The "BlowMeAndKissMyAss" 2005 Award goes to

[easychair]

I thought it was weird and disloyal for him to rat out doc rock. I can't imagine what he was thinking that they'd do. "You better get in there and defend yourselves, pals." Sometimes he seems like a decent enough guy, and then something like this comes up and shakes my faith in people.

Really? I think apl is a freakin' wingnut, but I can't see him looking for anything but a good outcome for both Rockdoc and the people at Carvin. I would bet money he was hoping everything would work out for both sides, and just wanted to let Carvin know they had a chance to defuse a less than good situation. I can't see him ratting anyone. I don't think he's like that.

 

[TheRockDoc]

Really? I think apl is a freakin' wingnut, but I can't see him looking for anything but a good outcome for both Rockdoc and the people at Carvin. I would bet money he was hoping everything would work out for both sides, and just wanted to let Carvin know they had a chance to defuse a less than good situation. I can't see him ratting anyone. I don't think he's like that.

Originally Posted by apl

He didn't buy anything. He was expecting to be drooled over when he walked in with an old product.

Yep, I'm sure he was lookin out for me

 

[easychair]

Well, to be fair, you posted this right before he posted that, as your ideal way it would have worked out.

"Hi doc, we want you to be proud that you bought a Carvin. We'll get this fixed up real nice for you so that you'll really get turned on to the experience of owning one. BTW, have you been to our website? There's a pic of one just like yours. You know, we have special programs for people who are previous Carvin owners, what's your email so I can keep in touch with you. Do you like the Koa wood on your double neck? Next time there is a special, I'll be sure to contact you...

To the casual observer it would seem you are annoyed about more than the $20.

 

[apl]

I thought it was weird and disloyal for him to rat out doc rock. I can't imagine what he was thinking that they'd do. "You better get in there and defend yourselves, pals." Sometimes he seems like a decent enough guy, and then something like this comes up and shakes my faith in people.

Hey, boo.

Usually I associate "ratting out" as reporting someone's law- or rule-breaking to an authority with the power to punish, and my loyalties to doc or Carvin are minimal beyond the generic respect I try to show to everybody. Are you under the assumption that what's said on this board stays on this board? I was curious about how they'd respond to this. Carvin is a small enough company, family owned, that I figured someone would come by and say something. It's sad when two parties get so angry with each other over these kind of things, no matter who's at fault or who started it.

Bottom line is that doc's got a very nice guitar, nicely fixed up, shipped per his preferences.

As I mentioned in the allusion to the soup nazi, I'd be back for more from Carvin unless they intentionally stole my money and never sent me anything. Funny comment doc made somewhere earlier that he might have put down way more than $1500 for another Carvin. That'd be hard to do. The most expensive guitar they have in stock today is $1479 plus case plus shipping is this California Carved Top C6M.

 

[Track Rat]

Well, no carvin for me.

 

[Treeline]

There's more, but if you think that qualifies me as an arrogant prima donna, I'm sorry to hear it man.

Not a bit of it, RD. My post points out that this dispute escalated in a way that has you looking like one - and unfairly so because I don't think you are one. As you explained clearly, you became offended when the Carvin rep hung up the phone and it got worse when you called back and Mike cooled to your request. Don't be worried about what I think - I'm in your corner; you're the customer.

BTW, Mike's response was not blackmail. It's evidence of poor conflict training but nothing more.

So what do you think made him shut off the light so quickly? Was he reamed out by his supervisor? Or was it a combination of that and then getting reamed out by you three minutes later as well? Put yourself in his shoes for a minute. He may have concluded, or may have been told - that further discussions were not going to get anywhere good and he was to stop them. Whether a smart policy or not, might that have explained some of what you experienced?

Were you more angry than you really had to be over this when you called them back? How much of the escalation does Carvin own - and how much do you own?

The problem is this whole thing has nothing to do with twenty bucks; it has to do with respect or the perceived lack of it. You perceived the lack of it when you inquired as a good customer and got a yes / no on the shipping charge, followed by their apparent hostility. They may have perceived the lack of it from you in the way you handled their error and your apparent hostility. In the end, does it really matter who was right? Is being right over twenty bucks really worth this much anger? Is there a better way for both of you to have handled it? Are you both ready to fix it now? All it would take is a phone call - leave the twenty bucks out of it.


So my question remains - what is each of you prepared to do to fix this?

And I believe it is still Mike's serve.

 

[Reggie]

I don't know about Carvin, but where I work, shipping quotes are actually "shipping estimates." Shipping rates are controlled by the freight companies; not by Carvin. And it is getting increasingly difficult to give accurate shipping estimates with all the surcharges UPS and other places keep tacking on due to gas prices and such. I really doubt Carvin is trying to make some extra doe by overcharging you for shipping, but I don't know. I would find out the shipping weight and the zip codes, and see what kind of shipping rates you could get yourself with UPS or something.

 

[cellardweller]

I'll cast my lot with the "faith in Carvin shaken" group.

 

[Metal Ist Krieg]

I know the Roc Doc personally. I'm the guy who originally repaired the guitar and said that it may be something they'd have to look at to be sure it would be fixed properly because it was a problem I'd never encountered before. I also know, as a repair tech, that dealing with corperate companies is very often a serious pain in the ass. From what he told me as well as what I've seen him do on a professional/personal level dealing with people, I'd venture to say that RD handled himself professionally as he could and I'd have to say that carvin dropped the ball seriously on this one... You have to think... Ok, RD had a shitty flight, probably was tired and bedraggled when he showed up... Carvin should have maintained a professional personna whether or not RD was rude....(which I do not believe he was, I've seen him tired and stressed and he's never been rude to my knowledge) Also, the fact that a guy flew across the country to drop off a guitar should have been flattering, AND for RD to spend the time he spent searching for the guitar should have also been flattering...(he looked for this guitar for a very long time.) He brought this guitar to them to have it looked at by the people who built it. They blew him off from the beginning, and the last straw was the misquote on the shipping/arguments/hanging up. Who in the hell hangs up on a customer???? especially when they have something the customer owns in their possession? What gives? Does Carvin do this alot? Probably not because not alot of customers make a habit of flying from one coast to the other to drop off a guitar to their repair shop. If it were me, I wouldn't even want the damned thing. There's other double neck guitars on the planet(80's model BC Rich Bich Double neck comes to mind as a great replacement) And to everyone who says "he bought an old guitar... etc..." should know that I also build instruments, and if someone hand-delivered an instrument I built 20 years ago to my doorstep for repairs I'd be deeply touched by that... Carvin missed that, and their customer service department reminds me of Wal-Mart.

 

[apl]

...it may be something they'd have to look at to be sure it would be fixed properly because it was a problem I'd never encountered before.

What was the problem?

 

[6gun]

Yup. And it's Carvin that's the loser in situations like this, regardless of how they defend their policies.

 

[Jamal Bucket]

if someone hand-delivered an instrument I built 20 years ago to my doorstep for repairs I'd be deeply touched by that...

just thought this was a good point .

 

[TheRockDoc]

I press the option for shipping/tracking an order
"Thank you for calling Carvin, this is ____speaking"
"Hi, I'd like to get a tracking number for a repair order I had shipped back to me.
"Uh, you'll need to call the repair department, and they're gone for the day (4:13 PST). They'll be here tomorrow"
"Well, don't you have a shipping desk?"
"No"
"So the repair department ships directly- separately from the regular shipping department"

*I did think this was interesting since I couldn't get the dimensions for the box right away a couple of days ago since it was being prepared by the shipping guys*

"OK, so you said ask for the repair department tomorrow?"
"It's one of the prompts when you call the main number"
"But you said ask directly for the repair department..."
"It's one of the prompts when you call the main number"
"Is there anyone specific that I should ask for when I call tomorrow?"
"When you call the main number, it will be one of the prompts"
I thinks to me self -Self- I may be dumb, but I ain't stupid, so with poise and grace..."SO I should hit the prompt for the repair department when I call back"
"Uh huh"
"Ok. thank you, sir"
""****click****"

The click was courtesy of The Big C...

I'm sure **click** is California for, "Thank you for calling Carvin, and have a nice day"

 

[amra]

Allight rock doc, now you are beating a dead horse....if you intentionally act annoying you can't really blame a company for being short.

 

[TheRockDoc]

Allight rock doc, now you are beating a dead horse....if you intentionally act annoying you can't really blame a company for being short.

It is a dead horse...

The Carvin guy was very nice on the phone and so was I. There was no sarcasm in my voice, he did not know my name- unless APL has my phone tapped and his feeding his Carvin guys some private info on me

I just thought that since it was already a dead issue, I would just start fresh. A different department, anonymous, etc. etc. I just wanted the damn tracking number *S*

Don't be mad at me because I thought the guy was a pecker for not listening or answering my question, and hanging up without even saying duh.

Then again, my high pitched nasal whine has to be good for something more than getting me laid...

 

[Treeline]

Well, it's still Mikes serve and he seems to have left the arena for the moment. Maybe he's in the men's room...

 

[Chalz]

As has been said above, it seems like this entire situation has been blown completely out of proportion. While I DO know the complete details (both sides) from beginning to end of this situation, I feel they are not pertinent to my personal agenda at this current time, therefore I will refrain from any comments regarding as such.

I look at it like this:

Mike was informing that there was a mistake. Mistakes happen. We are all human. The only beings that don't make the occasional mistake at Carvin are the CNC and PCB machines. To err is human. When your standard rate is $19.99 for all guitars, you get quite used to typing $19.99. Doublenecks are, well, double the weight of a regular guitar, and larger to boot. They cost more to ship, and we were hoping to clear that up in hopes our mistake could be taken simply as that. Carvin wasn't trying to screw anybody out of anything...screwing customers doesn't really get a company anywhere...unless of course you have share in oil companies. After that point, I will not go on, as that is where it seems the issue arises, and like I said, I'm not trying to come in here and settle an argument or anything.

Now, I will delve into the guitar a bit. In the past I have seen 2 doublenecks re-enter the Carvin doors for repairs. It is always nice to see such a great piece of Carvin history come in to be re-furbished . The techs enjoy working on them, and others enjoy seeing them. One thing I have noticed however, is that Carvin is one of the VERY VERY few major OR minor guitar companies that will work on a guitar that was made over 25 years ago. I find that pretty neat. I have a friend with an old Gibson that needed some work, and he was hoping to send it back to Gibson for some refurbishing. He called, and they were barely shy of laughing in his ear. Fender is the same, and most other comapnies, spare boutique companies that usually charge over $3,500 per instrument. The simple fact alone that Carvin accepted to work on this instrument (one that is 20 years out of warranty, and has been discontinued for 15 years...and that we haven't had the machinery to make in 10 years) speaks highly of the customer service of the company.

When the instrument was brought into the showroom it sounds like there was some confusion...justifiably so. It's not even close to every day that someone brings in a guitar so old for repair, and it is the salespersons job to verify that it is OK for the guitar to be sent in for repair. As for the rest of the details, I don't know, I wasn't there...so no comment.

I stray from my point.

My opinion may be biased, but I believe that Carvin has some of the best customer service in the industry. What Pro-Audio company can you call after you buy a system, and get taught how to set up and run the system? Carvin. What Guitar company would sit on the phone for 15 minutes walking a customer from 5 years ago through how to do a truss rod adjustment? Carvin. What Guitar company would take back a second-hand guitar they sold 25 years ago to try to get it up and running again? About 2%. Carvin is in that 2%.

I apologize you feel your service with Carvin was bad, and hope that in the future you receive the service that you expect from all companies you deal with. For all those who plan on dealing with Carvin in the future and are worried they may have problems, don't fret too much...If by some chance you end up having to deal with the service portion of the company, know that you will be in good hands.

If you feel that due to one persons testimonial, Carvin is not a reputable company to do business with, well, the best I can say is that you are missing out on some of the best gear in the industry at any cost. But, whatever gear you get, make sure you get the good stuff. Something you will be happy with and feel comfortable knowing that the company you bought it from has your back.

Now please...stop with the name calling...everyone. It gets us all nowhere faster than a Bugati on the Autobahn. (And for those that don't know, that's 1000hp at 250mph fast) I tend to feel that arguing and name calling on the internet is kind of like the special olympics...even if you win, you're still retarded.

~Chalz

 

[Track Rat]

I take it Chalz, that you're with carvin. Did you by chance read the comments made by Mike (mgood)? No reaction to his comments which to me sounded like he DID engage in verbal fencing with a customer?

 

[Metal Ist Krieg]

You know this is slightly off subject, but it still applies. First off, you are correct in saying that not many guitar companies will take a 25 yr old instrument in for refurbishing when its 20 yrs out of warranty. BUT! THEY SHOULD. Its not like RocDoc was trying to get the work for free. He was there, card in hand, grin on face, happy, and ready to pay for the labor.... I can't believe that the few companies that actually do what they are expected to do by their customers expect a pat on the back for just doing what is ethical.(repairing your own gear, warrantied or not). You wanna cookie for repairing your own guitars? Hah. Look, I'm sure most gibson afficianados aren't aware that gibson won't touch old guitars for repair in most cases, or less people would be huge fans of gibson... because it is percieved on the street that they do indeed take care of older guitars. The fact that fender was even mentioned in this thread made me throw up.
The bottom line is the lack of professionalism here. The customer has no obligation to be professional and every right to react strongly to unprofessional conduct. The person representing the company has an obligation to be professional, however. That's what this is about. Again, I know the RocDoc was professional in his dealings with them, at least as professional as he could be... And another thing that pisses me off... Other companies aren't the ones in question here. The fact that most companies suck is common knowledge now... Using that as an excuse to also suck is ridiculous. Just because a hackshop like :::Insert shitty company here::: can get away with crappy service and making a habit out of bending their customers over a barrel with painted firewood has nothing to do with how carvin or any other company SHOULD conduct business.

 

[Metal Ist Krieg]

Oh yeah... I forgot to mention... the more Carvinites jump on here to "defend" Carvin, the more they come off like a bunch of baffoons. How can a company like that get that far?