Wanted Dead or Not Alive....

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RAMI

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OK, I was going to wait until my other tune was off page one, because I don't like having more than one song up at once. I tried waiting until my other tune fell off page one, but it keeps getting bumped.

So, this is a song I finished about a month ago and showed to the guys that I really trust in the Tone Thread. But since it's a finished song, I figured I'd post it here and get other people's impressions.

Thanx in advance. :)

WANTED DEAD OR NOT ALIVE
 
Well, I guess when you're on top of the page, you're on top of the page.

Kind of like being on top of the world but different. :D

I downloaded it and when I get a chance I'll have a listen.
:D
 
RAMI said:
Thanx Karen. :D

I think you already heard it, but maybe not the final version. You might have heard it instrumental.
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Actually Tom, as in Petty. From the album Echoes. :D

No Carpenters here.
 
Don't knock the Carpenters. She was a great singer and drummer.

Actually....a little sidebar......I remember seeing a short documentary, and they were supposedly the first "Commercial" group to have a ballad that had a really distorted guitar solo on the fade out. That actually led to what is now commonly referred to as the heavy rock ballad. My memory's vague, so I might have it totally wrong. I wish I could remember which tune it is. I'll try to think of it.
 
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She was. No denying that.

Ok, had a listen. Good mix, good tune, good instrumental balance.


Here I go turning the tables. :D I'd like to hear a bit of a crisper snare. It sounds good, don't get me wrong, I'd just like it to "crack" a bit more. Maybe even just a bit more verb on it with the verb EQed.

Onto the guitars. You are always saying you're not really a guitar player, or otherwise questioning your skills.

Not the case. The guitar parts are perfect for the songs, and I guarantee if a "real" guitar player were to do a cover of your tunes, they would be woodshedding for a bit to learn the parts and mimic your style.
So don't sell youself short.
 
RFR said:
She was. No denying that.

Ok, had a listen. Good mix, good tune, good instrumental balance.


Here I go turning the tables. :D I'd like to hear a bit of a crisper snare. It sounds good, don't get me wrong, I'd just like it to "crack" a bit more. Maybe even just a bit more verb on it with the verb EQed.

Onto the guitars. You are always saying you're not really a guitar player, or otherwise questioning your skills.

Not the case. The guitar parts are perfect for the songs, and I guarantee if a "real" guitar player were to do a cover of your tunes, they would be woodshedding for a bit to learn the parts and mimic your style.
So don't sell youself short.
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Thanx a lot. You know you're right about the snare.

Actually, now that I've let it sit and am now listening to it for the first time in about 2 weeks or maybe more, I'm hearing several things that can and should be better. Not only mix issues, but performance wise, too.

Vocally, I it needs to pick up in emotion, especially on the last chorus. It almost sounds like you can interchange the fist chorus with the last, and that shouldn't be the case. The last chorus needs something. Either more emotion in the lead vocal or some harmonies....or both.

Yeah, I can make this tune better. I should have listened after letting it sit before I posted it. Then, I wouldn't have posted it because I would have realized it ain't finished.

Anyway, I'm always open to other opinions on the mix or whatever other suggestions peeps might have.
 
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This is the Carpenter's tune I was talking about. Besides the guitar solo, listen to her voice. She was incredible.

 
Well you are your best (and worst) critic.

Gotta get it to where you can be proud.

I see what you're saying about needing some more build, but that's a production issue.

On the mix itself, having listened to a lot if your stuff, it and others sound a little too clean.
Lets take two live records from a world class band the Rolling Stones. Get your ya yas out and the steel wheels tour.

To me despite how pristine steel wheels is, I prefer the raw sound of ya yas.

Part of that view comes from having an analog background, but it's something i dig for rock and roll. A bit of grit. Soundwise.

I dig your stuff, but for me, just a bit more grit would take it over the top.
:D

Disclaimer: these are my opinions alone, and I expect no one to share them, nor take me serious :D
 
RFR said:
Well you are your best (and worst) critic.

Gotta get it to where you can be proud.

I see what you're saying about needing some more build, but that's a production issue.

On the mix itself, having listened to a lot if your stuff, it and others sound a little too clean.
Lets take two live records from a world class band the Rolling Stones. Get your ya yas out and the steel wheels tour.

To me despite how pristine steel wheels is, I prefer the raw sound of ya yas.

Part of that view comes from having an analog background, but it's something i dig for rock and roll. A bit of grit. Soundwise.

I dig your stuff, but for me, just a bit more grit would take it over the top.
:D

Disclaimer: these are my opinions alone, and I expect no one to share them, nor take me serious :D
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I totally get what you're saying. I'm the opposite, sort of. What I mean is I don't think it's an analog background thing, so much as it is just having a preference for something more raw.

For me, a perfect example is which side of the fence Deep Purple fans fall when it comes to comparing "Machine Head" with "Made in Japan", which is pretty much "Machine Head Live". Most people I know, especially musicians, prefer the live album, and I can see why. The performances are incredible. It's probably the best live hard rock album ever, and there are no studio overdubs on it. It's totally live and so good.

But, I still prefer the studio versions of every song. I just do. The studio version is....perfect, but not "Alan parson Project" perfect. It still has balls, attitude, etc....

So, it just comes down to a matter of preference. I like controlled, raw energy on an audio recording. If I was at the concert, then being part of the energy and having visual stimulation changes my expectations and perception of everything.
 
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Different schools of thought. For sure.
Made in Japan is the shit. One of my all time favorite records. Except child in time. Musically brilliant, but when he starts screaming, I wanna strangle him. Lol.

When I go back to machine head, which I grew up on and heard first, it sounds a bit more lifeless. I still love it, but prefer MIJ.


Back to the mixing. As I've been exploring the daw world I'm painfully aware of the crisp, cleanness. Comparing full analog mixes of the same song to it's all ITB counterpart, I prefer the sound of the all analog mix. Fatter, and dirtier. I guess it's that harmonic distortion, or something. Or maybe the staging of all the channels each adding a bit of flavor to the 2 buss.

However, I also like very much the clean crispness of the digital. So it's a matter of getting the best of both worlds.

As to you my friend, your songs and mixes are to the point where you need no critique, and could just post them with the attitude of "here's my song, fuck you if you dont like it, its the way i want it". :D

Like i said earlier, you gotta make yourself proud.

Me? Well, I enjoy listening to them. Thanks for sharing.
:thumbs up:

Edit: Should we take this to pm? We're the only ones dicussing it. :D :D
 
Edit: Should we take this to pm? We're the only ones dicussing it. :D :D
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Nah, it doesn't matter. We can leave it here, we're talking music. Other tunes will push this one down eventually. I have to re-work it anyway, so I'm good with that. If anyone has any mix suggestions anyway, I'm always open.

RFR said:
As to you my friend, your songs and mixes are to the point where you need no critique, and could just post them with the attitude of "here's my song, fuck you if you dont like it, its the way i want it". :D
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Thanx dude. This is really just a hobby for me. I have no delusions. I'm just trying to make music that I like. I find people end up writing their best songs when they stop worrying about what's "commercial" or "current". I'm just having fun with it. I just love writing, recording, the whole process. It's fun. It should be, anyway. :)
 
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RAMI said:
Thanx dude. This is really just a hobby for me. I have no delusions. I'm just trying to make music that I like. I find people end up writing their best songs when they stop worrying about what's "commercial" or "current". ++++++EDIT++++++
I'm just having fun with it. I just love writing, recording, the whole process. It's fun. It should be anyway. :)
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THIS ^^^:thumbs up:

I'm a newb at this hobby and not qualified to critique the mix from an A.E viewpoint((I'd shit donuts if I could produce something this good!!!)sound wise)
From my listener opinion platform I'd like some more hair on this, more grit. Besides that very good !!!!!

I agree the commercial music cookie cutter never rests, justs keeps filling the box but
Don't care about this:
RAMI said:
I see some people driving themselves nuts trying to write something that's "commercial" (as if anyone even buys music any more, so what's the point) that it sounds so contrived, predictable, and bland as all fuck because it's anything but original. And they're usually the ones that get the most defensive at any criticism, so they're not even willing to try and get better, and they're too wound up tight about their music that they don't really enjoy it.
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They named a dog after the siblings - new breed a Carpenteria.
The solo isn't worth waitig for - not all that flash a double track on the other side either. Songs, voice & drumming were all class a bit like RAMI except he rocks as does this track mate!
 
rayc said:
They named a dog after the siblings - new breed a Carpenteria.
The solo isn't worth waitig for - not all that flash a double track on the other side either. Songs, voice & drumming were all class a bit like RAMI except he rocks as does this track mate!
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You talking about the Carpenters solo? Yeah, I agree, but it's also a long time ago. Nothing special about that solo at all, but I think it was ground breaking to do that in a ballad at the time.
 
BCF1 said:
(I'd shit donuts if I could produce something this good!!!)
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Thanx man. I have no technical knowledge above what most other people have. If my stuff sounds good, then anyone's stuff can sound good.
From my listener opinion platform I'd like some more hair on this, more grit.
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I think I agree 100%. That's why I'm not really happy with it. It needs more work and less rigidness. That's what I was getting at before. Thanx a lot for taking the time to listen and comment.:cool:
 
RFR said:
When I go back to machine head, which I grew up on and heard first, it sounds a bit more lifeless. I still love it, but prefer MIJ.
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I think sometimes it simply comes down to which one we heard first. I wore out Machine Head and then got "Japan" a few months later. By that time, I got to used to Machine head. Had I heard "Japan" first, I might like those versions better.

A good example of that is Frampton. I can't stand the studio version of any song that's on "Frampton Comes Alive" because I got used to the live album first. So, I think what we heard first plays a big part in what we like better.
 
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