D
dalley
New member
With these things going for $99 on MF, I am suprised PMI is still selling these things for $179 on their site.
I've been researching for a week and I just can't decide on a preamp
SRR
New member
Ooops, as of two or three days ago they still had VTB-1's there, sorry. Their B-Stock I think were trade show demos and stuff like that, not sure if they are refurbbished goods or not, I think they said no refurbs, I could be wrong.
As far as the DMP3, no its not out of date. I don't have one, never heard one, never touched one. But from what I have read on forums like this, its an outstanding pre for $140-$160 or whatever it goes for. Someone that owns both the DMP3 and the VTB-1 would have to chime it here, but again from what I have read you can't really go wrong with either of them. Just different flavors of ice cream, one isn't better then the next one just different.
As far as the DMP3, no its not out of date. I don't have one, never heard one, never touched one. But from what I have read on forums like this, its an outstanding pre for $140-$160 or whatever it goes for. Someone that owns both the DMP3 and the VTB-1 would have to chime it here, but again from what I have read you can't really go wrong with either of them. Just different flavors of ice cream, one isn't better then the next one just different.
Kevin Deschwazi
Well-known member
Obsolescence isn't really an issue with analog gear. A lot of high end stuff is based on 40+ year old technology (Neve, UREI, API etc).Omniscient said:
tubedude
New member
Let me offer you what is truly the best of advice.
Take your $350 or so you were going to spend. Order an OSA API style preamp, or a Brent Averill 312a without a power supply.
Now, leave it in the box and forget you have it. When you get another $100 together, buy yourself a VTB1 to screw around with for a few months. IN the meantime, start saving up some money for a rack/power supply for whatever you bought that you have almost forgotten about now.
Then, when you are about $70 short on the power supply for your WAY-better-than-anything-thing-else-you-are-looking-at preamp, sell the VTB1 and then buy the rest. When it comes, you can thank me with naked pictures of your girlfriend or something.
I just bought a Brent Averill BAE 312a single channel with power supply, for $850 shipped directly from them. Now, if you pull that off doing it in pieces, the power supply unit for the rackmountable ones has two output jacks. Meaning, in a few months you can buy another 312a for much cheaper since you already have a power source for it.
The API has been a favorite and is still a favorite, for over 20 years. Hearing one will make you understand why. The BAE is an API design with a couple of even better modifications. HIGHLY recommended.
And trust me here... the preamps you can get for $100 are in the same league as the ones you can get for $300. Dont waste your time, but TAKE your time. Be patient. You might even run across a used one at gearslutz and knock a month off your wait. Buy smart. Money isnt free.
Think about it.
Take your $350 or so you were going to spend. Order an OSA API style preamp, or a Brent Averill 312a without a power supply.
Now, leave it in the box and forget you have it. When you get another $100 together, buy yourself a VTB1 to screw around with for a few months. IN the meantime, start saving up some money for a rack/power supply for whatever you bought that you have almost forgotten about now.
Then, when you are about $70 short on the power supply for your WAY-better-than-anything-thing-else-you-are-looking-at preamp, sell the VTB1 and then buy the rest. When it comes, you can thank me with naked pictures of your girlfriend or something.
I just bought a Brent Averill BAE 312a single channel with power supply, for $850 shipped directly from them. Now, if you pull that off doing it in pieces, the power supply unit for the rackmountable ones has two output jacks. Meaning, in a few months you can buy another 312a for much cheaper since you already have a power source for it.
The API has been a favorite and is still a favorite, for over 20 years. Hearing one will make you understand why. The BAE is an API design with a couple of even better modifications. HIGHLY recommended.
And trust me here... the preamps you can get for $100 are in the same league as the ones you can get for $300. Dont waste your time, but TAKE your time. Be patient. You might even run across a used one at gearslutz and knock a month off your wait. Buy smart. Money isnt free.
Think about it.
mrbowes
New member
or buy the VTB-1 now and wait on the OSA rack until you have the funds.
C
chris-from-ky
New member
tubedude said:
You are a genius!! I would've said spring for the RNP but, you have outwitted us all!!!!! LISTEN TO THIS PERSON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
homestudioguy
Well-known member
tubedude said:
Wise words but I think my ART GOLD MPA is a step above the $100 pres and it is now selling at $299 and the GOLD MPA with digital connectivity is now at $399
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MPAGold/
http://www.artroch.com/downloads/reviews/ART_Review_RecordiDMPA_1103.pdf
http://www.artroch.com/downloads/reviews/ART_ReviewDMPA_FuturMusicUK.pdf
Wise words nonetheless.
BG/HSG
tubedude
New member
mrbowes said:
Well, by buying a pice of it now, you kind of paint yourself into a corner that you WANT to be in, plus it solidifies your goals and keeps you from riding the fence for the next 8 months. Procrastinating may lead to never getting the gear or only getting something less.
kid klash
The original Mr. Nice Guy
SRR said:
I found out in another thread that the B-stock VTB-1 preamps for $70 are sold out.
C
chris-from-ky
New member
Hey Tubedude, How's business up your way? I've been meaning to tell you, you have a nice gear list! And I think I heard some music from the MP3 clinic that I thought you mixed well. Do you do any shopping at Mom's Music? I've been there a few times but I haven't had money whenever I've been in the store. That's probably a good thing! Well, just thought I'd say hey. You are giving good advice here. I hope they use it!!!!
tubedude
New member
WHats up bro? How far out are you? Swing up here next week for some hard core mixing sessions. Fun fun fun. I have about 18 songs to mix over the next 3 weeks before my next band shows up.
C
chris-from-ky
New member
Man, I wish I could!! I'm really busy next week. I would LOVE to come by sometime though. I'll give you a heads up when my Schedule is more agreeable. Oh, and I can make it to Louisville in about an hour. Take care, Dude!
T
Tonio
New member
tubedude, the BAE 312a's are 850 out the door at Avedis' shop? I was wanting to go for it. So he gives a discount from the sell price listed ($545 for module and 499 for rack/pwr supply) eh? Or did you have to talk him down.
T
T
C
chessrock
Banned
Most of the mic pres on your list are pretty much in the same class.
I'd just get whichever one you can get a good deal on, or that offers you the features that make the most sense to you right now. Let price and features influence your decision more than any miniscule differences there might be in relative sound quality.
.
I'd just get whichever one you can get a good deal on, or that offers you the features that make the most sense to you right now. Let price and features influence your decision more than any miniscule differences there might be in relative sound quality.
.
SonicAlbert
Super-Sonic "Herb" Albert
On your list I personally would take the Aphex 207 or RNP.
I recently bought a DAV BG-1 and am very happy with it, but it doesn't have DI inputs.
I recently bought a DAV BG-1 and am very happy with it, but it doesn't have DI inputs.
Jburn34
New member
The advice about the BA API module is not bad. You can beat API or Brent Averill.
I can't believe no one has mentioned the Groove Tubes Brick! I've tried all the pre's in the original post except the symetrix. The only two I would consider would be the MP20 (especially with a transformer swap) and the Brick. Honestly, the only one out of all of those you will see in most pro studios would be the Brick. It is an excellent DI and a dang good pre for the price. My private studio has had Avalon, API, Neve at times, a ViPRE, to name a few, and the GT Brick has ALWAYS found a use. Plus it is built like a tank. For your apps it sounds perfect...definitely consider it. The Brick blows the VTB1 and similar pre's (IMO most pre's under $1000) out of the water.
The M-audio DMP3 is a very decent pre also, and you do get two channels. It does not have the richness or build quality of the Brick but it does not suck for the money. Many of the other pre's that are being mentioned are not worth it. The only reason I would not get the Brick at that price was if I wanted stereo...I would get a MP20 and at some point consider putting different transformers in there...but it's decent with the existing ones.
Another thing to consider is that you can absolutely not beat the customer service at Groove Tubes or at Presonus. If you need some contacts I will email you some people to call there.
I can't believe no one has mentioned the Groove Tubes Brick! I've tried all the pre's in the original post except the symetrix. The only two I would consider would be the MP20 (especially with a transformer swap) and the Brick. Honestly, the only one out of all of those you will see in most pro studios would be the Brick. It is an excellent DI and a dang good pre for the price. My private studio has had Avalon, API, Neve at times, a ViPRE, to name a few, and the GT Brick has ALWAYS found a use. Plus it is built like a tank. For your apps it sounds perfect...definitely consider it. The Brick blows the VTB1 and similar pre's (IMO most pre's under $1000) out of the water.
The M-audio DMP3 is a very decent pre also, and you do get two channels. It does not have the richness or build quality of the Brick but it does not suck for the money. Many of the other pre's that are being mentioned are not worth it. The only reason I would not get the Brick at that price was if I wanted stereo...I would get a MP20 and at some point consider putting different transformers in there...but it's decent with the existing ones.
Another thing to consider is that you can absolutely not beat the customer service at Groove Tubes or at Presonus. If you need some contacts I will email you some people to call there.
T
tweaknstein
New member
preamps
The cheapest great sounding mic pre is made by SYTEK. I forgot the model but its 4 channels of neotek recording console mic pre's with jensen transformers.theyonly have gain knob, phantom switch, and phaseswitch for each chanel. They don't have tubes but the jensen transformers sound better than a knock off tube mic pre. I am convinced that any mic pre with a 12ax7 is junk. The manufactures put them in there because they light up and look cool. To bad they don't sound good but they sure look cool. In 2000 I found a sytek for 350. 12ax7 di's sound horriable too. the radial di's sound sweet for 100 bucks again they have jensen transformers.
The cheapest great sounding mic pre is made by SYTEK. I forgot the model but its 4 channels of neotek recording console mic pre's with jensen transformers.theyonly have gain knob, phantom switch, and phaseswitch for each chanel. They don't have tubes but the jensen transformers sound better than a knock off tube mic pre. I am convinced that any mic pre with a 12ax7 is junk. The manufactures put them in there because they light up and look cool. To bad they don't sound good but they sure look cool. In 2000 I found a sytek for 350. 12ax7 di's sound horriable too. the radial di's sound sweet for 100 bucks again they have jensen transformers.
pohaku
New member
Um, lots of high end and otherwise respectable tube mic pres use 12ax7s, so I don't think you can use them as any kind of indicia of quality. They are pretty standard preamp tubes. For example, Summit MPC 100A, Peavey VMP-2, UA 610, and Pendulum MDP-1 all use them. The Groove Tubes Ditto DI box also uses one. I'm sure there are many others.
E
earworm
New member
yeah, buy cheap, record cheap, upgrade, sell, buy more expensive, record for a higher price......thats how i do it...every six months i kinda upgrade
C
chris-from-ky
New member
DON'T BUY CHEAP!!!!!!!!!!!! Spending more on "quality" in the beginning will only benefit you! I know this first hand. I bought cheap three years ago and I haven't had the money to upgrade and EVERYTHING I bought (minus my hd24) has lost nearly all resell value. You buy cheap now, you might as well plan to give the crap away once you realize it's crap and you're ready to upgrade. THINK ABOUT IT!!!!!! If you can make better sounding music for yourself and any clients you pick up, that will be the power for progress. They'll tell their buddies about you and you'll get more business. If your recordings suck, they'll have to pay the first time and then go elsewhere with their business and not speak highly of you or your abilities. Listen to reason!!!!!! Don't be so bold as to say, "I can take this low-end crap and make decent music." Crap gear makes crap records regardless of your skill level. Decent gear (that being the BA312's, RNP, Sytek, and up) makes decent recordings (if you got the skills) and great gear (Neve and the like) makes great recordings (again skills required). You've got to understand how much better off you'll be for making a sound investment from the start. You wouldn't invest in lousy stocks hoping they at least let you break even till you get more money to go after better investments. You go for the better investments at the beginning because those investments have proven themselves to be money makers. SEE THE POINT HERE??????? DON'T BE DECEIVED!!!!!!! BUY BETTER QUALITY FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!