Confused about audio setup (mic+piano/keyboard)

[marto]

Hey so I wanna start recording myself singing and playing the piano(digital). I looked at many videos but I'm still a little confused.Ideally I also want to hear the sounds live through my headset while I'm recording (so that the piano's sound doesn't go through my mic i.e. the piano's speakers are off).
What I have:

• YAMAHA PSR E373 keyboard
• USB A to USB B cable
• 6.3 mm male to 3.5mm jack socket
• I intend on (probably) getting the MA 67 microphone (requires phantom power)

Now I believe I need an audio interface and an xlr cable to connect that mic to the pc right? Should I then also connect my keyboard to the interface (if so, how?) or is it gonna work if i just connect it to my PC with the USB A to B cable?
Thanks in advance

 

[Folkcafe]

Where to start?

Keyboard I suppose. The USB jack is dual mode. It can either be used to transfer and backup files and if set properly, it can send and receive midi information. So this connection isn't going to transmit audio to your computer. You'll have to decide if you want to use a virtual instrument in your recording software to record midi, or plan on having an input on this yet to be decided interface for the keyboard.

Now interface? Recording the keyboard stereo or mono? Stereo keyboard plus vocal mic is 3 inputs. So a 4 input interface unless you record the keyboard mono.

You don't mention software, so I'll leave that as an open question. The more you respond, the more information you are going to get. It's an ask and answer format and the more you respond, the more your questions can be flushed out.

 

[marto]

Where to start?

Keyboard I suppose. The USB jack is dual mode. It can either be used to transfer and backup files and if set properly, it can send and receive midi information. So this connection isn't going to transmit audio to your computer. You'll have to decide if you want to use a virtual instrument in your recording software to record midi, or plan on having an input on this yet to be decided interface for the keyboard.

Now interface? Recording the keyboard stereo or mono? Stereo keyboard plus vocal mic is 3 inputs. So a 4 input interface unless you record the keyboard mono.

You don't mention software, so I'll leave that as an open question. The more you respond, the more information you are going to get. It's an ask and answer format and the more you respond, the more your questions can be flushed out.

You spoke of having an input for the keyboard on the interface, but what kind of input would that have to be? Assuming I'm fine with mono, could I use the USB cable for that?

 

[Folkcafe]

You spoke of having an input for the keyboard on the interface, but what kind of input would that have to be? Assuming I'm fine with mono, could I use the USB cable for that?

Not without some sort of audio interface. To reiterate, the USB of the keyboard will not transmit audio.

For audio, the back of your keyboard only has a headphone out and would have to use this to capture the direct audio from your keyboard. This is a left and right output. Mono would mean picking one or the other which if the instrument is outputting stereo, it could be a little odd sounding. You'd need a cable to split the headphone output to two 1/4 jacks but only use one into the interface. Other option is a small mixer to mix L&R to mono to go into one channel of the interface.

What software are you planning to use and how familiar are you with it?

 

[rob aylestone]

The USB cable is to get note data in and out of your keyboard to a DAW - Reaper, Cubase, that kind of thing. Your keyboard's audio ONLY comes out of that ¼" jack on the back, so if you really want to record the sound the keyboard produces as audio, then it will be a jack to jack cable into the interface - most have combi connectors - an XLR for mic or ¼" for keyboards, synths or guitars. A two channel interface gives you the other for a mic - stuff on a pair of headphones and set up your DAW to record the two channels, and away you go.

The Yamaha, in the PSR range is not noted for all it's sounds - and your DAW might be able to do better - as in some of the free piano samples available now. The USB cable gets the note data into the computer where the yamaha piano sounds becomes something even beter. That's maybe for the future. Most simple 2 channel interfaces will do what you want. The 3.5mm socket is an input, I doubt you'll need to even use that. Headphones will go into the audio interface which you have to buy as the mic has to plug into something!

 

[Papanate]

Hey so I wanna start recording myself singing and playing the piano(digital). I looked at many videos but I'm still a little confused.Ideally I also want to hear the sounds live through my headset while I'm recording (so that the piano's sound doesn't go through my mic i.e. the piano's speakers are off).
What I have:

• YAMAHA PSR E373 keyboard
• USB A to USB B cable
• 6.3 mm male to 3.5mm jack socket
• I intend on (probably) getting the MA 67 microphone (requires phantom power)

Now I believe I need an audio interface and an xlr cable to connect that mic to the pc right? Should I then also connect my keyboard to the interface (if so, how?) or is it gonna work if i just connect it to my PC with the USB A to B cable?
Thanks in advance

Yamaha > 1/4” Jack to 1/4” Jack - Audio Interface - Computer - DAW.
That way the Computer/DAW will record the Audio of the Yamaha.
or
Yamaha > USB Cable > Computer > DAW Midi Record - out to Yamaha
That way the Yamaha will transmit MIDI to be recorded in the DAW - and the DAW
Will Playback the Midi Track into the Yamaha

MA 67 > XLR > Audio Interface > Computer

Comuter - DAW - Record Mode - HeadPhones -

Then do what you want.

 

[TalismanRich]

The USB output is ONLY going to provide midi data, so you would need a virtual instrument to be triggered. It does not transfer audio data.

For that, you would need to use the headphone jack out of the Yamaha with something like a stereo plug to two RCA or 1/4" jacks, which is what most audio interfaces have. That would give you the actual audio from the Yamaha. You would need to be careful that you didn't have too much volume on the output so as not to overload the input and distort.

 

[TalismanRich]

I was looking at this review of the ES373 and apparently is does have the ability to send audio to a DAW like an interface. Look at the section on Connectivity. However, this will limit your ability to use another interface for the microphone, unless you are using a Mac and configure for multiple devices. This doesn't work for a Windows PC. You will probably need to use the Steinberg driver that Yamaha provides on their site.

Yamaha PSR-E373 | EW-310 Review: A Much Anticipated Upgrade

Yamaha’s PSR-series is primarily an arranger keyboard line, but it is most well-known for its budget options. If you’ve ever checked out beginner keyboard recommendations, you’ve probably heard of the PSR-E363 or PSR-E353, which are

www.pianodreamers.com

 

[Folkcafe]

I was looking at this review of the ES373 and apparently is does have the ability to send audio to a DAW like an interface. Look at the section on Connectivity. However, this will limit your ability to use another interface for the microphone, unless you are using a Mac and configure for multiple devices. This doesn't work for a Windows PC. You will probably need to use the Steinberg driver that Yamaha provides on their site.

Yamaha PSR-E373 | EW-310 Review: A Much Anticipated Upgrade

Yamaha’s PSR-series is primarily an arranger keyboard line, but it is most well-known for its budget options. If you’ve ever checked out beginner keyboard recommendations, you’ve probably heard of the PSR-E363 or PSR-E353, which are

www.pianodreamers.com

Didn't see that in the manual but here it is. If the OP has a Mac, you can create a aggregate device. PC you can only have one interface which would either be keyboard or audio interface but not both.

 

[TalismanRich]

Barring the use of the headphone out, the OP can always record the keyboard first and then in his DAW, record the vocals. That's what DAWs are great at doing! Then you can concentrate on getting the vocals perfect without having to redo the whole song a dozen times when you screw up! (not that any of us have ever screwed up a take...) ?

 

[rob aylestone]

That's actually quite neat! Still need the interface sadly for the mic - but this could be a useful feature for some of the unique sounds you can't recreate in the computer.

 

[marto]

Thank you so much guys?, it's crazy how much better I understand it now.
I think imma do it like TalismanRich said. Record the piano first and then the vocals. I definitely don't have the skills to do both simultaneously anyway.

So now I just gotta buy my mic and audio interface. Is there an interface you could recommend that isn't too expensive? I suppose I only need one input for the mic.

 

[rob aylestone]

There are lots - but even the cheap Behringers are quite nice. My advice would be to NOT buy a single input one - two is always more use later. After all, if you are on a PC, you won't easily (if at all) be able to run an interface and the keyboard acting as one - so one day, you might want to play and sing - or record in stereo from an old CD player or whatever. The two channel ones are just more future proof. My favourite budget ones at the moment are
Behringer U-Phoria UMC22 and
Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 3rd Gen

In fairness, most around this price are pretty decent.

 

[Folkcafe]

You haven't mentioned what software you plan on using to record with. I would contend that it is the first question you answer before getting anything else. Ultimately you are going to be doing the work on the computer. Your picks are going to be free, bundled or will have to purchase something. Many of the free version have useful features disabled and are only available in the paid versions. As a keyboard player, you'll at least want to be able to use virtual instruments. Presonus Studio One for instance, has a free version but will not support VST plugins.

Most interfaces often comes with a light version of some sort of recording software. Which is important. Many come with Ableton Lite. It's a program that is used in producing Beats and Hip Hop. It has a less than intuitive interface and a steep learning curve. I know, I use it (long story). The Behringer is a good piece of hardware but comes with a software package called Traction. Not going to find any users here and probably elsewhere for much help. Some others come with Cubase LE or now Cubase AI. Track limited but full featured.

In considering pricing, also add any software you are going to have to purchase if what you want, isn't bundled with it. One advantage to some of these light version is that there are options to upgrade later at a discount. I've done this multiple times with a few. Reaper gets a lot of great reviews here. License is $60. I tried the demo but ultimately ended up with something else. Nothing wrong with it, I just liked other packages better.

So back to the first paragraph and an earlier question on software. One suggestion would be to take a look at a few tutorial videos of the one you are considering or perhaps what comes bundled. See if it makes sense to you. What works for me, might not for you.

If on a Mac, it comes with GarageBand and you can graduate to Logic Pro later. Good luck and be sure to let us know how things turn out. Who knows, you might have more questions.

 

[marto]

There are lots - but even the cheap Behringers are quite nice. My advice would be to NOT buy a single input one - two is always more use later. After all, if you are on a PC, you won't easily (if at all) be able to run an interface and the keyboard acting as one - so one day, you might want to play and sing - or record in stereo from an old CD player or whatever. The two channel ones are just more future proof. My favourite budget ones at the moment are
Behringer U-Phoria UMC22 and
Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 3rd Gen

In fairness, most around this price are pretty decent.

hey thanks for the links, could you explain the price difference please? Coz I see that both have two (or four?) inputs which is great at 50 euros, but I can't afford the 111 euros one. The first one has mic and inst, and the other one has also 2 line inputs. So could I plug in four things on the second one and two things on the first one?(say a guitar and my mic?)

 

[marto]

You haven't mentioned what software you plan on using to record with. I would contend that it is the first question you answer before getting anything else. Ultimately you are going to be doing the work on the computer. Your picks are going to be free, bundled or will have to purchase something. Many of the free version have useful features disabled and are only available in the paid versions. As a keyboard player, you'll at least want to be able to use virtual instruments. Presonus Studio One for instance, has a free version but will not support VST plugins.

Most interfaces often comes with a light version of some sort of recording software. Which is important. Many come with Ableton Lite. It's a program that is used in producing Beats and Hip Hop. It has a less than intuitive interface and a steep learning curve. I know, I use it (long story). The Behringer is a good piece of hardware but comes with a software package called Traction. Not going to find any users here and probably elsewhere for much help. Some others come with Cubase LE or now Cubase AI. Track limited but full featured.

In considering pricing, also add any software you are going to have to purchase if what you want, isn't bundled with it. One advantage to some of these light version is that there are options to upgrade later at a discount. I've done this multiple times with a few. Reaper gets a lot of great reviews here. License is $60. I tried the demo but ultimately ended up with something else. Nothing wrong with it, I just liked other packages better.

So back to the first paragraph and an earlier question on software. One suggestion would be to take a look at a few tutorial videos of the one you are considering or perhaps what comes bundled. See if it makes sense to you. What works for me, might not for you.

If on a Mac, it comes with GarageBand and you can graduate to Logic Pro later. Good luck and be sure to let us know how things turn out. Who knows, you might have more questions.

oh mb for not answering the question before, I just had so much going through my brain.
I actually haven't chosen a DAW yet. I played the piano and sang for a little bit already but i'm just now starting with the production side of things so I pretty much don't know anything.

I thought audio interfaces and DAWs were two completely seperate things and I could just worry about the software after I get all the hardware. But now you made me realise that I should probably think about that now.

From what you said I suppose I best not go for the affordable Behringer then, coz I just know that a not so intuitive interface would make me give up on it all instantly. Not sure what would be the best option then ?

but wait, would reaper (or another daw) work even if it's not the one I get with the audio interface?

 

[TalismanRich]

The DAW is the computer program that does the recording/mixing, etc. The audio interface is hardware that converts your audio signal into something the computer can the put into the DAW.

RE: Reaper "demo".... there is no demo version of Reaper. What you download is exactly the same as when you register. It's not crippled in any way. It doesn't include a lot of virtual instruments, but there are quite a few free or low cost ones that work. Pretty much any VST or VST3 should work fine. It does include a long list of plug-ins, including compressors, limiters, reverbs, EQ, auto tuning, etc.

Cakewalk by Bandlab has a completely free version. They have other versions that are higher end versions, but the basic Cakewalk has unlimited tracks, instrument plug-ins and effects which will probably cover all your needs for at least a few years.

I don't know anything about the Melon Audio MA67. In fact, I had never heard of them until I Googled it. There are a ton of Chinese made mics, which may or may not sound good and be reliable. I would look at something like an AKG P120 or P220 which is probably close to the same cost. I actually like the MXL V67G for vocals. I've got one and used it for recording several vocals. You can find them anywhere from $75 to $100.

As for an interface, I agree with Folkcafe about going with at least a 2 channel interface. I would even consider a 4 input if you can save up some extra money. It just gives you options for the future. You can't really go wrong with a Scarlett 2i2. THe Universal Audio Volt 2 or the Motu M2 and M4 are also good candidates.

 

[Folkcafe]

oh mb for not answering the question before, I just had so much going through my brain.
I actually haven't chosen a DAW yet. I played the piano and sang for a little bit already but i'm just now starting with the production side of things so I pretty much don't know anything.

I thought audio interfaces and DAWs were two completely seperate things and I could just worry about the software after I get all the hardware. But now you made me realise that I should probably think about that now.

From what you said I suppose I best not go for the affordable Behringer then, coz I just know that a not so intuitive interface would make me give up on it all instantly. Not sure what would be the best option then ?

but wait, would reaper (or another daw) work even if it's not the one I get with the audio interface?

On the Behringer, just consider that it comes with a DAW nobody uses. You can use any DAW with it as most interfaces will work with almost any DAW. My advice was to consider the DAW first and if the one you like costs money, to consider it in the overall cost of getting up and running.

As to Reaper, others can explain it better than I. A license still costs money. TalismanRich can perhaps explain what 60 day Evaluation means vs 60 day Demo.

 

[TalismanRich]

I've run into "demo" versions of programs that were crippleware. Certain functions would not work. I've seen programs that would only let you record for a period of time, or would otherwise disrupt your final product. It's like some picture or video programs that put a watermark in the picture unless you register. Not using VSTs or limiting track numbers are prime examples.

With Reaper, if you don't register, it will continue to work, they simply put a startup nag screen/delay for evaluation. If you ignore it, everything still works even 6 months from now. Once you purchase a license, you get a file that you put in your Reaper folder, and the program simply launches immediately, and it says "Registered to XXXXXX". You can put it on more than one machine if you have a desktop and laptop that you use for different things. It's easily moved to a new computer without the registration headaches that you get with some other programs.

Yes, it can be as complex as you want. There are lots of capabilities and customization options. But you don't HAVE to all that stuff. You can use it for basic recording and simple mixing. Learn the basics and work with it. Expand as you need to.

 

[ecc83]

Hi Marto, you have had a great deal of good advice so far but can I IMPLORE you not to cheap out on your choice of interface!! The budget devices are er, ok but for your particular application one quality is needed that they may not have, something called "Low Latency". Latency is the inevitable delay you get between pressing a key and the interface/pc/DAW sounding the note. This will not be an issue in some situations but will in many.

To begin with the best but very expensive, "RME" make USB interfaces with the lowest latency of almost anyone. However two products can be suggested at a more reasonable cost. The MOTU M2 (M4 have 2 extra line ins and outs) and the Native Instruments Komplete Audio 6. Focusrite products have a very good name overall but I do not have direct experience of their latency capabilities.

I have had a very quick look at the user manual for that keyboard and if you haven't studied it carefully so far I suggest you do so and meantime save up for a 'proper' interface.

Dave.