Tube amps on a budget...

[Toker41]

For the record, my arsenal consist of:

Mesa Dual Rec. 3 ch stack.
Mesa Dual Rec 2ch stack
Mesa Studio pre with Mesa 50/50
Mesa Boogie Mark IV
Mesa Boogie Mark III
2 Marshall JCM800 100w stacks
Marshall JCM800 50w stack
Marshall JCM 800 combo
Marshall JCM900 stack
Fender Twin Reverb
Fender Super Twin


There are a few more including older Ampeg's, and Vox, and a newer solid state Roland that is amazing, but I don't want to come off as bragging.



My point is that they ALL sound great, but not all Boogie. I simply listed what I believed to be the most versatile, best sounding from clean to heavy crunch, and best built (most durable) with the best customer service. I suggest spending a bit more instead of spending a lot more later always chasing that perfect tone because you go through a lot of cheaper crap before you finally step into quality tone, and equipment. In no way did I ever suggest, or state I was a "tone god". Fact is, those amps that I said sucked (the ones I QUOTED) are cheaply made, do not sound very good, have poor customer service, and are mostly capable of only one tone that is even close to decent (and I use the term loosely). If I could start over, I would certainly get good equipment to start instead of chasing it for years to the tune of thousands of dollars. In the end you will spend A LOT less money if you just spend a little more now. Mow some lawns, sell some lemonade, turn tricks on the corner if you must. It will keep you from eventually kicking yourself.

I do not believe this view is buying into my "own bullshit", or calls for an attack using words like "tone god".

But whatever.....

 

[soundchaser59]

You really don't justify a response from me sonny. You have issues - perhaps a good enima would help ya'

Maybe your amp needs an enima?

I did everything Toker41 said not to do, I paid out the nose and modded things every which way, I've played more different amps thru more different speakers than you'll ever see in your life, amps that went outa business before you were born.....

And Toker41 is right. I got outa the tone suck hole by doing exactly what his post says....... I cycled thru all the crap, I wasted a ton of money, and I wish I had just bought a much better amp in the first place.

Your attack is absolutely unjustified. This place is ALL about opinions, and Toker41 is just as entitled as anyone else to voice his opinion of what constitutes good gear and not worth it gear, especially if his opinion just happens to agree with thousands of other people who have gone thru the same tone grinder I have. You can disagree and voice your own opinion, but do it with respect and tact. Otherwise you only degrade your own standing while saying nothing to justify your opnion.

Maybe the delivery was a bit strong, but his goal of trying to spare someone else the wasted money of trudging thru cheap amps that put profit margin before quality sound and solid build is commendable.

I dont have any issues with Peavey, they have been good to me for 35 years, but I'm glad I dont own one now and I'll never buy another one. I've owned several Fenders, the only one worth keeping was the 1984 Twin, but it was not versatile enough. Nothing wrong with it for the right players, but not for me. As far as I'm concerned a bottom of the line Mesa or Rivera will walk circles around any Fender or any Peavey. The little Traynor I had would blast the Blues Jr outa the water for what I'm doing, for the exact same amount of money, and to this day I regret selling that little thing.

If I had back all the money I wasted trying to save money on lesser amps, I could have a Rivera and a Mesa and a Carr and a Brown Note and none of the budget gear mentioned above could ever come close to the tone......and I would have cash left over!

 

[soundchaser59]

the VJ's 8" speaker by itself is a tone monster!

This is the comment that is not worth responding to. I am truly sorry.

Someday you'll wonder what you were thinking.......

But I'm glad there are people out there willing to buy the Epiphone tone monsters, so the rest of us meek souls dont have to face them!

Too much fun.....

Your turn

 

[Vulconizer]

I'll second Traynor amps. I have one and cannot see ever selling it.

40 watts of tone that totally does the trick for me. Might not be the right thing for others, but worth a listen for sure.

 

[eyema_believer]

Don't waste your money on any of those amps. They all suck, and you will only end up spending your time forever trying to get a usable tone out of them.

I own two Crate V-series amps. I love them. Haven't had a bit of trouble with them either. One was even in an accident with the equipment van. A really bad accident.

Oh...... I just bought a real amp... a Mesa. I've had a heck of a time getting it to sound as good as my Crates. They also put any Fender under $1000.00 to shame. The Vox AC30 might give it a run, at 2 or 3 times it's price, but the AC30 is made in China, and my Crates and made in the USA.

For the record, I make my living playing my guitar. Been a while since I came out of the garage.

Peace!

~Shawn

 

[elenore19]

I lo-o-o-ve me my Fender Super Champ XD (SCXD) - it's one of the new "hybrid" amps, although it's "reverse" hybrid with a digital modeling preamp and a full-tube Class A/B power amp. 15 tube watts.

I don't know about not being loud enough to play with drums. It seems loud enough for me - mine has bass that rattles windows on 4. Also, upgrading the speaker gets you more volume. It can always be miked (and should).

I can't stop talking about this amp. I love the sound, but also the price and features.

I actually bought it online on recommendations and I am not disappointed. But typically I'd recommend trying it first. But you must treat each "voicing" as an amp - play with tone controls and drive, because they have different structures on each setting.

COMPLETELY agree with this post. I got the Super Champ XD off of a recommendation from some people on this site. Best amp I've played. A Very bluesy amp, but if you want other tones, it definitely has it. I play punk and metal mainly. And then the cleans are Fantastic. I play it through a 2x12 with V30's. Makes it sound more crisp and better. But I still like the stock speaker, and it gets just loud enough to get over the drummer I play with. If it had another like 5 watts, it'd be perfect. But still close enough for me!

FANTASTIC amp. Seriously. Name a tone, you can get it from this amp. At least that's how I feel about it. I recently just played a JVM 410H and I love this super champ tons more. Granted, if I messed around with the JVM I'm sure I could equal the quality tone. But then again the JVM cost 6 times more than the super champ.

Sorry for the lengthy message. Just felt the need to really get the point across that this amp kicks ass.

 

[stevieb]

As an aside, I have NO idea why more people don't build hybrids this way...

I'd say it's because it is much cheaper to put a single 12AX7 in there, and market it as a "tube amp." Don't laugh, many makers do just that- Vox, Behringer, etc. Oh, sure, they come clean in the fine print, but how many folks fall for it, either because they don't read the specs, or because they believe that a single pre-amp tube can somehow turn out the same tone as, say, THREE 12AX7's and four EL84's.

And yeah, I got hooked like that once- ART Attack Module AT28. Decent amp for what it was, altho I unloaded it once I cleaned the pots- howled and squeeled like a banshiee piglet after that.

 

[Roguetitan]

Don't waste your money on any of those amps. They all suck, and you will only end up spending your time forever trying to get a usable tone out of them. They are amps meant for kids in their first garage band that don't know anything about tone. Save your money, and buy something more top end. I would recommend Mesa Boogie. Expensive, but well worth it. You can get a used Rectoverb combo for $1000. If that is too much, pick up a used Mesa Boogie Studio Stereo preamp on Ebay for around $300. You will need a tube power amp, but they sound amazing. Metallica, and Kurt Cobain used them just to name a couple. Do yourself a favor, and avoid years, and thousands of dollars chasing a tone you will never get with a cheaply made hunk of crap like Peavey. And whatever you do NEVER waste your money on anything made by Crate. Beg, borrow, or steal to get the money you need for a better amp. The hassle of trying to pay it back will be a lot less headache than trying to make those cheap hunks of garbage sound anything close to good, and it will help you avoid throwing good money after bad.



Edit: Here ya go. A LOT of bang for the buck.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesa-Boogie-Mar...ryZ10171QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Dude to say that the Valve King is a piece of crap you have aparently never played thru one I also own a Mesa Big Block Titan V 12 for bass which is really good amp but to be honest with you I was not that impressed with the Mesa you listed. in fact I would take the Valve king over that pirticular model. now a Road King or a Roadster those are worth a doubletake
I am not going to call others crap when I know different.

I am not too impressed with the new Peavey S 32 mixer we bought but that is another thread.

 

[famous beagle]

Yeah this is just getting silly y'all. Sound is a matter of opinion when it all comes down to it.

Someone earlier said that a bottom of the line Boogie or Rivera would beat any Fender. I don't know if he's talking about new stuff only, but I totally disagree.

I've owned both Riveras and Boogies, and I'll never own another. It's not that they're not good amps; they're just not the sound I prefer.

And that's what it really comes down to for everyone. If it sounds good to you, then who cares?


There have been successful guitar players using "crap" gear and making that a large part of their sound: Jack White and Kurt Cobain come to mind. (Jaguars used to be considered crap guitars before the grunge movement made them popular again.)

And what about Hound Dog Taylor? That guy used a plastic guitar and a bottom-of-the-line Sears Roebuck amp. And who's to say that he didn't have tone?

Anyway ...

 

[ggunn]

As far as I'm concerned a bottom of the line Mesa or Rivera will walk circles around any Fender or any Peavey.

That's very subjective. I've got a Deluxe Reverb and a Son Of Boogie, and I much prefer the sound of the Fender. The Mesa is louder, but so what?

 

[Toker41]

:

Dude to say that the Valve King is a piece of crap you have aparently never played thru one I also own a Mesa Big Block Titan V 12 for bass which is really good amp but to be honest with you I was not that impressed with the Mesa you listed. in fact I would take the Valve king over that pirticular model. now a Road King or a Roadster those are worth a doubletake
I am not going to call others crap when I know different.

I am not too impressed with the new Peavey S 32 mixer we bought but that is another thread.

Wow, not impressed with "the model" I listed. I listed a bunch of them, which one are you referring too?

I also own some lower grade amps:


Peavey classic 30
Beheringer V-amp Pro (laugh if you want, but this has GREAT clean tones).
Line 6 Pod Pro (biggest hunk of crap I own).
I had a 5150, but finally sold it the other day because it's crap.

My 2 bass amps are a Boogie 400, and an old Fender that I keep around because the old timers seem to like it even though it's got a buzz that I can't seem to shake.

It would take forever to list all my equipment, and shouldn't really even be necessary. Fact is that I suggested Mesa Boogie for reasons that go beyond great tone. I've played through Valve Kings, and didn't care for them. It would take a lot less time to list the types of amps I have no experience with.
I'm not talking out of my ass, and would not comment on an amp that I have no experience with. The only Peavey I would recommend would be VTM120, or VTM60.


Those that don't like the Mesa Dual Rec: Have you tried 6L6's in it, as well as EL 34's (brings it closer to a Marshall sound, but with a bit more clarity, and warmer bottom end). Did you change it from "bold" to "spongy"? There are so many different ways to run those heads, that I doubt many of you that bash them have ever spent more than a few minutes with them. It's funny that nobody has listed one reason they don't like them, other than "I'm not impressed with it".

 

[Roguetitan]

That's very subjective. I've got a Deluxe Reverb and a Son Of Boogie, and I much prefer the sound of the Fender. The Mesa is louder, but so what?

who needs louder if you are using sound reinforcement anyway?

 

[famous beagle]

:

It's funny that nobody has listed one reason they don't like them, other than "I'm not impressed with it".

It's also funny that you haven't listed reasons why you don't like amps, other than "they're crap."

 

[Toker41]

Yes, I have. Lack of: Tone, versatility, reliability, customer service, durability, etc. Read my posts.

 

[famous beagle]

Yes, I have. Lack of: Tone, versatility, reliability, customer service, durability, etc. Read my posts.

Ok, now I see it. You lumped them all into one "those amps have bad tone, bad customer service, etc."

Well I don't play Boogies because they lack tone. They lack the tone I like. I don't know about their customer service, and the two I owned seemed very reliable.

Sure, they're versatile, but in my experience, the more versatility an amp has, the more the tone suffers. Again, that's in my experience.

 

[Toker41]

Look at the stage of any major rock band from Fleetwood Mac, to Nickelback, to Slayer. A LARGE majority of the times you will see a very limited list of different amps. Mesa Rectifier's are certainly in the top 3. None of those other amps, save Marshall, fender, and a few choice Vox, are anywhere in sight on that scale. I promise you that if you can name a major artist that uses Valve Kings that they have an endorsement deal, and they are more than likely modded. Fact is, Mesa is a well respected, widely used, professional piece of gear. You may like the tone you get, but the argument that it's "crap" is simply not winnable, and is really just kinda ridiculous. Go to a bunch of major studio's and count how many Mesa's, Marshall's, Fender's, and Vox you come across. Then count the number of Peavey's, Crate's, and V3's with 8" speakers you come across. There are respected professional industry standard pieces of equipment, and there is the armature B list.
So, I stick by my original statement. When it comes to your guitar rig, buy pro gear so you only have to spend the money once. You really take a beating on resale on the B stuff.

 

[eyema_believer]

'Tube amps on a budget...'Tube amps on a budget...'Tube amps on a budget...

 

[MatchBookNotes]

Guys; I appreciate the posts and the suggestions but can't we have a separate thread for the pissing contests? I mean it amuses me to see a bunch of people e-fighting but bloody hell why can't we be friends? WHY CAN"T WE BE FRIENDS! I know you work for the CIA but why can't we be friends?

 

[Gidge]

yep, them major label guys may go with certain brands, but all across the South, I see guys gig with Peaveys that are reliable and have tone....

 

[ggunn]

yep, them major label guys may go with certain brands, but all across the South, I see guys gig with Peaveys that are reliable and have tone....

I was at a rich guy's backyard party a few months ago, and a local guitar hero was playing. I noticed that he was getting an absolutely incredible tone from his PRS guitar. I walked up to the stage to see his amp; it was an old beat up tweed Peavey Vintage 50, and he wasn't playing through that amp because he can't afford something else.

Use what works for you, guys, and ignore anyone who makes a blanket statement like "all XYZ amps are crap". It's all subjective.