Where did that extreme low end rumble come from????

  • Thread starter Thread starter HangDawg
  • Start date Start date
HangDawg

HangDawg

bUnGhOlIo
I finally finished up mixing a 9 song project for a local band and I'm pretty happy with the end result and so are they? I played it on a variety of systems and it was pretty nice on all but 1 instance. I took it to band practice last night and played it through the PA which has 4 18" rear loaded bass bins and about 4000 watts for the low end. Now I can hear some really nasty shit in the low end that apparently is not being reproduced in my studio, or anywhere else for that matter. I have Event studio precision 8's in my studio and they have pretty good low end to them along with copious amounts of bass trapping. How the hell do you know this kind of shit is present if your monitors and every other system you play it on doesn't reproduce it?

The good thing is, they are sending this to be mastered so I assume they will get rid of it. I just wonder where it came from? I can't make out what is causing it. Could it be artifacts from cubase or some other piece in the software chain? Damn this just pisses me off. :mad:
 
This is why I always play my mixes on my subwoofer equipped car stereo. Indeed, my car stereo (not a great one by any means!) is voiced like a "V-shape" EQ. All high mids, treble and low bass, with not much in between. Definitely the kind of system my mixes would be played on.

Having that said, I can hear all the shite (below 80 Hz) very easily with the sub.

I highly suggest anyone to high-pass any instruments at about 40 Hz ~ 70 Hz during mixing (especially kick drum, vocals and distorted guitars) to make sure there isn't a bass rumble build-up when done mixing. It also helps the mastering guy, cause he can push it even more because there is less power dissipation in the low lows.

Most studios that are not equipped with a properly set-up subwoofer can suffer from this. Most nearfields cover down to 35 Hz but even then, it's a struggle for those little integrated power amps to get the cone moving at this frequency, so you loose all impact. So it's more accurate to say that most nearfields cover "properly" down to ~ 40Hz and that's it.
 
TheDewd said:
This is why I always play my mixes on my subwoofer equipped car stereo. Indeed, my car stereo (not a great one by any means!) is voiced like a "V-shape" EQ. All high mids, treble and low bass, with not much in between. Definitely the kind of system my mixes would be played on.

Having that said, I can hear all the shite (below 80 Hz) very easily with the sub.

I highly suggest anyone to high-pass any instruments at about 40 Hz ~ 70 Hz during mixing (especially kick drum, vocals and distorted guitars) to make sure there isn't a bass rumble build-up when done mixing. It also helps the mastering guy, cause he can push it even more because there is less power dissipation in the low lows.

Most studios that are not equipped with a properly set-up subwoofer can suffer from this. Most nearfields cover down to 35 Hz but even then, it's a struggle for those little integrated power amps to get the cone moving at this frequency, so you loose all impact. So it's more accurate to say that most nearfields cover "properly" down to ~ 40Hz and that's it.
Click to expand...


I did high-pass most everything except the kick. I did play this on a pretty decent home stereo with a sub. Still didn't hear it. Not until the 18 inchers and massive power did the shite reveal itself.
 
i saw record each individual track onto a cd as seperate tracks, and then play it back to see which is doing it, and then eq it out on that track??

hmm.

FW
 
I tried holding off, but I have to ask:

how can one expect *anything* played back through four overdriven 18" cabs or thorugh a car stereo with EQ boosted through the roof to sound any good?

I may not be a head-banger, but come on; you guys are just asking for trouble with those monstrosities of playback systems.

G.
 
fateswebb said:
i saw record each individual track onto a cd as seperate tracks, and then play it back to see which is doing it, and then eq it out on that track??

hmm.

FW
Click to expand...

I wouldn't think that would work. When you combine tracks the lows and mids from one track tend to build up with the lows and mids from another track and that is probably where the rumble is coming from. You wouldn't hear it if played separately but together you would get the buildup.

I agree with G.

P.A. gear is NOT the place to test a CD. I've even seen an awful lot of bands run a CD through to set the sound for the live gig and when the band starts playing the sound sucks. If you intend for your CD to be played on home stereo's, in cars and computer's then TEST them on home stereo's, in cars and computers. Not on a band's live rig. Ever notice that when you go to a concert, before the show the house P.A. is running a CD or other music QUIETLY?
 
I've got a set of ASP8s, they're very nice. If I want to hear whats really happening way down low I stick on a set of DT770 headphones which go even lower, that doesn't mean I can hear it to balance - just to hear if there's any junk down there. Another way to hear it is to stack a couple of Low-pass filters set to 40Hz and try and hear if there's any junk down there by turning the monitors wayyyy up - also, every time you stack a filter it gives a steeper slope which helps isolate the range.

But IMO the real way is to grab a spectrum analyzer like Voxengo SPAN and see if there's any junk below 30-40Hz rumblin around, if there is chop it off. Since you have a good test case with the 18" PA make a CD with a 20Hz hipass, 30Hz HP, 40Hz HP, etc till you understand what is going on. If you have a commercial reference track that sounds good see/hear what is happening really low using lowpass/spectrums in you studio... Those folded 18" cabs are killer - in a good way !
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
I tried holding off, but I have to ask:

how can one expect *anything* played back through four overdriven 18" cabs or thorugh a car stereo with EQ boosted through the roof to sound any good?

I may not be a head-banger, but come on; you guys are just asking for trouble with those monstrosities of playback systems.

G.
Click to expand...


I didn't expect it to sound good. But I didn't expect to hear that weird phasey low end swirly shit either.
 
My point was you can't trust what your'e hearing on such systems. That "phasey swirley lown end sh_t" may not be your recording's problem. You can't tell by playbng back through multiple 18" bass cabs, a setup which can introduce so many of it's own artifacting proglems to the audio that you wouldn't know whether what you're hearing is coming from the source material or from the playback system.

If you've high-passed everything but the kick, take a look at the kick channel between the beats. Is there a lot of low-volume, LF stuff happening there? If so you might want to gate that channel.

But if you're high-passing everything else and the problem is not on the kick channel, then the problem is that playback system and I wouldn't worry about it otherwise.

G.
 
Some of my favourite CDs sound downright awful through my PA cabs. But the ones which are really spot on, like Dave Matthews Band or Jeff Buckley, sound great anywhere. Guess that doesn't help you other than to say that the phenomenon you've spotted does exist. Sorry! :)
 
It doesn't sound bad anywhere else so I guess I'll assume it's the PA. It's going to get professionally mastered so I hope if there are any real problems they can fix it.
 
you might want to cut your final tracks 2-3 db around 50 hz. nothing wrong with that. or maybe that should be done on the PA end.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top