Stop calling yourself a "PRODUCER".

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gecko zzed said:
This, I fear, is what is happeinng here with 'producer'. On one level, I don't really care what people call themselves, but on the other, I am concerned that a long-held and stable concept of 'producer' is being denatured.
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As usual, zzed, that was a excellent post making some excellent points to which I cannot disagree, really.

Maybe it's just me, maybe I have a bias here that I haven't pinned down yet, but it still seems to me that this producer thing is different. Yeah, it's language evolution in progress; I'm all over that idea. But there is a direct conflict here. It's not as though "producer" is being co-opted by another unrelated field - say sewing or cricket playing - but rather an arbitrary adoption of a second and unrelated definition of the same word being used in the same manner in the same field.

Both definitions are job titles within the field of music production, but they define entirely different jobs. (Sure, one can rationalize how piecing together parts of ther songs into the quiltwork of a new song is "producing", but come on, Mike, in your heart of hearts you have a deep understanding that knows that is not really what being a producer is all about, and that it's an entirely different thing altogether.) If this were politics, it would be like waking up one morning to find out that the title "state senator" now also applies to congressional aids. It just doesn't work.

Also, linguistic evolution also implies that the "old" definition of producer is dying out or becoming invalid. This is not the case; the real title of "producer" is still as current, valid and viable as it was 20 years or 50 years ago. Actual producers are not a dying breed, and in fact in today's world of manufactured Top40 performance acts can be called as important as ever.

Let's face facts, here. The new definition of producer is a similar type of animal as the new definition of mastering. It's a result of ignorance on the part of a large wave of laypeople entering the field without doing their proper homework first. It's an instance of a misunderstanding on their part of just what the word meant and they adopted their own meaning to suit their erroneous beliefs. So now, all of a sudden, "mastering" allegedly means fixing bad mixes and then ruining them again, and "producing" is supposed to mean creating new music from pieces of old music.

Besides the problem of confusion of job titles already discussed, we now have a problem where the language starts changing the reality in a derogatory way. Most of us know the dangers of the change in view of the mastering process, and the producer thing now means that real, honest to goodness music producers have to explain and defend themselves in order to explain that they are legitimate producers and not a joke.

G.
 
So at what point does one evolve from being "the guy who knows a bit about audio engineering and knows what sounds good" to "Producer?"

Is there an exam you have to pass by to get the title of Producer? The very existence if the term 'producer' in itself is its downfall. The lack of quantifiable qualifications to differentiate between the non PROducer and the produca' is the issue we are dealing with.

Im not saying that you need qualifications to be a producer, but you don’t see people walking around saying "Ooo Im a doctor" when they don’t even have a PhD and didn’t go to Med school, and in that respect its quite easy to see who is bullsh*ting. I can't see a point of reference in the examples you have described to explain to an outsider what the difference is.
 
Waffleness said:
So at what point does one evolve from being "the guy who knows a bit about audio engineering and knows what sounds good" to "Producer?"
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When they actually perform the job description.

In fairness, there are plenty of newbs out there that are legitimate producers, IMHO. Anyone that takes an active role in managing a production and is agreed upon by all the folks involved as being the person charged with responsibility for that role is wearing the producer's hat and therefore, IMHO, can be called the producer for that project. Whether they are good or bad, experienced or not, is not the issue, it's whether they actually fill that role.

G.
 
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RAMI said:
I agree...But for that matter, most original bands would be better off lip-syncing their own tunes, too.
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Anymore, most of them do! :D


Speaking of farts . . . I don't know what I was thinking last night :o :(
 
Let's put this whole thing into perspective!!

We all got into music for one thing and one thing only... to score with the chicks. If you're a guy, you use music to score with the chicks. If you're a girl, you use music to score with the chicks (and probably have a better success rate, too).

So if someone has to utter the word "Producer" as a means to an end, more power to him. Get laid, brother, get laid. :D :D :D
 
RAMI said:
Except for Lance Bass. :D :D :D
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ok now that was funny.

I just think if your are looking for a "producer" in any genre of music you need to do some checking into the person. If someone were to approach you and say "hey im a producer" I would hope you would know enough to talk to him/her more and listen to what they have done. If I were to choose a lawyer I would definetly not just randomly point my finger over the lawyer page of the phone book. Nor would I just hand my money to any accountant off the street.

The good thing about the producers you named in the OP and some of the others named in this thread is that the reputation is already behind them. They worked damn hard to get that title and anyone can see what they do and why they have that title. If your just joe producer off the street making false claims it doesnt take tolong for a client to figure that out. Thats why I say let them claim a title thats not theirs to claim, It will end up hurting them more than helping.
 
Chili said:
Yup, right. I stand corrected.

(But in my defense, I never followed N'Sync and had to google him to see who he was and what you were talking about.)
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I have an N*Sync embroidered pillow. It rules on kick drum!
 
The ladies don't believe it when a guy calls himself a "producer" any more than the guys do...at least not the ladies worth pursuing. It's become a joke.

"Hey, he's cute, what's he do?"

"He calls himself a 'producer'."

"Honey, they all do. That's just a code word for 'unemployed'."

G.
 
RAMI said:
Once again, completely missing the point.
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It's easy to miss the point of a post that had no point to begin with.

Check this out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfJ8usIcEGQ

The female is Carolee Schneemann. The cat is named Kitch. The male is James Tenney, who is credited with the first instance of using commercial samples in a recording. 1961. He seems like he has a clear conscience. :rolleyes:

Maybe that will keep you awake.
 
he sees what he wants to see. Sounds like a pretty closed minded fellow
 
starbuck26 said:
It's easy to miss the point of a post that had no point to begin with.

Check this out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfJ8usIcEGQ

The female is Carolee Schneemann. The cat is named Kitch. The male is James Tenney, who is credited with the first instance of using commercial samples in a recording. 1961. He seems like he has a clear conscience. :rolleyes:

Maybe that will keep you awake.
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That is cool. :cool:

But, like I said, you totally missed the boat. I have no problem with anyone using samples, and I like hip-hop. The fact that you think your link proves anything shows how little you're capable of understanding.

But feel free to continue to display your ignorance. Of course it's impossible to think something has a point when we don't have the mental capacity to GET the point. :p I'd say 95% of the people in this thread got the point, even the ones that disagreed with said point (that you still don't get and probably never will). Congratulations for being in the bottom 5%. You must be used to that by now. :D

Thanx for re-enforcing my original assessment of you. Enjoy your foot, you might want to add a bit of salt. :D :D :D



Oh wait....I thought this wasn't worth even responding to, and you didn't even give a fuck. Open wide, that's 2 feet you now have to accomodate....hee hee. :)
 
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RAMI said:
That is cool. :cool:

But, like I said, you totally missed the boat. I have no problem with anyone using samples, and I like hip-hop. The fact that you think your link proves anything shows how little you're capable of understanding.

But feel free to continue to display your ignorance. Of course it's impossible to think something has a point when we don't have the mental capacity to GET the point. :p I'd say 95% of the people in this thread got the point, even the ones that disagreed with said point (that you still don't get and probably never will). Congratulations for being in the bottom 5%. You must be used to that by now. :D

Thanx for re-enforcing my original assessment of you. Enjoy your foot, you might want to add a bit of salt. :D :D :D
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I didn't miss the boat. I chose not to get on it. And frankly, since it seems like it's heading to a Deep Purple concert, I hope it sinks.
 
Nobody here is a producer until the ones here on a "home recording" site, that think they are better, and more experienced (or just more full of sh*t) than you says you are!

:rolleyes:
 
starbuck26 said:
I didn't miss the boat. I chose not to get on it. And frankly, since it seems like it's heading to a Deep Purple concert, I hope it sinks.
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(Hehe....I knew he'd be back. :p )


I didn't think it was possible after reading your first "random keyboard fart", but you lose more brain cells with each post. Thanx for showing us it's possible. :D:D:D
 
you are in like company then RAMI to have started such a mindless rant:cool:
 
I just like to make music. I've never used the term producer to represent myself or what I do. I have "guided" the recording process of some fellow local musicians, and helped argue the needs for a better take here and there due to the vibe of the song being recorded. I'm a hobbyist musician. No need to pretend to be anything else.

Translated for those who need it:

I just like ta make da noize's. I've never used da term producer ta represent myself or what I do. I gots "guided" da recording process o' some fellow local musicians, an' helped argue da needs fo' uh bettah take here an' dere due ta da vibe o' da song being recorded. I'm uh hobbyist musician. No need ta pretend ta be anyfin' else. ya'll is mad stupid.

:D


EDIT: before anyone give's me crap about how many posts i've got here, like that qualifies me to weigh in here, look at the join date. :eek: I like to read not post but this one got my attention.....

The thing i wanted to add was to the original argument:

The title doesn't make the man, the man makes the title.
 
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