writing a story or "historical" song

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kylosius

I Like Rusty Spoons
i have been listening to the pogues alot lately, and i am in awe by alot of the lyrics. shane macgowan has written some awesome lyrics. when they do story songs, it doesnt come off as cheesy, but whenever i try to write one (even if the lyrics are somewhat decent) they still sound cheesy. anyway of avoiding the cheesiness?
 
Research the facts.....

I wrote a song about a battle during the civil war....
I used the research data base at the Library of Congress to gather facts....
This info gave me dates....numbers....basically the whole story about the battle...
I tried my very best to keep the cheese to a minimum... :D

The song is called Right or Wrong....its at Soundclick...


Good luck,
Joe
 
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kylosius
I love The Pogues and songs like "Waltzing matilda" and if I am remembering the title right"The Birmingham six" always blew me away. Shane has a gift for telling a story. It is as if he knows the people involved and they were his F#@king friends...
Alcohol and hard living surrounds the persona of the band with Mr Macgowan at the helm. A Dirty Glamour half awake and wrapped in a blanket. I am not sure how you get there from here or if I would even like it if I really got there but I sure do love the Pogues.
 
I'm giving away my age, but Iron Maiden wrote tons of songs like that. Some of them were great (Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner) and some were really bad (Alexander the Great).
The thing that made the latter really suck is that the lyrics were just a long list of facts with no emotional content. Something like:

Alexander the Great
Ruled Asia from 509 to 520 A.D.
He was the ruler of lots of tribes.
He conquered many lands and people.

The lyrics just went on like that for like 10 minutes.

On the other hand, some of IM's songs were great, and really gave you a glimpse into what it might have been like to actually be there. Listen to Aces High, Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner, The Trooper, or Run to the Hills to hear what I'm talking about.

Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com
 
I personally love Billy Joel's song downeaster alexa about the Long Islan Bayman. I think one of the things that make the lyrics not cheesy is that he gives them a very personal edge, the story is told as if billy joel is the bayman.
 
My first thought was "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down". Robertson chose to see this huge historical situation through the eyes of Virgil Kane--one man. That took all the facts and related them to a human beings situation. Thats what gave it the power. The last thing I'd do is laundry list the facts. Look for the story and tell that. I think thats how I would try and approach it.
 
Yeh, what Crawdad said - make sure you don't listen to the Joan Baez version - she messes up a couple lines. Plus, well, it's HER. Reason enough not to listen.

Find some songs that you like the way they get the story across, then see if you can do what they do.

John McCutcheon's "Christmas in the Trenches" tells a great story. So does the Beatles' "Rocky Raccoon". So does Dave Loggins' "She Is His Only Need" (Wynonna's version is my wife's favorite cryin' song). Or you might prefer John Lee Hooker's "One Bourbon, One Scotch, One Beer". Or even (shudder) Jim Croce's "Bad Bad Leroy Brown" - a huge hit. Ditto (shudder) Avril Lavigne's "Sk8er Boi". Or Kenny Rogers has some great ones - "Ruby" is my favorite.

All these take very different approaches to their stories, but each is quite effective in its own way. Use what you like, toss out what you don't.

I'm not sure which "Waltzing Matilda" terocious is referring to - there's the traditional one, and a war related one (GOD what a tearjerker) - both are good listens if you can find them...

Good luck,

Daf
 
Aaron Cheney said:

Alexander the Great
Ruled Asia from 509 to 520 A.D.
He was the ruler of lots of tribes.
He conquered many lands and people.

The lyrics just went on like that for like 10 minutes.
Click to expand...

LOL. Check out the B-52's "Mesopotamia" for some fun-with-history lyrics. Or Steve Martin's "King Tut". Or Billy Joel's "We Didn't Start the Fire"...

Daf
 
The Pogues did the war related version of Waltzing Matilda on "Rum, Sodomy and the Lash" and then there is a Tom Waits WM which is to die for.
 
just had to chime in.

Nobody mentioned "The day the music died" (by no means a list of dates and facts) and I don't think I saw "Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"
"Rocky Raccoon"(witch was mentioned) was the first song I ever learned how to play. A classic.
I love songs that tell a story. I've got a couple of 'em and I love to play 'em. My sis hates one of 'em and I always play it anyway.
Anyway, Good Luck!
-joe
 
On the Homerecording.comp CD that's almost done, I will have a song that tells 4 stories. Here's the lyrics, for those that are interested:

Bad Luck...Good Story

Lightning showing up on the weather charts
Good day to make a man of abandoned parts
But in the rush to beat the rain
They gave it a defective brain
And so instead of doing good
It terrorized the neighborhood
And now they're burning the laboratory
It was bad luck but a real good story.

Was a forty-niner seventy-four years old
Nothing in his life but a lust for gold.
Until he found a vein of ore
Five miles long or maybe more
And so he raised a joyful sound
And rattled all the walls on down
And now he's working a dead man's quarry
It was bad luck but a real good story.

Even my Lord in his power and mercy
Old Judas did betray
But the Good Book says he conquered the grave
And all man-kind was saved.

But I was chatting with Lucifer the other day
He said a lot of people come and they always stay
And every one of them has a tale to tell
About why they don't belong in hell
But none of them is as good as mine
And how I lost my throne divine
And now I'm stranded in Purgatory
It was bad luck but a real good story.

It's the title track to my new CD, which has 10 songs..... but if you let it run through 2 blank tracks, you arrive at the "secret" 13th track, which is an extra verse (which won't be on the homerecording.comp CD) that goes like this:

There was a gentleman that wanted his love to wife
As he had fancied her hand nearly all his life
But another gentleman loved her too
Which left them just one thing to do
Each took his pistol and like a fool
Stepped off the pace for a suitor's duel
And both were dead in a blaze of glory
It was bad luck but a real good story.

So..... now you have a reason to buy the Homerecording.comp CD and mine!

Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com
 
story songs of history songs

well, I pretty much write story songs exclusively and have a couple suggestions. To avoid cheesy-ness, use the same guidelines as other types of songs.

1. Avoid cliches.
2. Avoid predictable storylines/outcomes.
3. If the story is factual, don't be afraid to embellish or, re-imagine the story.

Always remember, just because it really happened, it isn't necessarily interesting. Maybe try inventing characters in historical situations.

In terms of conflict and resolution, I try to avoid clear cut moral plays (like songs about rape or racism or war, I pretty much assume everyone knows how to pick between good and bad) and concentrate on more subtle good vs. pretty good or bad vs. worse conflicts. They're more interesting because people actually might disagree with your message and discuss the song afterwards. I don't know about you guys, but I'd rather have someone confront me and my song's message than have a room full of people nodding at me in agreement.

Finally, here are some good examples of Historical Story Songs:

Bob Dylan;
The Lonesome Death of Hattie Carroll
Hurricane

They Might Be Giants;
James K. Polk

Stone P.
 
Aaron Cheney said:
It was bad luck but a real good story.
Click to expand...

I like this!!! I've already ordered my HR CD...

I hope Brad's not doing another song about his mom - that one's still disturbing, months after the last time I heard it...:(













:D
 
Sort of a historical song is "Sail Away" by Randy Newman. Boy, (or is that Boi, Averil? talk about a scathing account of history.
 
I love story songs and historical songs written from an indvidual viewpoint, but my all-time favorite story song is "Let Him Roll" by Guy Clark. It knocked me out when I first heard it 26 years ago and still does. Clark's "Desperadoes Waiting For A Train" is also another good one. Another great story telling writer is Tom T. Hall, who is still active on the bluegrass festival circuit and still writing songs with his wife Dixie.
 
Aaron-that's a kick ass lyric. One of the best I've ever seen on this board.

Kylosius, sounds like it's time for some Dylan homework. Blood on the Tracks would be a good place to start for what you're interested in, I think.

Frank black has a great song about the energy crisis of the late '70's called "Czar." That one has a great lyric.

love on
-small
 
Aaron - can't wait to hear the song on the comp cd :)

Another good "Historical" song with poetic license is Belleau Wood written by Joe Henry & Garth Brooks - performed by...you guessed it...Joe Henry :p LOL.

I think this is a beautiful song, but the facts aren't quite right. The song is about a Christmas truce during WW1. The battle of Belleau Wood happened June (ish) of 1918. There was a Christmas truce in 1914 however and there was a lot written about this. In fact, I came across a poem that I suspect the co-writers of this song relied quite heavily on for the lyrics. There's the research part :)

So there you go...a song based on a real historical event, with artistic license used to make the song more appealing. :) Seriously, if you get a chance, check out the song. I think it is wonderful.
 
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