It just cracks me up....

  • Thread starter Thread starter Blue Bear Sound
  • Start date Start date
Blue Bear Sound said:
What started me on this was seeing a few threads where someone mentions using analog to get that "non-digital" sound, but they're talking about PortaStudio-type analog!!!

And THAT is what cracked me up!

:eek:

You mean the Fostex X-18 portastudio I bought in 1994 is NOT considered high end analog!?
 
Shockadelica said:
You mean the Fostex X-18 portastudio I bought in 1994 is NOT considered high end analog!?
Exactly my point........ many people DO attribute desirable analog characteristics to ANY analog unit, regardless of its quality or not....
 
Bruce, sometime, go and track a guitar to any digital, then to a cassette deck. Do the best you can do at matching record/playback levels.

Explain the differences you hear aside from some tape hiss.

Ed
 
M.Brane said:

As a "bit on the side" for people who read that thread, someone in there questions Rupert Neve's marbles when he stated in an interview that "CD quality sound encourages violence".
In stating this Rupert was entirely correct.
Extensive tests were done in the late '60's regarding the human response to frequencies. These tests were mainly undertaken by professors at Utrecht University in the Netherlands. I took part in these test and the results were mind boggeling.
Certain frequencies invoke certain responses, and the ones of aggression are centered at midrange frequencies, sensual ones at low frequencies and those which make you feel relaxed and content are very high frequencies.

Subsequent to the results of the tests we experemented with them at live gigs. With a large 5 way crossover PA system where the lowest frequencies were transmitted via 20-68Hz W bins and the highs through special tweeter and Quad amps, as well as an all analogue signal path, this was easy to do. These test proved the study's findings beyond any doubt.
I know Rupert did get those test results as well.
We stopped co-operating with the tests when we learned the results were destined for the military.
It so happens that CD quality does not allow for any of the "good" frequencies, and so leaves a predominance of those frequencies which encourage feelings of aggression.
 
Whatever, low frequencies don't make me feel "sensual", it just makes me need to shit! :D

Sorry :)
 
What gets me though:

Forget about recording for a second... Most acoustic instruments reside in your "midrange", and a lot sure don't leave an agressive feeling... :confused:
 
Whatever. A good classical recording can be relaxing, whether heard through tape, CD, vinyl, live, whatever.
 
Do you know that listening to piece with 30Hz boosted in particular dB will increase your sexual libido ? :)
 
What I read here is a bunch of morons who underestimate the power of sound, and the ears ability to hear minute detail.

Now you guys mock THREE fucking professional engineers. This is rich!

If you all want to get the final "digital vs analog" test results, record something simple to both, and don't tell your woman (assuming most of you geeks even HAVE a woman...;)) what you are doing, and just ask them which they like better. It would be best that you capture the same performance, so you need to "mult" at a patchbay (oh wait! most around can't afford fucking patchbays that can mult!!!) Try your best to achieve similar levels, and in the analog end, strive to achieve the best signal to noise ratio.

I can tell you that most women I have done similar tests on will pick analog every time! I had a woman once who could pick out all analog tracked, all digital tracked, and analog tracked transferred to digital versions of songs. I was astounded that she could pick this shit out from samplings of music she had never in her life had heard.

I have tried lately to go gentle or to not respond on this board when complete stupidity get's posted. I don't expect even some of the "semi pro" engineers around here to have studied sound that much. I certainly don't expect most of the "hobbiest's" to go much farther than this board for info. I EXPECT to read rediculous, uninformed, statements based upon experience that is limited to a Roland VS unit, or a Delta 1010 card and some Mackie pre's and a Studio Projects mics. I EXPECT that most around here have had little dealings with "the real deal" type of gear. But where I start getting very pissed is when people who cannot achieve a setup with a noise floor of any better than MAYBE 60dB, and do the bulk of their audio is rooms that I wouldn't even enjoy LISTENING to a mix start saying that certain people are full of shit, of that people who have been around the block a few times in product developement (I only have a "few" clues about the products sjoko2 has worked on....these are products you KNOW and RESPECT..but he won't let on..neither will I at his request) and everybody with an opinion that is worth less than their asshole starts crying "bullshit!".

I am seeing posts by people that claim Ozone is a "professional" mastering solution, capable of "outstanding results". The same camp that thinks the world of Waves DirectX plugins (with their 341 samples of latency at 48KHz! and mangled leading edges on the waveform when they aren't even setup to do ANYTHING...). I am seeing the same people who think a fucking Sampson amp is "pro", and that a Delta 1010 is a "pro" converter.

You know what guys? Most of you forgot what great audio sounds like! Point fucking blank, you are all firmly entrenched in suckass audio. You are listening to all the wrong things. I think most of you just don't even know WHAT to listen for, nor have a clue about what some of us are even talking about, much less what we are listening for.

You same guys who claim all this crap gear is so "capable" are the same one's who start in on the ol' "why don't I get the same "depth" and "warmth" as big time recordings?" and the like. It is basically pathetic. It is not JUST the gear, it is your limited experience hearing anything that actually sounds good! But here you go discounting what professionals, LONG TERM professionals in the field say about audio.

:rolleyes:

Long before I ever read anything ol' Rubert had to say about higher sampling rates, I had discussions on this board about how I felt the audio just sounded more "natural" at higher sampling rates. Everyone argued that higher bit depth was the key. Great, now you all have "supposed" 24 bit capabilities in your garbage gear. You know what? The mp3's I am hearing don't sound 8 bits better!

Maybe I am just too cynical these days reading this crap on these boards! Oh well, I read your guys crap, you can read a little of mine now. Mock what professionals who have worked in this field (some of who have worked in this field than some of you who mock them have been alive!) if you will. You lose my respect (I know, like you care...)

Digital sucks ass. The "good" digital is as out of your price range as the supposed "good" analog is. Given the lower end choices, I will pick most analog any day of the week. Most chicks agree! :)

Ed
 
DAMN Ed!!!

cant really argue with any of this, but...harsh like sweetnubs...oh well its whats inside the package that counts...

before everyone gets pissed off and launches the anti Ed volleys, take his rant for what its worth, each bit is a new way to look at exactly what you're doing. This is related to all the Studio Bashing that goes on around here. The emporer's clothes and all that

I do got a minor point to make. The woman test is a great one, gotta try it. But I got another woman test which may be just as important.

Give a band that cant sing/play for shit 1000 bucks to spend on a song. Have them go to a top end place using ONLY analog for 150 an hour and a low end place running mid level digital gearfor 35 an hour

after them sucking ass all thru it and at the hi end place only having time to try and bury bad parts as oposed to being able to fix them ( maybe a FEW punches here and there ), as opposed to editing an almost acceptable performance at the low end place with all the extra time

ask the woman which one she likes better

digital may suck compared to analog, but in the end its the performance that matters more, and performances of crap bands today need the shit edited out of them. Of course you can edit analog too, digitally even
 
sonusman said:
Bruce, sometime, go and track a guitar to any digital, then to a cassette deck. Do the best you can do at matching record/playback levels.

Explain the differences you hear aside from some tape hiss.

Ed
Ed,

I've done plenty of tracking to PortaStudios -- been there - squeezed a lot out of them.... I'm not talking about a single track.... try tracking a drum kit with a PortaStudio and see how much clarity/depth/responsiveness you'd get! :eek:

(I know you know this is true...) ;)


Hell, I've even used a cheap-ass casssette deck as an effect lately - to change a rather strident piano sample into something lower-fi but more usable - but that's a far cry from rookies here claiming that "analog is analog, at whatever price", or that "all you have to do to make digital palatable is run it through a PortaStudio"?!?!?! Crimony -- the crappy pres alone in those things could be used as distortion pedals! That's not the way to "good sound"!!! ;)

This thread got unhitched somewhere - but my (only) point still is... all analog is not created equal... (same goes for digital....).... and just because the format is "some" type of analog doesn't automatically make it warmer/better/superior for recording purposes.

BTW, I have missed those famous rants of yours!!! Nice to see them again...........! ;)
 
junplugged said:
isn't this HOMErecording bbs?

How about homeRECORDING bbs ?
You can emphasize what you want but "Home" has really little to do with improving your sound or knowledge. If you want to improve your chops go to www.Homemusician.bbs
If you want to improve your home go to www.homedecorating.com
This place is for all kinds. Thats what makes it interesting.
 
"but that's a far cry from rookies here claiming that "analog is analog, at whatever price","

Waitaminnit! Analog IS analog at any price. A portastudio is indeed analog. I don't think I've heard anyone claim that a porta2 sounds as good as an Otari 24 track.
 
Holy flying bannana dung batman, what was that all about?

In case you were getting your panties in a wad over my post (not sure, I couldn't really identify who that was directed at), my point was that "high frequencies cause relaxation, low frequencies are sensual" is a gross oversimplification.

I do not doubt the validity of such lab results. What I was trying to say was that adding low frequencies to Korn doesn't make it any more sensual than capturing all the high frequency shrillness of fingernails on a chalkboard will make you relaxed. There's more to it than that... namely, the music.

-Dick
 
But Blue is talking about analog in the sense of what people mean when they say "analog"!

Yoy know... "Analog" = "Big, Warm, Fuzzy Feeling"! :rolleyes:
 
jake-owa said:
"but that's a far cry from rookies here claiming that "analog is analog, at whatever price","

Waitaminnit! Analog IS analog at any price. A portastudio is indeed analog. I don't think I've heard anyone claim that a porta2 sounds as good as an Otari 24 track.
Gimme a fuckin break, Jake -- you KNOW what I mean, you're not that stupid........ :rolleyes:
 
This whole thread is stupid. I believe that the "analog" YOU are referring to exists in all forms of analog, true to different degrees but it does have that analog sound. Why bash anyone from your very high horse Bruce? Don't justify it. Who cares what you are sick of? Not me.
 
If you don't care....

...then why bother to post anything at all to this thread?

And why don't you read --- I never said I was "sick" of anything, what I posted was "it cracks me up"...........

big fuckin' yikes............ :rolleyes:
 
I didn't say you said that verbatim. It sure sounds like you are suggesting in that direction.

Who cares what cracks you up...is that better?

Still..not me.

I post so that some kid with a portastudio doesn't get disheartened by message you are giving, intentionally or not. Analog sounds natural, 2", 1/4", wire recorder or fucking tinfoil drum. If you are such a pro why not let people think what they want? I'll tell you why: because you get a kick out of being a big-shot here. It's like when I was 19 years old and I would hang out at the mall and wait for highschool kids get out of class just so I could steal their girlfriends.

So I post because I want those kids to know that it doesn't matter what some jerk says about the way they do things.
 
And I will continue to post MY OPINION ---- especially to trash a lot of the nonsense I see being posted........

Don't like it?? THEN DON'T FUCKIN' READ IT.............

Might I suggest you stick to posting in the Cave instead....

:rolleyes:
 
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