What is the cheapest way to record in your opinion

[Jack_Jones]

I agree, find a novice recordist, pay him 5 or 10 dollars an hour and do it with him. Or find a recording student and maybe they'll do it for free for student credit.

Recording is an expensive mistress (even when she is at her cheapest). I like Apple's Garageband for cheap recordings (free with Mac computers and powerful).

I've written a few articles on how to put together inexpensive recordings at GuerillaProducer.com

Hope that helps.

 

[Neadadvice]

Thanks for the advice and if home recording doesn't work out for me thats what ill end up doing. I am leaning towards getting the tascam dp-004 though and try mixing through reaper. I heard some recordings using it and a video using it and they all sounded really good to me. I also have to continue to study up on recording techniques and layering.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

Honestly, how important is sound quality at this point?

On a super-low budget, if you already have a mic, cable, and a computer, I'd download Reaper, then buy a couple adaptors - a XLR-1/4" and an 1/4" to 1/8" (or XLR to 1/8" if you can find one). I'd then just plug your (dynamic) mic straight into your computer's sound card.

The cons here are that stock computer sound cards really aren't up to the task of professional recording, so your guitar, bass, and vocal quality is going to get raped by the analog to digital conversion.

The pros, however, are that you'll be out like $10, and even with shitty AD/DA conversion, you can get surprisingly tolerable results. As long as you don't expect to sound like Devin Townsend and are ok with a slightly lo-fi aesthetic, then you'll be fine.

And, even at this threshold, technique matters way more than you'd think. Spend some time dialing in and learning to mic your amp, and even on this super-budget rig, you'll get a reasonably acceptable demo, and furthermore you'll have developed skills that can be scaled up to a better rig one day. Go out, drop five grand on preamps, converters, monitors, and mics, and don't have the basics down, and then all you'll have is a truer reproduction of a shoddily-recorded guitar.

And yes, this is how I started, back in '99 or so in college. Heck, I didn't even have a mic at first, I was just using my laptop's built in mic and putting it on the ground next to my amp, before I "upgraded" to one of those computer mics that kind of looks like a whammy bar, before I "upgraded" to a Radio Shack SM58 knockoff and an adaptor. People couldn't believe how ghetto my rig was, when they heard the finished product, and I learned a TON about mixing and recording in the process.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

Wow the last two post were a big help. I have been doing what the cancers has said and have played around just recording my guitar part using the computer mic and reaper the last couple days. I tried recording in my garage, basement, with amp in the other room wth volume blasted and the amp right next to computer. As the cancers said though the sound was unsasisfactory, even for someone like me who just looking for the bare minimun in sound. The quality was ok, but im guessing the computer mic or computer sound cards can not be used for recording music, because for some reason the volume would swell in short burst and the end product just had too many of these spikes to really get enjoyment from listening to my music.

Without hearing it I can't be absolutely sure, but I suspect the problem isn't "computer mics and sound cards aren't good enough to be used for music" (even though this is true, strictly speaking), but rather that you were blasting the amp, and probably overdriving the living shit out of the microphone, sound card, or both. Did it seem to "swell" depending on whether you were playing high notes or low notes? Was it way fizzier recorded than it sounded in the room? Dimes to dollars, the final product blew because you were distorting something in the signal chain.

This isn't exactly extreme metal, but this is something I recorded probably back in '00 or so, using Sonic Foundry Acid 2.0, a Mesa Rocket-44 combo, my laptop's sound card, and that aforementioned "whammy bar" mic, with the amp volume and input volume set low enough that it wasn't clipping. Drum loop and bass loop, but everything else (clean guitars, processed-to-hell-and-back guitar harmony "synth pads", and lead) was all recorded at very low volume in this manner.

Again, bigger picture, this isn't a recording to brag about, but it's surprisingly not-painful considering what it was recorded with, and everything I learned about amp micing and recording and mixing working on a shoestring budget was just as valuable when I graduated to a "real" setup a couple years later, after I was out of college and didn't have to choose between, say, a Firepod and an entire year's worth of beer.

 

[The Cancers]

Mr. Peterson just said everything I meant to say, but with more skill with the whole language thing-bob. Um, Drew, you might be my long lost hetero soulmate.

 

[lifelyrics]

Thanks for the advice and if home recording doesn't work out for me thats what ill end up doing. I am leaning towards getting the tascam dp-004 though and try mixing through reaper. I heard some recordings using it and a video using it and they all sounded really good to me. I also have to continue to study up on recording techniques and layering.

If you're interested, I can upload some samples of my son & his buddy jamming w/ drums & guitar and/or drums & bass. They recorded a 2 1/2 hour jam session in my son's room, using the built in mic's of our DP004.

If you decide to purchase the DP, there are a few things you should know up front. You won't be able to use most condenser mic's directly to the DP. You'll need to upgrade the SD card (comes with 1G, but only part of that is usable for straight recording), and you'll need to plug it in, if you intend on recording for any length of time. You can record 2 tracks at a time, up to 4 tracks for one song, before needing to either mix & bounce those 4 to 1 track, or convert the tracks to wav files and export them to your computer, where you will be able to work in your DAW of choice.

We have used the DP with Audacity, though most people on this forum seem to prefer/use reaper, so you'll probably have more help working with your tracks if you download Reaper.

Best of luck to you.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

Mr. Peterson just said everything I meant to say, but with more skill with the whole language thing-bob. Um, Drew, you might be my long lost hetero soulmate.

Haha, thanks man. Pity you're not a hot chick.

 

[Neadadvice]

Hey Drew, I can't thank you enough bro. Sorry I haven't responed sooner, I've been applying everywhere for a job. Anyway I listened to your zen dreaming, nice playing by the way, and I can't believe you recorded that with just your sound card and a cheap mic. I really have to learn the proper technique, because if I get quality like that I would be more then ecstatic. I already have a xlr to 1/4 cable, but my computer does not have a 1/8 outlet, so their wouldn't be any purpose in a getting 1/4 to 1/8 cable. What is your opinion on an xlr to usb cable? Would that work? Also at what setting would it be proper to set a guitar 65 watt amp (crate gt65, I hate the thing, I really want a old marshall valvestate 8100, but I have more important things to get now). When I recorded using my computer mic I didn't have it too loud I think, but maybe for a computer it was to loud. You were correct that the volume would spike when I hit high notes, is this a definite indication that I am overdriving the sound card?

Also thank you lifeslyrics for your offer and good wishes and if you could I would really appreciate if you could upload this sample a of tascam dp-004 recording. I am leaning now towards just getting a xlr to usb cable if that is proper.

Thanks to everyone this community has been very kind to me and I really appreciate it.

 

[Don138]

Cheapest? Get 5 hours, or 8 if you can find a deal for $140 or so, or book a few hours with Stuart at Isotopia here in Austin. That guy will give you a rough mix soon as you lay down the tracks that will sound amazing. My ex guitar player had some black cube thing, don't know what the hell it is, about a foot and change wide, with 1 mike sittting just outside the door of the practice space, worked ok. I just bought my tascam 424 MK III for 30 bucks and am learning to use it. Soon as I can get tracks to bounce I'll be ready to take over the world

 

[lifelyrics]

Also thank you lifeslyrics for your offer and good wishes and if you could I would really appreciate if you could upload this sample a of tascam dp-004 recording.

The clip is under 1 minute, but enough for you to get an idea, I think.
http://soundclick.com/share?songid=7877762
If you'd like to hear some when they were using the bass guitar, just give me an email address and I can send to you directly.

I am leaning now towards just getting a xlr to usb cable if that is proper.

You will need to get an xlr -> 1/4" cable if you are planning to use with the DP (It has two 1/4" inputs-input A is designed for either guitar or mic/line input input B is mic/line only).

You will also eventually want to get a plain old USB cable to transfer your files back and forth between DP & computer, because it's more convenient than removing the SD card (you have to take the batteries out to get the the card).

 

[Neadadvice]

Thank you lifelyrics for that sample. It was very helpful and it greater inforces my faith in the tascam dp-004. When this was recorded was the guitar directly plugged into the tascam or was it recorded external mic or the internal mic?

Thank you Don. It seems here in chicago things are more expensive for recording, and proably cigarettes (we are at $10 a pack). The cheapest I found was 40 dollars an hour. Im imaging for my band to record 3 or 4 songs it would be cheaper to get go out and buy the gear. Thanks you though.

Also I found out I just how bad my attention to small detail is. I do have 1/8 input it just wasn't located in the area im accustomed by my previous laptop (it in the front not on the sides, didn't realize laptops have inputs in the front). So I ordered a 1/4 to 1/8 adapter since I already have an xlr to 1/4 cord and my vocalist has a dynamic mic. Ill see how the recording comes out and ill post it when its done, so if anyone is interested they can comment. If it doesn't turn out well ill proably get the tascam dp-004 unless someone recomends something else and then ill only be out $2 on the adapter.

 

[Richard Monroe]

What is the cheapest way to record? Buy a used KORG PXR4 Pandora on ebay. Under $100? no problem. $89.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ToneWorks-Korg-...trkparms=65:12|66:2|39:1|72:1205|293:1|294:50

Read the manual. Use the onboard mic, or plug any cheap stage mic into it. Set the input level so it never gets too close to zero, so you don't overload it. Pan it to center. Convert it to MP2. Hook it to your computer by USB and then use shareware to rip it to MP3 or CDA and burn to CD. Done. And it will produce a surprisingly better recording than trying to pretend that $100 buys a recording studio. What kind of room to record in? One that is soft- containing lots of laundry, pillows, whatever hanging all over the walls. If you have trouble controlling the clipping from your screaming vocals, the onboard compressor/limiter will help. It also contains a boatload of useful effects.

I'm not kidding. I used this little box for almost 5 years for my notepad and for portable recordings. It's better than anyone realizes. I upgraded to a more modern machine that has built in stereo mics, can record for a longer period of time, and exports WAV. and MP3 files, but one of my buddies is still using it. It'll come as close to anything I know of to doing what you want to do for no money. Good luck-Richie

 

[lifelyrics]

Thank you lifelyrics for that sample. It was very helpful and it greater inforces my faith in the tascam dp-004. When this was recorded was the guitar directly plugged into the tascam or was it recorded external mic or the internal mic?

You're welcome, however, after what Richard just posted, I would encourage you to look into that, especially considering the money. The DP has some nice features, 2 decent built it condenser mic's (that's what they were using), but, as I said before, you would need to invest even more money than the cost of the unit (SD card, power adapter, xlr to 1/4"...) I think we paid $159 for ours, and then spent at least another $50-$75 to take care of the issues we didn't realize we would face when we bought it.

All the best to you.

 

[Richard Monroe]

The DP004 is a pretty good machine, but pisses me off by not having a backlight, which makes it really hard to use in clubs, where I do a fair amount of remote recording. The KORG is obsolete- one because it uses Smart Media cards, which max out at 128mb. That results in 90 track-minutes in high resolution, which is 16bit/44.1kHz. That's 45 minutes in stereo. Secondly, it only has one built in mic, so you need an external mic to record in stereo. I finally settled on Zoom H4n to replace mine after 5 years, which does most of what I want to do, but it is basically a $350 machine. Its predecessor, H4, is a $200 machine, and looks good on paper, but has critical design flaws that prevent me from recommending it to anyone. I think it is a headache in a box. The H4n corrected every one of those design flaws. Thanks for that, Zoom.

Aside from the backlight issue, the DP004 is a better machine than the Korg Pandora, but it is also a $200 unit, and I was trying to stay within this po' guys budget. The Pandora is also a machine I know very well, and it works. Because it is obsolete, there are a lot of them on the market for very little money. It's a bit of a pain to get the tracks into a computer, because it only exports a finished mix in MP2, which is an uncompressed format. This makes it necessary to mix down in the Pandora, then export a *huge* MP2 file, and then rip it to the format of choice, either CD or MP3. For $200, I'd buy a Zoom H2 or DP004, depending on your needs.The DP004 is a true 4-tracker, and the H2 is, I think, the better stereo remote recorder. For $350, H4n beats all of the above. For the novice recorder with no money, a used Pandora is a great bang-for-buck investment. For an experienced recorder, it's a very cool toy.

For a while, I have advocated the emerging class of microrecorders for novices on a tight budget. In the beginning, they are a learning tool that gets you up and running right away. As you progress, the newer ones record straight to computer software, and act as a cheap USB interface. As you get deeper into it, it becomes a scratch pad for a recording artist, a travelling headphone amp, a portable remote unit, and an auxiliary oreamp, tuner, metronome, etc. It does the whole thing right out of the box, and never becomes completely useless.-Richie

 

[DrewPeterson7]

Well, a XLR-USB is going to cost you a lot more, since it needs to do some sort of analog-to-digital conversion. Do you have a "Mic in" or a "Line in" on your laptop?

I can't be 100% sure without hearing it, but if the response was frequency-dependent, then I'm guessing it probably is.

For starters, does whatever program you currently have to record have any way to "monitor" the recording signal? Typically, this will be one or two green bars, that turn yellow and then red right at the very top, and give you a visual depiction of the "loudness" of the signal coming into your sound card. You want to stay well within the green, for digital recording - try to make sure you're "peaking" at or below -6 dB - that the loudest signal your sound card will ever see is 6 decibels or less. If you're going well above that, to zero and above, then that's most likely what your problem is - you're distorting your sound card.

 

[lifelyrics]

For a while, I have advocated the emerging class of microrecorders for novices on a tight budget. In the beginning, they are a learning tool that gets you up and running right away. As you progress, the newer ones record straight to computer software, and act as a cheap USB interface. As you get deeper into it, it becomes a scratch pad for a recording artist, a travelling headphone amp, a portable remote unit, and an auxiliary oreamp, tuner, metronome, etc. It does the whole thing right out of the box, and never becomes completely useless.-Richie

I really just wanted to agree with you, Richie, with my own experience. The DP was our first multi-track recorder, and it was easy to learn, use, and can even be used without a DAW (though I preferred to export and work with the tracks on my audacity - at the time). Eventually, we discovered we would need to upgrade to use a condenser mic with it. After we got set up with the new stuff, I really didn't want to part with the DP. I have realized what you said, but not only is it far from useless, It's great for whole room, live recordings (if you're in a lighted room! I never even thought about the lack of a backlight, since I never used it in that setting!).

 

[Neadadvice]

Thank you Richard for enlightening me of Korg Pandora, as I feel now I may be needing it. I recieved my 1/4 to 1/8 adapter today and spent just about the entire day experimenting with recording by connecting the 1/8 to 1/4 adapter to a 1/4 to XLR cable to a Nady SP-5 Mic. The results were poor unfortunately. My vocalists recording was acceptiable, but I just couldn't get my guitar part right. My vocalist was helping me out and I had him hold the mic right next to the speaker of my amp, off center. I had the volume starting out a a bare minimun of being audible, while still having adequate gain, and recorded using reaper. I recorded while being in the green as Drew recommended, but the result was just too soft. I slowly raised the volume recording the first verse over and over again to try and increase the volume of the recording enough to be acceptible. It was getting there, but then before I reached a high enough level I overdrove the sound card. After that I experimented with placing the amp further away from the mic. Again I experimented with slowly moving the amp back and slowly increasing the volume. Proably the best results I had was with the amp being 15 feet away and the amp at 7, I think that is a very unconventional method but I was getting desperate, but I think I was still overdriving the sound card as the high notes in the intro would spike and then the volume would subside as I entered the verse.

After I felt I tried every possible combination of distance and volume of the amp I gave up on recording the guitar using the mic. I tried just plugging the guitar into the computer using the adapter and a 1/4 to 1/4 cable and I did record the guitar clean, but even so it was still very soft. Then I tried using this cheap amp I have, but it has a head phone input, so I plugged the adapter to a 1/4 to 1/4 cable the the amps headphone input and plugged another 1/4 to 1/4 cable from the input to the guitar. I hit record and I did get alot of volume the problem was it primarly came in the form of feadback.

I was confident I would come out of today with atleast somekindof recording, but I failed. Im guessing the sound card is the problem. I have new, but cheap laptop Im recording with so im sure the soundcard is of very low quality. The solutions I came up with is either getting a SoundTech STUSBXLR10 LightSnake USB Microphone Cable, Behringer UCA202 USB Audio Interface, M-Audio Sessions, A used Korg Pandora or dish out the money and get a Tascam DP-004. Im leaning towards getting the LightSnake and plugging it into the Nady mic and trying again. It appears to be the simple and cheap fix to my problem. If you guys have any suggestions I would really appreciate it. Sorry for the long post, just really down about not being able to record today.

 

[ermghoti]

You could try a Zoom H2. They are going as low as $150 new, so they should be available used for $100. They have a lot of limitations, but sound pretty good, and can transfer files to your computer or be used as an interface, IIRC.

The really good part: they're handy as all get-out as a little live recorder, scratch pad, quickie demo tool, etc, so if you stick with recording and upgrade to a more full-fledged system, you won't have the thing collecting dust in a drawer, waiting for you to sell it at a loss.

http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trksid=p3907.m38.l1313&_nkw=zoom+h2&_sacat=See-All-Categories

 

[lifelyrics]

If you are planning on layering multiple track recording, you should probably steer away from USB interface. You will be hard pressed to find anything without latency issues that make it next to impossible to record while listening to something you've already laid down. Something like the Zoom that Richie told you about, or the DP works (or possibly the H2, ermghoti recommended to you), even though it has USB is because you lay down your tracks within the "portastudio", then move several tracks at once over to a computer or laptop in order to work with them in a DAW (if desired). There are a few low-end USB interfaces, but if you've ever tried recording that way, you will know that you have to come up with some very creative ways to lay anything down and monitor it at the same time - I mean, with your computer. You will hear an echo of everything your doing - not fun. The Korg sounds like you lay down your tracks, then "mix down", then xfer to computer, so you wouldn't have the issue there, either. You may want to google some of these products for their user's guide or manual, and see if that helps you become more familiar with which ones do what, and compare that to what you're really looking for. My hubby downloaded the TAPCO one before we purchased their 4x6 firewire interface.

Don't be discouraged. You are on a huge learning curve, and these things take time. It's better to do research and testing, like what you're doing, ahead of time, than to spend a bunch of money and then find it's not what you needed it to be!

Good luck

 

[Neadadvice]

Thank you again lifeslyrics for your words of encouragement and thank you ermghoti for recommending me the zoom h2. I looked on craiglists and couldn't find the zoom h2, the korg pandora, or the tascam dp-004, but I found an interface and a recorder that may be of use. The first one I found was the M-Audio fast track http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/msg/1297015392.html. This thing is usually 100 new and I think someone here recomended it to me here a while back. I am hesistant though because lifeslyrics told me to stay away from usb interfaces. The only recorder I could find that was cheap was this one http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/msg/1293111957.html. Its only fifty bucks, but it is a tape recorder not a digital recorder, so I am also hesitant. If you guys don't think either of these are any good I found a zoom h2 for 100 buy it now on ebay and a korg pandora that the bidding is still low on. I couldn't find any good deals on the tascam. Let me know what you guys think. Thank you.