What is the harmonic function of............

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VTgreen81

VTgreen81

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the fmaj7 in the key of em? It's followed by a Gmaj7, so I'm assuming it's a secondary dominant that'll resolve to the III. The closest I can come is that it's a substitute for a Dm9 which would be a v/III, but I'm sure I'm a bit out of whack.
 
VTgreen81 said:
the fmaj7 in the key of em? It's followed by a Gmaj7, so I'm assuming it's a secondary dominant that'll resolve to the III. The closest I can come is that it's a substitute for a Dm9 which would be a v/III, but I'm sure I'm a bit out of whack.

as far as i know, the key of Em has no Fmaj7 in it. it actually has an F#m7. Em is the same as Gmaj. if it were a dominant it would be a F#7. the dominant in Gmaj/Em is D7. the song probably switches keys which is why you'd have an Fmaj7.
 
It's still in Em, just uses an accidental. But thanks for trying.
 
It turns out to be a neapolitan chord which is a triad based on a diminished supertonic. :eek:
 
VTgreen81 said:
It turns out to be a neapolitan chord which is a triad based on a diminished supertonic. :eek:


cool. i never had advanced theory. glad you found what you were looking for.
 
Another way of describing modally is as a tri-tone substitution chord for the dominant. In otherwords, it's roughly equivalent to a B7.

I wouldn't call the progression em7 -> FM7 -> em7 Neapolitain - it is a phrygian mode progression.
 
$.02

in as much as you said maj7 it cant be neopolitan as tha is a dominant sounding chord... as frazier mentioned it sounds like your getting modal... and yes that would be phrygian...has nothing to do with your GF's sexuallity... but to give a learned response will be hard in as much as this is all out of context and theory is abou context...
 
Just play!
if sounds good then :D
else try something different.
Relax...... :cool:
 
$.25

VTgreen81 said:
It turns out to be a neapolitan chord which is a triad based on a diminished supertonic. :eek:
this is just plain wrong... a neopolitan is specifically a secondary dominant of the dominant built on the b2nd step... not to be confused with a tritone sub... IMO your still in phrygian... :cool:
 
Yeah, I hear Dylan wrestled with exactly the same question...
 
The discussion seems a bit assoteric. Fun though :D .
 
assoteric? Was that miss-spelling intended? Cause it's appropriate :D

up-fiddler said:
The discussion seems a bit assoteric. Fun though :D .
 
vtgreen81 said:
It turns out to be a neapolitan chord which is a triad based on a diminished supertonic.

dementedchord said:
this is just plain wrong... a neopolitan is specifically a secondary dominant of the dominant built on the b2nd step... not to be confused with a tritone sub... IMO your still in phrygian... :cool:

How can you say he's wrong and then reiterate what he just said? A triad based on a diminished supertonic IS a V/V built on a flat 2nd. He's in em and isn't a fifth of E a B and the fifth of B an F? Thus F is the secdom of the dom(V/V)as well as the the flat 2nd of em. The only thing he's wrong about is the resolution, to be a neapolitan there is a specfic interval to resolve to, I don't remember which. But the Chicago to Boston bus is still the Chicago to Boston bus even if it gets hijacked and taken to Detroit.

What's happening here is he's gone outside the box a bit and he's in a place where Johann and Wolfgang aren't going to be much help. Sometimes with modern music the rules just don't fit and you'll kill yourself with analysis. With the use of tonal clusters in today's compositions theory is going out the window.



But he's still a damn dirty hippie even if he is starting to catch on to a bit of theory.
 
$.02

except he's asking about a F maj7 not dom 7 and he's resolving it to a gmaj7 not a B7 theory is about context ya cant change that your on the wrong bus... and lastly why ask if ya dont want to know??? one of the more basic deffinitions of ignorance is to not accept the information presented to you...
 
dementedchord said:
except he's asking about a F maj7 not dom 7 and he's resolving it to a gmaj7 not a B7


Thanks for trying to explain things, but I think I'm at to the point where I've learned just enough to realize how little I know and half of what's being tossed at me is going over my head. I started playing with this and I liked it and I have this stupid idea in my head that I need to know not only that it works, but WHY it works.

Now I know that Phrygian is the third mode, so E Phrygian would be C major, but I don't see how that relates to this. sorry to be dense.



And Bushthechrist................why do you haunt me so?
 
$.02

actually if you want to be more assoteric it's not that either as you are going to a gmaj7 ... in phrygian it should be g7 ... if your interested it's that malaguena (sp) sound... or check out chick coreas la fiesta... my bad just wanted to help.... :(
 
up-fiddler said:
Just play!
if sounds good then :D
else try something different.
Relax...... :cool:
Yeah just my thoughts. If it sounds brilliant I dont even try to find out what chord it is im fiddling on my keyboard :)
 
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