wet/dry

[watchtheworld]

i just want my guitar and voice to sound liek this

www.myspace.com/camerafone

but everything i record always sounds "wet" and i'm not very particular to buying 129871928741 dollar microphones/preamps/mixers/compressors/limiters/gates/cables.

the only thing i have had the pleasure of owning is a shure sm57 and a M-audio usb interface and cool edit pro.

so my question i guess. is how do i make things sound not "wet" with the equipment i have?

the most i know how to do so far is to raise the treble and mids and lower the bass. and that's the closest i've gotten to making it sound "dryer"



Edit: okay so also for example..
www.myspace.com/travismartinjoncaswell
"untitled"

everything sounds so far away and muted. it soundsl ike im listening to the song with cotton in my ears.

whereas back to the other band
www.myspace.com/camerafone
"one"
everything is like loud crisp and clear in my ear.

 

[danny.guitar]

First of all, and this is a guess, but the first one you linked to sounds professionally done, or at least a very well-done home recording. Sounds like minimal processing went into it.

Second, your song sounds fine to me (untitled). I hear a lot of room noise. Sounds like it was recorded live all at once, so it has a nice live sound. How'd you record it?

Most of the "problem" you're facing is probably lack of room treatment. What you're hearing is the influence of the room you're recording in. This is why most studios have sound absorbing panels/foam on the walls to absorb a lot of the reflections. Another way to help is to simply put the microphones closer to the source but it won't fix the problem.

Check out the Studio Building & Display forum on here. Lots of talk about sound absorption, bass traps, diffusers, all that boring/important stuff.

Btw, I personally like your song a lot more than the other one.

If you listen though, to the drums, you can really hear the influence of the room (soft/fluffy/muffled sound). Acoustic instruments like drums/acoustic guitar REALLY need room treatment.

 

[watchtheworld]

well that isn't me.that's my friends. haha i didn't feel brave enough to post mine. but we have/did similar things in our recordings.

also, i have seen some crude ideas of sound deadening by some of my friends and they were throwing thick comforter/blankets over the amp and microphone. does this have any effect whatsoever? because i do have a back room, but i'm ont really intending on plastering it up with foam if the effort is minimal/or nonexistant.

 

[Dani Pace]

When I want a dry sounding guitar I use a solid state amp, for a wet sound I use a tube amp. I try to keep post processing to a minimum and rely on the original sound of the guitar/amp as much as possible. The volume and tone settings on the guitar will also have an effect, lower tone settings seem wetter as do lower volume settings. Setting the tone to treble not only gives you a brighter sound, it tends to dry the sound a little. Use a limiter instead of a compressor to get a dryer sound too, and very little or no reverb. You might also want to increase the presence (brillance) a little to give the guitar a more biting sound. Smaller speakers (10s or even 8s) seem to have a dryer sound but may be too twangy to suit your taste. It's largely a matter of making adjustments until you hear what you want to hear, try these ideas and a few of your own.

 

[Monkey Allen]

I liked the 'poorly' recorded song a thousand times better than the fancy 'well' recorded song. What Danny and Dani say is good advice. Mic placement, the room, the instruments you use, type of mic and all that are key things to worry about.

 

[watchtheworld]

well okay.

the presence is another key term i've been hearing. how do i increase the presence? i also know how to pan things to the left and right and such. but that obviously only goes so far.

and about the amps, i would do that, but i'm strictly recording acoustic.

and for a limiter, can i get a program, or is there such a preset on the Cool edit pro? and if this isn't the right place to ask i'll ask in that forum if you'd like.

also i liek both songs equally as much, but i like the "professional" one's sound not necessarily waht they play. the poorer quality one is fun and exciting.


also i am considering buying a mic. but that would mean i would need a new usb interface, because the one i have doesn't support phantom power.
therefore leads me to my next question.. what mic? ahha. for STRICTLY acoustic and vocal. and preferably under 300

 

[danny.guitar]

well okay.

the presence is another key term i've been hearing. how do i increase the presence? i also know how to pan things to the left and right and such. but that obviously only goes so far.

Normally you can add presence with EQ, but that can usually make things sound worse. You said you were recording strictly acoustic so I wouldn't want to rely on ANY effects whatsoever to get a good sound, except for maybe reverb and other 'polishing' effects like that. You'll want to get the best sound possible at the source (like the 'pro' song you linked to).

and for a limiter, can i get a program, or is there such a preset on the Cool edit pro?

There are a bunch of free limiter plugins out there. Like the W1 Limiter which is supposedly an exact clone of Waves' L1 plugin. You can download it here:
http://www.kvraudio.com/get/1510.html

also i am considering buying a mic. but that would mean i would need a new usb interface, because the one i have doesn't support phantom power.
therefore leads me to my next question.. what mic? ahha. for STRICTLY acoustic and vocal. and preferably under 300

I'd look into the Audio Technica AT series, like the AT4040, etc. Not sure which ones are under $300.

For a preamp I'd get the M-Audio DMP3. It's $150 new. That leaves about $150 for a mic (not much).

You'd have to ask someone who has more experience with mics on which one to get that will be suitable for both vocals & guitar, and one that fits your budget.

 

[Monkey Allen]

The CADm179 has been mentioned more than twice in the mic forum as a good inexpensive alrounder:

http://www.zzounds.com/a--2676837/item--CADM179

Like all these audio hardware choices...you're in a sea of choice once you dive in. It's not easy to zero in on what you want.

 

[knightfly]

The AT 3035 is available mail order for $199, and is flat from 20-20k. Not just on paper - it sounds better to my ears than the higher priced Shure KSM-27 and KSM-32, which sell for $299 and $499 respectively... Steve

 

[Dani Pace]

How are you micking the guitar now? Mic position is a very important part of how an acoustic guitar sounds. Try different placements, clocer to the bridge might help. The angle of the mic (relative to the guitar) will change the sound also. A deader room should help to make an acoustic sound dryer. Room reflections often make acoustis guitars sound wetter (less room ambience= dryer sound in thes case.) The AT 3035 is a good mic for acoustic guitar, and a good drum mic if you want to use one for that too. If your acoustic has a pickup you can combine a direct signal with a mic (or more than 1 mic) to get more variety and control. The choice of body style will also have an affect. Larger body guitars have a fuller sound (more resonance) while smaller bodies and thin bodies have more twang and a dryer sound. Brighter (sounding) strings might help to give you a dryer sound. There are lots of variables to consider when trying to get a certain sound, experimentation with patience is the best way to find what works best in any situation. Even a little room treatment is better than no room treatment, especialy when recording acoustic instruments. For now, keep trying and good luck. dan

 

[watchtheworld]

alright haha all this sounds good. i think i am going to get a new mic. there's really not much post recording i can do to the guitar to make it sound better.


i think i'm going to get one of the AT series.

and the pre-amp i think i'm going to go with is thisss

http://www.zzounds.com/a--2676837/item--TASUS144

it includes cubase and gigastudio.

and for the room treatment i'm going to plaster in my closet probably. haha

thank you to everyone who helped!

 

[knightfly]

Best and least expensive "upgrade" you could do to your room is get rid of the carpet and FORGET foam - search the STUDIO forum on those two words and you'll see why.

And I doubt you could go wrong with nearly ANY of the AT mics - I have the 4033, Pro 25, ATM 25, and an AT897 short shotgun (mostly for video work) and I wouldn't send ANY of 'em back... Steve

 

[Nick98338]

I would agree that the "far away" sound is caused by picking up too much of the room. So, do what you can to not pick up the room. Treat the room, or at least put a lot of stuff in the room. Doesn't have to be special "acoustic" sound absorbing stuff. Just normal stuff.. furniture, curtains, chairs.. just about any kind of stuff. Or, use a smaller room. Get the sound source closer to the mics. Or, use a mic with a cardioid pattern. Not omnidirectional. Some mics... like CAD and AT just sort of sound more "up front".. closer.. than some other mics do.