Your Favorite Mic for Guitar Cabs?

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I know SM57's are supposed to be the best universal mic there is.

So... I bought x2 of them, as I know every studio seems to own anywhere from 2 to 6.

BUT.... I personally have never got a very good guitar sound out of them. My guitar sound always sounds muddy, and lost. Just not exciting at all.

I have tried different amps, different settings, deifferent guitars. Maybe I just like a brighter guitar sound, but I think what is really going on is that I am not micing properly.

My method :
I point the sm57 5" away from the speaker, a little down towards 4 o'clock from the center. (I saw the 4 o;clock thing in a magazine, and now do it by habit). And thats it.

Usually I get frustrated and end of recording my mic direct and using modelling of some kinds to make an emulated amplifier sound,

Anybody know what it is that I am doing wrong ?
 
Matt,

i noticed u're using a VS..i once recorded some demos in one (an older model, only 8 tracks) and i remember the pres in it having kind of a tin can quality...a tad harsh..maybe thats the problem? but then again i doubt it...
 
I can't remember who it was - someone on here was telling a story ages back about a famous engineer coming to his school and showing them how he got his signature guitar tones with a ribbon on a guitar amp. The kids asked him whether it was safe to do, whether it could handle the SPLs involved, and he told them he'd done it for years before promptly breaking their expensive ribbon mic on the first take. Guess it still pays to be careful!!!!

Oh and on the SM57 - I haven't ever really gotten great sounds from it on anything, least of all on snare of amps. There are better and they aren't more expensive ... we'll just have to see which ones are still working in 60 years time in order to be labelled 'vintage'!! :)
 
i'd take a 57 over an e609 any day. the e609 is way too bright for my taste.
 
mattkw80 said:
I know SM57's are supposed to be the best universal mic there is.

So... I bought x2 of them, as I know every studio seems to own anywhere from 2 to 6.

BUT.... I personally have never got a very good guitar sound out of them. My guitar sound always sounds muddy, and lost. Just not exciting at all.

I have tried different amps, different settings, deifferent guitars. Maybe I just like a brighter guitar sound, but I think what is really going on is that I am not micing properly.

My method :
I point the sm57 5" away from the speaker, a little down towards 4 o'clock from the center. (I saw the 4 o;clock thing in a magazine, and now do it by habit). And thats it.

Usually I get frustrated and end of recording my mic direct and using modelling of some kinds to make an emulated amplifier sound,

Anybody know what it is that I am doing wrong ?
Click to expand...
Don't always put the mic in the same spot out of habit. Not good to do. First make sure you have a good sound out of the speaker, then experiment with the mic placement.

BTW, what preamp are you using with the 57? With a good pre and a 57, as long as the sound that's coming out of the amp is good, then you should be able to at least get very good sounds. The 57 is a great little mic IMO.
 
Don't just point and shoot when micing up the guitar amp. Put the mic in front of the amp at the approximate distance you want to work with and bring up the gain on your pre. Then bring the guitar up in your cue mix (pretty loudly, but not deafeningly loud). While the guitarist plays some chords or picked parts (or while you play, if recording yourself), move the mic around in front of the amp. Try on or off axis. Try different speakers. You'll be surprised at how much difference a subtle movement can make tonally. Also, if you're almost there with your placement, adjust the EQ on the amp with the headphones ON. After all, its what you're hearing to tape that matters, not what you hear in the room (unless you're using a room mic, but thats another story).

I've only ever used a 57, e609, and AT 4033 for guitars, with not-so-special pres. I liked them all enough, but I'd love to have a ribbon like a Coles/STC, Royer, B & O, Beyer, etc to use on guitar amps.

As for the Royer 121, everything I've read indicates that they're built to take extreme SPLs. If I'm not mistaken, the ribbon is offset in the housing, sitting a little closer to the front grill than to the back, which allows it to move a little more. This is, I'm guessing, what accounts for the slight change in response from the back side.
 
Audio technica 4050, sounds excellent. well, sounds excellent on damn near every thing.
 
Most ribbon mics would not be able to handle the spl from a loud mesa or marshall stack unless you set them back a few feet. The Royer however is a very different beast. It has been designed so that you can stuff it in the grill of a big stack. I don't even use a pop filter with mine. I just tilt it slightly and after 18 months of loud guitar abuse, it still sounds as good as the day I bought it. When I need a brighter sound, you can either turn it around and reverse the polarity (you have to be a little more careful about spl's this way though), or move it away from the cab a bit and focused right towards the dust bubble. One beautiful thing about the Royer ribbon mics though is that they take VERY well to EQ. You can get away with more EQ on a royer than most other mics and have it still sound natural. Luckily, my D&R console has top notch EQ's in it as well.
 
my favorite mic depends on the amp i'm micing and the sound i'm going for.

IMO you can't go wrong with a shure 545 (sm57), slightly off axis, through a decent preamp.

lately, though, i've been enjoying the combination of the sennheiser e609 and either a blue dragonfly or an mxl v77.

in fact, there's little that the dragonfly and v77 don't absolutely KILL on.....but admittedly, i don't record a lot of "chugga chugga" metal. but if i did, i'd put the 545 and v77 on the amp and go worry about the drums. :D


cheers,
wade
 
I am using the Pre's onboard my Roland VS2000.


I guess I just need to play with the positioning.

How far away from the speaker should the sm57 be ?

The Grill of my amp of course automatically makes me back up about 2" from the speaker, but what kind of space (or air) should I leave between the metal grill on the amp and the sm57.

I am using one of those Vox Modelling Amps.
 
just play around with it and see what you like...try it with some headphones that provide some isolation from the room, and lift that amp from the floor.
 
I use a couple of e609 Silvers right up on the grille, and a shure KSM44 or Neumann TLM103 a few feet back. This gets the up-close sound, and more of the developed sound that you would hear in the room.

Cheers,
Zach
 
This is my favorites in order although I usually use a combination.
1) RCA Varacoustic
2) EV 635a
3) SM-57 / e609 (black)
 
Kasey said:
i'd take a 57 over an e609 any day. the e609 is way too bright for my taste.
Click to expand...
it's not an either or situation... :confused: use both and blend. :) or not. :D
 
Jayridge?
Have your ever gotten a change to use a Royer 121? How does the varacoustic sound in comparison? I love the 121 and want to find something comparable. I know they are completely different designs but I'm still curious to hear about the actual similarities or differences.


Ryan
 

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meriphew said:
Don't always put the mic in the same spot out of habit. Not good to do. First make sure you have a good sound out of the speaker, then experiment with the mic placement.

BTW, what preamp are you using with the 57? With a good pre and a 57, as long as the sound that's coming out of the amp is good, then you should be able to at least get very good sounds. The 57 is a great little mic IMO.
Click to expand...


In this case, for the SM57 I was using a DMP3. The situation is that the speaker and room sound great. I'm just having difficulty capturing what I hear. The SM57 seems to be picking up the mids and highs quite nicely. With this new speaker cabinet, the bass is much more full which the SM57's aren't doing well.

I've been experimenting a little with mics and placement. I'm getting better results by changing it up a little. I've left one of the SM57/dmp3 on the grill to the side sligtly off center getting more cone. I also placed another SM57/dmp3 out about 3' pointed straight at the cab...then, yet another (AKG414/Avalon M5) about 8' away where the bass really comes out and sounds best to my ear. This combo is a big improvement but I'm still not getting the full sound.

I've been blending the sounds to try to get the sweet spot but the more I play with this set up, the less I like the SM57's. They just generally sound too bright to me which seems to get worse the closer the mic gets to the cabinet.

Obviously I've got some experimenting to do. I'm definitely going to change up the mic combo a bit and stepping away from the cab seems to be big help too. The work I've been doing lately has been less rock/metal sounds but more jazz/blues stuff so I'm getting away from the hard/bright lead sound...just a bit of a departure from what I've been used to working on.

Thanks everyone.
 
Have you tried moving your closest sm57 all the way to the edge of the speker pointed just slightly towards the center?
 
Sonixx said:
it's not an either or situation... :confused: use both and blend. :) or not. :D
Click to expand...

yes it is!

lol, at least when youre a high school student whose only income is giving a few little kids guitar lessons each week.
 
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