I know a lot of you do mastering or have paid for mastering...

[foreverdown]

So what do you think is the price range I'd be looking at for mastering on the following project? Also, do you think I'd be better off mastering it myself with plugins? (I can get to the waves diamond bundle at school)

For the most part it is Acoustic Guitar and one male vocalist. There will be a few parts with harmonies, and some sections with backup guitar parts. Some small percussion (shakers, claps, etc) stuff very rarely and some subtle bass on a few tracks. String synth on a few tracks as well. There will be 10-12 tracks. I'm not looking for dead on price, but maybe a range to consider and then also do you think I should master it myself at school with waves? Since its just acoustic guitar and vocals for the most part I'm sure it won't require near as much work as a full band.

Any help is appreciated. And recommendations are welcome.

 

[ryanlikestorock]

Mastering yourself may seem like a good idea but you will regret it. Maybe not right away, but a year from now... you'll look back on the project and think it sounds horrible. My first "mastering" project (which was thankfully my own material) was horrible. If this CD means anything to you, don't do it!

Get it mastered, then do what you can with the Waves plugins to match what was done in mastering... just for your own interest. See how close you can come.

BTW: The acoustic/singer albums are always harder than the full band in my opinion.

 

[Massive Master]

That's a rough one... If you have *truly* great monitoring at the school also (I don't mean 824's, NS10's, etc. - No "studio monitors") along with a good monitoring environment and you feel that you can distance yourself from the project, it might be worth a shot. You can always change your mind.

(A) If the project "really counts" (for release, a label, etc.) have it done by a specialist.

(B) If they *don't* have excellent monitoring in a room that you can acclimate yourself to very quickly, have ti done by a specialist.

(C) If you can't hear the project objectively, have it done by a specialist.

I agree with RyanLTR - A simple acoustic recording can be much more painstaking than a full boat. There aren't the distractions that you have with an active band or even a symphonic recording. I know that sounds strange, but when the "field" doesn't actively change, the field has to be really great.

 

[masteringhouse]

I agree with John and Ryan's points except for the point that a vocalist/guitarist setup is more difficult to master than a full band. It's not so much the style that makes things difficult, it's when tracks aren't mixed so that they sound cohesive.

For example, let's say that you have a mix where the overheads in a full band setup are very sibilant while the guitar is very high-mid oriented and everything else is dull or all over the place. It's going to be difficult to find a compromise that sounds good across the full range for this. Now take a vocal/guitar setup where one or the other thing is askew, say sibilant vocals. You have a much better chance of correcting this through a de-esser without it interfering with the guitar.

I'm currently working on a female vocal/guitar album. It was recorded well, but I'm not sold the the mid of the guitar. This is where things get a bit more difficult with a solo project as there's going to be a compromise on both the vocal and guitar. Since it's more "naked" than a full band I suppose this is the issue that John and Ryan are referring to.

 

[ryanlikestorock]

The nakedness is exactly what I'm talking about.

 

[masteringhouse]

The nakedness is exactly what I'm talking about.

Nothing worse than a hairy butt poking it's way out of mix. Now where is the plug-in to put pants on that puppy?

 

[distortedrumble]

i agree with everyone else...have it mastered by someone else....if not for anything, then maybe for the fact that if you come back a year from now and hate it...you can always claim it sounded better but the mastering guy messed it up.....granted this wont be true but most people outside of musicians and engineers wont know any better.

 

[masteringhouse]

i agree with everyone else...have it mastered by someone else....if not for anything, then maybe for the fact that if you come back a year from now and hate it...you can always claim it sounded better but the mastering guy messed it up.....granted this wont be true but most people outside of musicians and engineers wont know any better.

I always blame the guy who mixed it ...

 

[distortedrumble]

LOL...oh yeah you could always say you had it sent off to be mixed

 

[distortedrumble]

hey tom, have you ever sent someone's tracks back to them and asked them if they are sure they want to spend the money on a song being mastered that sounds that bad?

 

[foreverdown]

So how much am I looking to spend on a mastering job? and where should I Start looking for places to have it done. Thanks for all of the input guys!

 

[Massive Master]

I might know a place..

Same with Tom...

 

[masteringhouse]

hey tom, have you ever sent someone's tracks back to them and asked them if they are sure they want to spend the money on a song being mastered that sounds that bad?

Actually I have refused jobs that I felt would be a waste of money for the client and would be a project that I feel I would not want to be associated with.

Usually I ask if the the mix can be re-done first, and explain my reasons if the music is good. If it's crappy music in addition to sounding bad I just refuse the job in the most politically correct way I can think of.

 

[masteringhouse]

I might know a place..

Same with Tom...

Yes, John is very good. I would go with him.

 

[ecktronic]

I dont really think that the mix is very good. The guitar sound is bland and thin. The vocals could be thicker and warmer. I would record it again before spending money on pro mastering. Mastering your self is pretty hard to do without alot of experience. (sorry if im loosing some people business, just being honest!)
Record the guitar with more mics and choose your room and floor very carefully. Try wooden floors, carpet floors, medium sized paded/unpaded room, small size paded/unpaded room. Just try out different rooms. I would say that an acoustic guitar wants a good stereo field however you do it be it double tracking or double/triple micing or both. And brilliant acoustics room ambience. I suppose with the right plug ins you might get a good sound. Love the 50 cent rip!!

 

[masteringhouse]

Yes, John is very good. I would go with him.

Before my dry sense of humor gets lost on anyone, this comment has nothing to do with the mix in this thread.

Both John (and I) I feel are reputable mastering engineers (as opposed to some folks who claim to master a song for $10). Each engineer brings their perspective to a project, some may be more in-line with your vision than others. And you can only decide that by listening.

We both offer an evaluation that I would suggest you take advantage of in order to hear which treatment you prefer. This practice is fairly common with the major record labels, with the exception that they are often paid a good price for the evaluation even if they get the job or not. The fact that John and I are willing to spend time out of pocket speaks volumes in regards to our interests in presenting the highest quality service at a reasonable cost. Might as well take advantage of it.

In regards to the price for mastering, in my opinion you should pick an engineer that is going to give you the results that you want, not necessarily the cheapest. You aren't going to get good reviews about your CD with comments like "sounds like crap, but it only cost him $50 to master it!"

Prices for mastering can range from $10/song to $500 (or more) per hour depending on who you get. For a mid-level project I would assume somewhere in the range of $400 to $500 for a complete CD (10-15 songs).

 

[distortedrumble]

i think some people save face and buy mastering for dummies software(s) because they know their stuff sucks bad enough to be rejected by any reputable mastering engineer lol.

 

[foreverdown]

I dont really think that the mix is very good. The guitar sound is bland and thin. The vocals could be thicker and warmer. I would record it again before spending money on pro mastering. Mastering your self is pretty hard to do without alot of experience. (sorry if im loosing some people business, just being honest!)
Record the guitar with more mics and choose your room and floor very carefully. Try wooden floors, carpet floors, medium sized paded/unpaded room, small size paded/unpaded room. Just try out different rooms. I would say that an acoustic guitar wants a good stereo field however you do it be it double tracking or double/triple micing or both. And brilliant acoustics room ambience. I suppose with the right plug ins you might get a good sound. Love the 50 cent rip!!

Heh well the tunes you heard are not what I will be putting on the record. I assume you went to my pv site. Those are old recordings, so they don't exactly apply here. Anywho thanks for the input

 

[foreverdown]

Many of you talk about the engineer, well that's me. I am recording this album by myself. I have an SM57, Studio Projects C1, Shure KSM 44, and an AKG 414 to work with. I am running all of that into Cubase. My recording space is my closet. I have some foam up in there pluse some clothes hanging so I got rid of the reverb. I have the ever so popular wharfedale monitors... an M-Audio DMP3 for my preamp, and the guitar I am using to record with is a Yamaha Compass Series. So I'll be using all of that to record this CD and I will be mixing it myself. I have a few friends that I Am going to send some songs to and have them do their take on a mix for it. So I hope that I can get a good enough mix to be mastered because I sure can't afford 200 bucks per song to have it mixed. I will be posting my mixes here at the BBS to get opinions and suggestions on the mix before I have it mastered so hopefully it will turn out quite well.

--Casey

 

[Massive Master]

These have probably been revisited a hundred times here, but...

• Stay in 24-bit
• HEADROOM is your friend. -6dBfs PEAKS are just fine - Tracking AND mixing. Leave the M.E. some room to work, and your mix some room to breathe.
• Don't feel a rush to "use all the bits" just to make it loud.
• Don't strap a limiter across the master buss. If certain tracks are causing nasty errant peaks, limit or compress those tracks if neccessary.
• Change volume levels frequently during mixing. Try to keep an "anchor" at around 85dB or so, but go louder and quieter here and there. Stay on the lookout for things that "jump out" of the mix at these levels.