Tascam 388 Story...

Wait...you measured for voltage or you were able to measure voltage at pins 2 and 13? IOW with the meter set to AC volts and tone going into a channel and bussed to PGM group #1 you were able to measure voltage at pins 2 and 13?
 
Ok after 4 or 5 attempts at a simple task I think I have it.
I measured AC voltage on pins 1 & 2 but it was the same from 1-8.
I also measured the DC voltage on pin 13 and it looks
like its getting control signal.
 
but it was the same from 1-8...

Can you clarify? I don't understand what you mean by this.

Can you verify that it is your tone signal at pins 1 and 2 of U109 by first, with your tone running, ensuring that you measure AC volts at pins 1 and 2, and then shutting off the tone signal and rechecking pins 1 and 2 to confirm that you now have no AC voltage at pins 1 and 2?

Also, what DC voltage do you measure at pin 13?
 
I meant that the AC voltage I measured on pin 1 was also what I measured on pins 2-8.

I didn't think of turning the tone signal off and measuring, I'll try that.

I think it was 30v or so but I'll check again.

Thanks again for the help, the 388 is at my parent's house so I've only been able to work on it every few days.
 
30V AC??!??

Voltage shouldn't be identical on pins 1~8 of U109...and when you are talking about pins 1~8 are you saying that you measured all the pins on one side of the chip and then around to the other side? Pin 8 is on the side of the chip closest to the mixer dress panel and closest to the back of the 388. Pins 1~7 are all toward the bottom panel, pin 1 being closest to the arm rest.

I would expect pins 5, 6, 12 and 13 to be about +5V DC if anything but it would depend on the monitor mode and transport mode...pins 1, 2 and 3 should be your tone voltage in AC but man if your tone voltage is +30V AC that is, like, +32dBu...that can kill stuff. If that's what's coming off your tone generator turn it down before you fry something. 1V AC would be more like a normal tone level for diagnostics. :eek:

Pin 4 could be the same as your tone voltage...maybe...I'd have to chase that one down...I think that would only have voltage on it in PLAY mode.

Pin 7 should be about -15V DC, pin 8 shouldn't be anything unless you have tone or signal routed to PGM group 2...I'm gonna stop there.

If things keep coming back so grossly inconsistent with what should be I'm going to have to graciously bow out and advise you get in touch with a local technician. You are taking risks every time you stick a probe in there...I'm gettin' itchy.
 
Woah woah woah. Sorry, I meant 30V DC on pin 13 but when I tested again I got 14.8V DC so disregard the 30V.
Also I should've said pins 1-7 not 1-8. Don't know why I said 8.
Just tested it again and I'm getting around 0.2V AC on pins 1 and 2 when the test tone is going through. If I turn off the test tone it just reads 0.

Does this mean the problem lies elsewhere?
 
Heads relapped

I recently enlisted help from evm1024 to relap the record/reproduce heads from the block that came with my 388 as well as the block that came with my parts 388. He did a fantastic job. Hopefully we're both happy with the transaction but I can't help feeling like I came out with the better end of the deal considering I now have two relapped record/reproduce heads which is just fantastic.

Ethan left the erase heads alone as the heads themselves are ferrite which, as I now know, is brittle and can micro fracture during the lapping and leave behind a surface that can damage the tape. Not a concern to leave it alone on my heads here as both erase heads have some wear in the aluminum, but the ferrite head surfaces are great. Erase heads typically have a much larger bearing surface and therefore aren't as great a concern when it comes to wear.

The reason I needed at least one of these record/reproduce heads relapped was, as I have mentioned in the past, because the wear groove was (I believe) from 457 which was slit slightly more narrow than the tape I'm using (and want to use) which is LPR35. So because the groove was more narrow than the LPR35 the tape would ride up slightly on track...1? Or track 8...I'll have to look back, but the point is it would deflect away from the head and the effected track would have a lower output by 3~6dB's, as well as a lower record level.

Ethan took careful consideration of the fact that 388 heads are rare and therefore removed as little material as possible. In fact you can just barely see the remnant of the old wear groove...you can't feel it, but you can see it, just barely. He took it down just as far as it needed to go. His quantitative perception is that there is a relatively healthy amount of material on these heads when new and both appeared to have quite a bit left so that's great news.

Anyway, big disclaimer here, Ethan is not in the business of relapping heads. If he decides otherwise at some point I'm sure he'll let us know. This was a private transaction between two enthusiasts located in close geographic proximity. Ethan's hope is that these case studies will encourage others to give it a try. Please refer to his thread on relapping heads...remember he dove in using the Nortronics guide linked in that thread and gave it a try and put the thread up as a resource for others to try. I know I'm definitely going to be giving it a shot at some point, I'm just in a position that I wanted expediency on these heads and I want to experiment on some throw away heads first and I haven't the time resource at the moment...its a priority to have the these heads done, but it can't be a priority for me to learn at the moment. So, thank you Ethan for being willing to engage in the transaction, and even moreso for being willing to dive into this area of DIY and encourage others.

My assessment is that if you have a keen eye, and a relatively steady hand and you enjoy patient crafting then you have the aptitude to do this yourself. The whole crown-jewel of DIY is having the power to take care of your own needs as they arise...having control of the quality and the cost. Relapping is arguably a pinnacle of analog tape recorder maintenance and repair, but you can do it. It isn't magic. Yes, the well-known firms that do this work professionally have expertise in this field that I certainly can't match...its called time and experience...yes they have tools and facilities to ensure repeatable quality control and to backup their gaurantee. Nobody is trying to say they aren't worth the expense or that there isn't a good reason they charge what they charge...you bet there is, and not everybody is going to be willing to rub their precious tape heads on sandpaper! :eek: But for some it will be worth spending $20 on a half-dozen old tape scanner heads on eBay or something for practice, and maybe $20 in supplies and maybe another $20 in some basic tools to be able to learn and have the gear to relap a bunch of heads.

Okay...here's some pictures of the original block...note that these pictures all came out kind of blurry...:(

IMG_6963_28_1.JPG


IMG_6964_29_1.JPG


IMG_6965_30_1.JPG


IMG_6966_31_1.JPG



And here's a before shot:

IMG_1129_8_1.JPG



And now for some pics of the spare block...and these are kinda blurry too, and note that the wierd lines all over the face of the stack just remind me I need to wipe it with alcohol...they're not from the lapping process:

IMG_6960_25_1.JPG


IMG_6961_26_1.JPG


IMG_6962_27_1.JPG


IMG_6967_32_1.JPG



Annnnnd the before shot:

IMG_1980_2_1_1.JPG



Now...not sure when I'm going to get to it exactly, but the next step is to get back to setting this 388 up...never checked the tensions and I'll need to start over on calibrating the electronics with a relapped head in there. When I get to biasing I'll do it using my scope as advised by the folks at Tascam and then I'll report where that leaves the bias amp output voltage at so those of you without scopes using LPR35 can get your 388's in pretty close range for proper biasing of that tape as the 150mV spec'ed in the manual is likely not right for LPR35. Should work good for 457, but not LPR35.
 
So I have some LPR35 for my 388 I recently aquired.Do I need to calibrate this deck specifically for this tape? or can It just be used without a setup.
Just curious.
 
So I have some LPR35 for my 388 I recently aquired.Do I need to calibrate this deck specifically for this tape? or can It just be used without a setup. Just curious.

No, its not an issue with the operating level of the tape; the thing you are dealing with is calibrating the electronics. According to Tascam Analog support the difference in BIAS requirement is significantly different between 457 and LPR35. Usually you adjust the bias by turning up the level of the bias tone being put out by the bias amps and watching its effect on a high-frequency tone being recorded to tape, usually 10kHz or so. As the level of the bias goes up the HF tone being tracked to tape will decrease and most manuals state a certain amount of "over-bias" as the right bias level to be produced by the bias amp. Well, the 388 manual just says to measure the level of the current being produced by the bias amps and 150mV is it. But Tascam Analog Support tells me that was based on 457, and that LPR35 has a different requirement, and advised me to monitor the HF tone with a scope and set the bias level at whatever the minimum distortion level was. I haven't done that yet but I intend to and to then measure where the bias amps are at and then maybe 388 owners using LPR35 can use that figure...maybe its 175mV...maybe 250mV...I don't know. For now just follow the procedure in the manual...calibrate just like you would according to the manual and I'd say just use 150mV for now.
 
Last edited:
relapped heads look great!

I've got the same 'wimpy track 1 syndrome' using Lpr35. for now its a 7 1/2 track. i have to say i wish there was another way besides relapping to fix that track to use the Lpr35 (i bought 3 pancakes a while back).

i admit also to wishing there wasn't the biasing difference between the lpr35 & 457 - i've got about equal amounts of both tape! i guess I'll use the quantegy 457 for now so i can have a track 1... do you notice a difference in quality with material recorded on lpr35 & quantegy? or do you have the tape to test this out? maybe i'll check side by side somehow to see if i can hear any difference.

i'll be following here for your updates with all the calibration / biasing stuff - i'd love to get around to all this at some point but lack the money for tools & time for the moment - still using the 388 as my main recorder on new projects with pleasing results though!:)
 
Last edited:
update on 'wimpy track 1 syndrome'

so just after posting last, i decided to try out a bit of FF & REW with the tape lifter up in order to wear down the edge of the head and it *appears* from my brief test that i got my track one back in full force. I only did about 2 minutes tape time of this in each direction. I noticed already from regular use the oxide dust on the top edge of the tape path on the head. - I tested tone on an area that i did not FF/RW w/ tape lifter up so i guess it did actually wear down the head and not just shave off the edge of the tape.
so perhaps there's a bit of hope for these wimpy LPR35 edge tracks due to 457 grooves without a relap. i'll update if the 'syndrome' comes back, and i suppose i'll still be reserving track one for last.
 
so just after posting last, i decided to try out a bit of FF & REW with the tape lifter up in order to wear down the edge of the head and it *appears* from my brief test that i got my track one back in full force. I only did about 2 minutes tape time of this in each direction. I noticed already from regular use the oxide dust on the top edge of the tape path on the head. - I tested tone on an area that i did not FF/RW w/ tape lifter up so i guess it did actually wear down the head and not just shave off the edge of the tape.
so perhaps there's a bit of hope for these wimpy LPR35 edge tracks due to 457 grooves without a relap. i'll update if the 'syndrome' comes back, and i suppose i'll still be reserving track one for last.

LUNE, that's terrific!

Please DO post back with longer-term findings. That could be a very valuable and cost-effective tip to address this issue. I don't regret having my heads lapped but it cost more than the electricity to run the machine for 4 minutes in fast-wind! :D
 
I measured it and there's tone at pin 3 but the voltage at pin 1 is around 30V AC which seems too high to be tone. Is this right?
Thanks a bundle for the help.

Mmmmm...can you re-check that? The feedback loop on that side of that opamp is a gain of 1...the output at pin 1 should be very close to the input at pin 3. What voltage did you get at pin 3 and where are you grounding your meter (where is the black probe)?

Are you sure you are getting the probes in the right places and that you are certain of what pin is what on U113?
 
I have...

I have a brand new 388 head, alright. Unused. I'm probably the only person u know who can say that! Surprised?:eek:;)
 
Back
Top