"Remaster" to 44.1kHz, 16bit from 48kHz, 24bit

  • Thread starter Thread starter Daniel England
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Daniel England

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I'm currently recording all my work in 24bit 48kHz. I'll be going to 96kHz once I get my other box set-up. I'm using Sonar X1 Producer and my SonicCell. I'm using the SonicCell for mastering as well as synthesis.

I'm having trouble "remastering" (down-sampling) to 16bit, 44.1kHz because of the dynamic range and compression I'm using.

I've tried the Leveller effect from Audacity and it causes too much distortion to my ears, even on the lightest settings. I've just tried the Boost11 plugin and that's no better, really.

I'm resigned to just dropping the peak level and resampling but compared with other tracks, they just seem too quiet. Perhaps I should do specific set-ups and renders from the SonicCell for the case of 44.1kHz?

Is there any advice anyone can give?

TIA


Daniel.
 
Your thread title is kind of misleading. The problem you are having has nothing to do with sample rate conversion. It's all about how much limiting you are trying to do and possibly what you are trying to use to do the limiting.

Without hearing the original file you are trying to make louder, I can only guess why you are having a hard time. The first thing that comes to mind is your mix might just be too dynamic to be able to get as loud as commercial CD's.

The answer to that would be a remix with some of the loudest stuff a little quieter and some of the quieter stuff a little louder.

Also, if you compress the individual instruments, or groups of instruments, that can help keep everything together and not make the mastering limiter do too much work.
 
First step, stop using 48k.

You dont need to use 48k unless you are doing video (where the final file is 16bit/48khz) or use native 48k equipment like ADATs or Soundblasters.

96k is just a drain on your resources unless you record highly-dynamic orchestral groups or make DVDs and have a bazillion $ studio.

Lock everything down on 24bit/44.1khz and worry about other, more important things.
 
Hmm... I'm sorry but the higher sample rates just seem so much more clear than 44.1kHz to me. I have a problem because I can only use one sample rate through the SonicCell and I want to use the higher rates for recording. I have to resample somewhere if I'm going to put stuff on CD and I don't want 44.1kHz in my project files.

I was hoping to be able to feed the higher rate master through another process to convert it (what I mean by "remaster") and not to have to process anything with effects in Sonar and just use the SonicCell hardware effects. Thats how the higher sample rate is no drain on resources.

I'm thinking I may need to do specific 44.1kHz "renders". Using some form of mastering on a file that's already mastered just seems not to work.


Daniel.
 
I'm confused. You might be using terms in non-traditional ways or something.

Resampling from 48k to 44.1k is not going to give you any distortion or mess with your dynamic range (as far as headroom goes), the thing that will do that are the limiters like the boost 11 and leveler.

If you are taking a file that has already been processed for loudness and trying to reprocess it, you are going to screw yourself hard.

All you need to do is take the finished 48k file and either render it with no processing as a 44.1k file or get a sample rate converter and send the file through that. resampling has nothing to do with limiting or maximizing or anything else.
 
Yeah, using anything else on the mastered song just screws up.

The problem is that my tracks seem to be comming out so close to clipping that they do or would do if I resampled them. If I reduce the amplitude by say, 0.7dB and then resample, they peak at -0.0dB. I can't help but think I'm introducing noise.

I don't know if this is normal or not and I can't do anything about them comming out so close to clipping (Sonar is saying they are peaking at -0.0 but not in red, in white). The only thing I could do is try turning down the master volume.

You can see it in this track I'm asking for review on:



What kind of peak level would be normal for this?


Daniel.
 
First of all, that's already pretty loud. Since most of your energy is in the low end, it's not going to sound as loud as other music that has a lot more midrange, but meter level-wise, it's really loud.

Once you start getting between 0dbfs and -1dbfs, the meters are in the 'interpretation zone'. Depending on what criteria they are using to calculate the meter level, you can get a different result by changing the slightest thing.

Going from 24 bit to 16 bit does raise the noise floor, because that's what adding more bits does for you, it lowers the noise floor. Mind you, it's not a big deal, because you are raising the noise floor from -144dbfs to -96dbfs. It's still not loud enough to really call it 'noise', but it can certainly bump the meter level up 1/10th of a db to make the clip lights come on.

Just drop the level a db or two, do the conversion, and bump it back up to where you want it.

Or, do the sample rate conversion on the raw 24 bit file (before you do what ever you do to get the level up just below clipping) and 'master' the 44.1k 24 bit file.
 
yep, you're right about that.

another plug, for that duty...


google is your friend.
 
TimOBrien said:
First step, stop using 48k.

You dont need to use 48k unless you are doing video (where the final file is 16bit/48khz) or use native 48k equipment like ADATs or Soundblasters.

96k is just a drain on your resources unless you record highly-dynamic orchestral groups or make DVDs and have a bazillion $ studio.

Lock everything down on 24bit/44.1khz and worry about other, more important things.
Click to expand...

I only record at 48k when doing work for video too. The difference between 44.1 and 48k is pretty much inaudible. For music recording I wouldn't bother with 48k. However, 96k may be worth the move for you, but as stated it uses way more resources.
 
TimOBrien said:
96k is just a drain on your resources unless you record highly-dynamic orchestral groups
Click to expand...
Hey now... I record highly dynamic orchestras all the time.

At 44.1kHz...

Racked 'em up at 96kHz a few times, but the converters didn't sound so hot at 96kHz... Can't remember what the unit was... A Digi thing of some sort.


Sorry -- Carry on.
 
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