal. That’s what started all of this.

I’ve got to go eat so I can be ready at 1:00PM.

 

[Rampant Colt]

but what you are looking for is some kind of magic I cannot treat in any positive way.

…and there you go again. You left out unicorns and rainbows.

 

[DM60]

…and there you go again. You left out unicorns and rainbows.

It seems you have a lot of knowledge and hopefully you post and participate. The technology IMO is the easy part now a days. Sound and how to mix is still an art, even with AI.

 

[rob aylestone]

I did say I was forever the sceptic. It's not you - loads of people want to add something to alter what that diaphragm actually captures. I do appreciate that sometimes the results can be wonderful, but it is a distortion of reality. We have people convinced that higher bit resolution and maths plus sample rates can put that sampled waveform back together so well we cannot hear it, and we have those who insist they can hear it. we have people maintaining that going back to tape and analogue mixers is an improvement. They cannot all be right. Everyone has their own idea of route for recording audio. I remember the Ferrograph test sets we used in the workshop to setup the gear to have minimal noise, distortion, wow and flutter, and back then many people could not hear it.

I've also tried to think about what price break we go from budget to 'normal' then to expensive. Clearly some of us have more money than sense, and others are really poor - so the breaks are variable. I think less than £75 for a mic is budget, and then expensive creeps in at what? £500 is an expensive mic. Break the £1000 price point and we move into the special category. 414s are expensive. U87s are special.

In all my years of collecting mics, the nicest sounding ones (to me) seem to have no real link to price. I can not automatically determine a new mic to me has to be good by it's price. Very often, eventually getting a mic missing from my collection has been somewhat underwhelming. Here are three mics that really haven't done much for me at all.
U87 - TLM103 I like much better.
RE20 - The 320 sounds nicer almost every time on far more of a range of sources.
Sennheiser 416 - the Audio Technica 815 is much nicer sounding mic.
I could probably find more. I would like to hear that Telefunken you mentioned in your first post. I've never heard one. Maybe when you start your recordings, you could use your posh chain, but also possibly record it direct through a normal preamp clean. I'd really like to see if it might work for me, without the tweaking kit.

 

[Rampant Colt]

I would like to hear that Telefunken you mentioned in your first post. I've never heard one. Maybe when you start your recordings, you could use your posh chain, but also possibly record it direct through a normal preamp clean. I'd really like to see if it might work for me, without the tweaking kit.

EVERYTHING that I will record will be clean. Nothing will be pushed. They’ll be no compression. You’ll hear the Marinair transformers which you’ve already indicated you don’t care for.

Furthermore, the chances of me going out of my way to appease you only to be ridiculed is slim to none, and slim is out of town.

 

[Rampant Colt]

It looks like you've got a really solid background in audio and I suspect you're far more advanced that most people would have guessed.

In actuality, audio would take a back seat to my background in music.

I began piano at age 6 due to overbearing parents. I was sight reading ledger lines and sheet music by age 8. By age 12 I was fully classically trained. That required a significant amount of music theory, but at age 12 you don’t retain that knowledge (thus Berklee).

I managed to transition from piano to guitar. It’s not as hard as it may sound, especially if you are familiar with the basic tenets of music.

At age 17 I auditioned for a legacy country act never imagining I’d get the gig. It turns out I got the gig and stayed with him for 6 1/2 years.

At 23 I did a live audition for another legacy country act who was one of my all time favorites. I replaced Warren Haynes who had left for the Allman Brothers. Sadly we lost David about four months ago. I was with him for 11 1/2 years.

By this time I had lost two wives and three kids. It’s a tough life.

At 34 I was asked to join another legacy country act. Probably in the top 15 as songwriters go. Sadly Kris passed almost two years ago. One of the most genuine and talented writers I ever met. I was with him for six years.

I finished my country days with a relative newcomer. Not my style of music and I left after two years.

So from 17 to 42, 25 years I was on the road. Of course there were breaks, but that’s a long time. I wouldn’t change a thing. Loved live playing especially to big crowds.

After all of that I had a friend in Chicago that wanted to do an acoustic album, which turned into two albums, and touring to sell/support each. We did well, but I’ll never do it again.

My last trip to a pro studio was June 22, 2026 to record a female singer/songwriter who didn’t play an instrument. I wrote the music for all of her songs in 2010 and it took 16 years to get to the studio. They had five children and no money to spend for a studio. But, it finally happened and I think it turned out well, just her vocal, and my 6 & 12 string guitar as well as mandolin. I don’t have a copy of it yet, but there is a YouTube video of it poorly recorded in a church. It’s OK, but not how I do things.

 

[DM60]

My last trip to a pro studio was June 22, 2026 to record a female singer/songwriter who didn’t play an instrument. I wrote the music for all of her songs in 2010 and it took 16 years to get to the studio. They had five children and no money to spend for a studio. But, it finally happened and I think it turned out well, just her vocal, and my 6 & 12 string guitar as well as mandolin. I don’t have a copy of it yet, but there is a YouTube video of it poorly recorded in a church. It’s OK, but not how I do things.

I think that's the thing. Getting a room with life and getting the sound out of that room, out of that/those instruments would be very exciting. Some of the best albums are recorded in less than optimum rooms/spaces. AKA, stairs, bathrooms, churches ...

 

[Rampant Colt]

I think that's the thing. Getting a room with life and getting the sound out of that room, out of that/those instruments would be very exciting. Some of the best albums are recorded in less than optimum rooms/spaces. AKA, stairs, bathrooms, churches ...

Here it was from 2010 or 2011. I think they were using SM58’s. I really can’t wait to get the studio cut.

 

[ecc83]

I think Remnant Colt is more interested in telling us what a great musician he is and how busy- busy at teaching music.
I have had enough of the willy waving.

Dave.

 

[60's guy]

I think Remnant Colt is more interested in telling us what a great musician he is and how busy- busy at teaching music.
I have had enough of the willy waving.

Dave.

Remnant Colt? Seriously, how low can you possibly go, Dave?

As the title suggests, I am just getting into home recording. It’s been quite the journey reading, watching, etc. over the past few months. I’ve recorded many times in pro studios so I know some of the things to be aware of.

Scott has been willing to share details about his journey leading up to his finally getting into recording at home. His story is an interesting story and he most certainly deserves more respect than he has been afforded here.

 

[Slouching Raymond]

Take a look at the link on his newbies post. There's a load of tracks there.
To have a long career in music takes some doing, with some good and bad luck along the way.
Getting your own recording space together is a smart move.
I want to see how he goes.

 

[ecc83]

Remnant Colt? Seriously, how low can you possibly go, Dave?

Scott has been willing to share details about his journey leading up to his finally getting into recording at home. His story is an interesting story and he most certainly deserves more respect than he has been afforded here.

I have known some very clever and talented people over my long life and I can say that the REALLY clever and talented ones have been very nice folk and very dismissive of their own achievements. Maybe it is a cultural/transatlantic thing?

Dave.(sorry about the typo...old. lots of meds y'know!)

 

[Papanate]

The most talented people I've met were all over the map - EVH was to say the least an Asshole - but he wasn't mean - just very off putting- James Taylor was a whole mixed bag of attitudes and non trusting behavior not cool to hang with - Jon Anderson was a space case involved in his own universe - still cool to hang with - the thing is most of the really talented people I've interacted with have huge character flaws - it comes with the territory - heck I've got huge character flaws but sadly only half the talent - but I've also noticed with many of the truly talented - is stardom is the last thing they are interested in - they struggle to be themselves and generally have a hard time explaining things to anyone but their best friends.