Tuning before/during recording

[cellardweller]

How often do most people find it necessary to tune during recording? I seem to be having a lot of trouble staying in tune. I get tuned up, two chords later my E is slightly sharp, etc...

Have you noticed a difference between standing/sitting(tuning while sitting then standing)?

This problem persists with both guitars I use. Do I need to change strings more often? If so, I guess it's a very fine line, and short life span for optimal tuning permanence.

 

[spankenstein]

http://edrose.com/preparation.htm

The "Take Care of Your Instruments" section is as accurate as can be.

If you aren't playing... tune.

 

[Light]

On my acoustics, I can generally do a couple of takes before I need to tune, but I ALWAYS check before I hit the red button. Depending on the guitar, the setup, how you play, and the style of music, it should last at least that long.

The other thing I would say is that you should learn to tune by ear, as an electronic tuner will never do as good of a job (just ask a piano tuner). I tune the "A" string to a tuning fork, and then I tune all of the "A"s to the open "A" string (fifth fret on the "E" strings, seventh fret on the "D" string, second fret on the "G" String, and the tenth fret on the "B" string). I then play a big E power chord (0799[12][12]). This works for me, as I am usually playing a lot of chords and lines which span 5-7 frets at a time, plus open strings at the same time. If I am going to be playing a folk song, or something like that, which is primarily in the first position, I will tune to the "one" chord of the key I am playing in. Tuning by ear (once you get good at it) is faster than using a tuner (takes me about 15-25 seconds).


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[StevenLindsey]

If you're having to tune every two chords, you need some setup work or just a new guitar.

And Light is right, a tuner will get you in the ball park but you still have to use your harmonics to get it really sweet.

 

[cellardweller]

Bad habits

I've never had any lessons of any sort, and never researched, or even asked questions like this, though I've been playing off and on for 15 years. As you can imagine, I've developed some bad habits. I used to tune by harmonics, but for some reason found it was quicker or whatever to tune just by letting consecutive strings ring open together (is that a 5th?). Of course, on the B, I would fret the 1st fret. Does this sound like an inaccurate way of tuning?

I just had one of my guitars in to get 'set up' 2-3 months ago, it's an Epiphone... Maybe I do need a new guitar, though my allowance has been spent for this year (and probably next!!!)

 

[spankenstein]

Re: Bad habits

I've never had any lessons of any sort, and never researched, or even asked questions like this, though I've been playing off and on for 15 years. As you can imagine, I've developed some bad habits. I used to tune by harmonics, but for some reason found it was quicker or whatever to tune just by letting consecutive strings ring open together (is that a 5th?). Of course, on the B, I would fret the 1st fret. Does this sound like an inaccurate way of tuning?

I just had one of my guitars in to get 'set up' 2-3 months ago, it's an Epiphone... Maybe I do need a new guitar, though my allowance has been spent for this year (and probably next!!!)

Holding a fret on the string you're tuning will IMO not be accurate.

I'm a firm tuner believer. With a well setup guitar there shouldn't be anything "out" when tuned. Obviously with acoustcs and 3 saddle bridges You have to compensate by the key of the song because of the lack of intonation precision.

Of course now the temperment discussions can start..... (or not).

 

[tjohnston]

If you are turning the air conditioning or heater off to record beware that small changes in temperature will cause the guitar to go out of tune. Sloppy stringing and cheap tuners will do this as well.

 

[cellardweller]

Please define "sloppy stringing", and what would be the correct way to put strings on?

I have no ventilation in my rec. room whatsoever, unless I open the door and stick a fan in it..., and there is no heater running (yet)...

 

[tjohnston]

sloppy stringing is when you dont secure and wind the strings around the tuning pegs correctly. There is a proper way to secure the strings bass and treble strings! There is a few diagrams on the web somewhere.

 

[TexRoadkill]

If you're having to tune every two chords, you need some setup work or just a new guitar.

And Light is right, a tuner will get you in the ball park but you still have to use your harmonics to get it really sweet.

If you go by harmonics don't you end up with pure intervals instead of even tempered? It would work for open strings but then fretted notes will be slightly off and any other instruments will be slightly off.

I usually tune for the attack with a tuner. I'll constantly play the not while tuning rather than tune for the sustained note.

 

[Light]

Please define "sloppy stringing", and what would be the correct way to put strings on?

I have no ventilation in my rec. room whatsoever, unless I open the door and stick a fan in it..., and there is no heater running (yet)...

How to String a Guitar


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[Light]

If you go by harmonics don't you end up with pure intervals instead of even tempered? It would work for open strings but then fretted notes will be slightly off and any other instruments will be slightly off.

I usually tune for the attack with a tuner. I'll constantly play the not while tuning rather than tune for the sustained note.

Yeah, harmonics will never get you right. You need to tune to fretted notes. Like I said, for my style of playing, the best thing is to tune to a big open E chord which spans all six strings. Most people seem to like the sound of a guitar I have tuned this way, but it is necessary to experiment.

The problems with electronic tuners are many. With the exception of strobe tuners, they are only accurate to within 2-3 cents. I can hear much finer than that, so for me that is not good enough. Additionally, in order to have chords be in tune with them selves (which is very important when a chord has many tensions and close intervals, as mine usually do) the tuner will not work well. For simpler chords, tuners are OK, but I have never had luck with them.

Here is an article about intonation and temperament, which has some bearing on the issue.

The intervals between the strings on the guitar are fourths and a major third between the G and the B.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[Cyrokk]

My typical tuning approach is to tune the open string to the 2nd fret two strings down: With the open E in tune with the perfect fifth on the 5th string 2nd fret, then the D string 2nd fret to the open E on the sixth, the G string 2nd fret to the open A, the B string, 3rd fret to the open D, and the 1st string E at the third fret with the G string.

It works well with my style, which is rife with double and triple stops, sus4ths, sus2nds and ninth chords.

 

[Doug H]

I tend to tune by playing chords. The home studio sucks because there's no band to play with and I have a hell of a time tuning to bass samples. I just can't hear the overtones well through my monitoring chain.

As I'm sure will be/has been covered, guitars are never in tune. Get it close, make sure the top and bottom are pitched and there isn't a chord that sounds too disodent.

 

[zipperhead]

I tune with tuner using a 12th fret harmonic and it works well...for me. If your intonation is on the money for the strings and guitar you are using, everything should go well.

If you have a tuner, you can check your intonation simply. Tune the 12th harmonic to proper note. Fret the 12th fret and compare. If the fretted one is higher, you need to adjust your adjustable saddle on that string to lengthen the string. The reverse otherwise. Loosen the string before adjusting.

When I put a different brand or weight of string on my guitar, I always check the intonation again.

Maybe you could consider going with a slightly heavier gauge of string. The lighter they are, the more susceptible they are to going out of tune. Thicker strings, I use a .9 on the hi E, sound meatier too. Good Luck, 2Ner

 

[monty]

"Cowards can never be moral."

...and you're not a musician if you can't tune by ear.

 

[Light]

If you have a tuner, you can check your intonation simply. Tune the 12th harmonic to proper note. Fret the 12th fret and compare. If the fretted one is higher, you need to adjust your adjustable saddle on that string to lengthen the string. The reverse otherwise. Loosen the string before adjusting.

You simply can not do an adequate job of intonation with an electronic or digital tuner. You also can not do it by ear. The only way to do it properly is with a strobe tuner. Electronic and digital tuners are only accurate to within 3-5 cents. A strobe tuner is accurate to within considerably less than 1 cent. Considering the high cost of a strobe tuner, you should probably just get it done professionally, which is not that expensive. It is, however, a good idea to get it done when ever you permanently change the gauge of strings you use, just as it is wise to get everything else adjusted.

Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[Light]

...and you're not a musician if you can't tune by ear.

I wouldn't say that, but I do think the reason so many people like tuners is that they never really learned how to tune by ear.

I guess the most telling reason for tuning by ear is to consider the fact that the best piano tuners, to this day, tune pianos by ear. There is no electronic tuner which is as good as the human ear.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[Clive Hugh]

Monty, as you get older you lose some/a lot of your hearing and with it your ability to tune by ear. Your turn will come. And while we are on the subject, Beethoven was stone deaf but continued to write, are you saying he wasn't a musician because he couldn't hear what he was playing?
Plus you might not be able to tune as well as you get deaf, but you sure as hell know it's out of tune.

Back to the tuners, try this
E- 440
A- 439.
D- 439.5
G- 439.5
B- 439.75
E- 440

I got that off a pedal steel article a few years back and it is pretty good.

 

[FattMusiek]

I usually tune before recording and am good to go. Both of my guitars have horrible intonation issues (I guess that's what it is) and I find myself playing AROUND the song, as opposed to how I would like to play it. On my guitars, the higher the fret, the worse it sounds.

Hope I could be of service (which I doubt).