tascam reel-to-reel adventures...help!

[lilcapn]

i've had a tascam tsr-8 8-track reel-to-reel for a few months now ("upgrading" (retrograding?) from my vs-1680, which was an upgrade from a portastudio) but am just now getting to use it with regularity, learning to use it, etc.

trying to record acoustic guitar with a C1 through a joe meek, and i'm hearing this repetetive noise -- its the tape machine, one reel sounds like the tape is hitting the side every time around.

anyone have a hunch as to whether is this a major "everything needs realignment" kind of deal (i never had work done on the thing when i bought it -- i just started using it!) or just a "you threaded the tape on the reel in a weird way" kind of thing?

with only one room to record in, i gotta fix this in order to record anything quiet to tape (or it's back to digital land)....

thanks!

ps if this helps, i notice that on the tape reel (not the take-up reel) after recording or listening and then rewinding, the tape on the original reel is at all these different "levels" on the reel, like it's coming back unevenly from the take-up reel....

 

[regebro]

ps if this helps, i notice that on the tape reel (not the take-up reel) after recording or listening and then rewinding, the tape on the original reel is at all these different "levels" on the reel, like it's coming back unevenly from the take-up reel....

That happens after rewinding. For that reason, put the tape on "backwards". I.e. Put the new tape on the left wheel and the empty reel on the right, and then START with rewinding the tape almost to the start. Then record from there.

When you are finished recording, play the tape to the end (as opposed to fast forwarding it) and it winds nice and evenly.

 

[Sennheiser]

Besides checking for a warped reel, make sure your reel tables are not wobbling on the motor shafts.

If it's wobbling just slightly it's no big deal. If it's wobbling a whole bunch you'll have to strip the machine down to the chassis to make the adjustment. I had to do this when I got my machine. it's no big deal but it is a pain in the ass. Mine weren't wobbling, but one table was lower than the other and was causing the tape to drag on the foward inside edge of the reel.

Not many tape decks will give an even stack in a fast mode.

Like Regebro said, a slow wind will give a good stack.

What I do is put the take-up on the left and the new tape on the right and re-wind all of the new tape to the take-up reel.

Now the new empty reel becomes the take-up reel and when you're done with that reel you have a nice even stack and your tape is tails out ready for storage.

 

[lilcapn]

my brain hurts

from staring at the two reels trying to figure out how i was going to accomplish the "tails out" goal -- but i think you've cleared it up!

thanks

 

[lilcapn]

clarifying the problem -- uh oh

the reel isn't warped, but i did some more investigation today, and the plastic part that the reel goes onto and then gets tightened by (the "clamper" i think is what the part
is calledin the manual) isn't snug all the way around when i tighten it to secure the reel on the post. ie, the reel itself is wobbling since the clamper isn't really clamping...

anyone experience this pain in the arse?

thanks!

 

[Sennheiser]

In my previous post I said I had experienced this PITA.

There are two cap head metric screws that hold the reel tables to the motor shafts.

Look in your manual on page 76, and 80 for the correct adjustment procedure.

You will have to take ALL of the covers off of the machine to do this. They are very well built machines, but they are a bitch to work on.

Someone on another board mentioned that after he had performed this adjustment once, he drilled 5/16th access holes into the cabinet sides to get at these screws so he'd never had to pull the case panels off again.

 

[regebro]

Re: my brain hurts

from staring at the two reels trying to figure out how i was going to accomplish the "tails out" goal -- but i think you've cleared it up!

thanks

Well, with most reels, there is no "front" and "back" side, and then you just put it on the right wheel, rewind and go. This is what both me and Sennheiser does.

If there is a front and back side to your tape reel, but no start or end on the tape (or if you don't care), you put the new reel on *backwards* on the right wheel, rewind it onto the takeup reel (on the left), and then flip the empty reel on the right over. This is known as a "virgin flip".

If there is a start and end (usually marked with green and red tape and the start and end of the tape) all these ways of using the tape tails out will mean that you have the red end tape in the center of the reel, which is actually the start. This is not a big problem, but if you may find this confusing, as the tape will look like it's a "heads out" instead of a "tails out".

It's not a big problem if you have a front and back on the reel, because then you'll notice that it's tails out when you try to mount it, but it's always nice if the two (front back-position and start-end winding) agrees. Less confusion. To fix that you need to use two takeup reels, and transfer the tape twice, or cut of the red and green tapes, or quite simply mark "tails out" on the reel. Quantegy doens't seem to have start and end tapes on their tapes, but I have seen it on other brands (although that was years ago).

Confused yet?

 

[Sennheiser]

Regebro, I don't follow ya on this:

Sennheisers procedure is completely equivalent, except that you with his procedure flip the takeup reel when moving it from the left wheel to the right. This requires you to remove both reels when doing the flip, while with the other procedure you only remove the empty new reel. Not a big deal

I've never had to remove my take-up reel from the left side of the deck. I just spool all of the new tape from the right onto the take-up reel on the left and then the reel that the new tape just came off of is now the take-up reel and all the new tape ends up back on the original reel (which is also the now the take-up reel) It ends up tails out when the tape is finished.

Did that make sense? I know I've been in these conversations before and it can realy get confusing the more it is discussed.

Oh, and Quantegy does still use the red and green tape on the ends.

 

[lilcapn]

thanks!

i won't even drag out the reel-flipping discourse, as i think i've got it now, but sennheiser thanks for the info -- i didn't realize this was the very same PITA you'd had!

i emailed teac/tascam about getting the new part, we'll see...

thanks!

 

[Sennheiser]

I must appologize. I forgot from your first post that you had a TRS-8. The procedure is probably different for this adjustment on your machine.

Are you sure you need a new part? Is something cracked or broken?


spelling error

 

[lilcapn]

oops

yes -- trs, not tsr -- o can't SEE anything cracked, but there's also nothing to tighten (the center screw is all the way tight), and the little hub you turn is just kinda loose/off kilter.

hopefully to replace the "clamper" i won't have to take the whole thing apart...

 

[Sennheiser]

No you won't have to just to replace the reel hub. But the bub rides on a metal reel table which is attached to the motor shaft. If the hub is tight and is not cracked, it's the reel table that is off.

You WILL have to get into the machine to adjust this. If you can turn a screw driver and follow an exploded view, YOU can do this.

Don't pay $60 dollars an hour to have some one do something for you that you can learn to do yourself. If you're going to use this machine in your studio, you SHOULD know something about it. There is no better OJT than getting into it and finding out what makes it tick.

While you have the covers off, poke around in there with your eyes and use the exploded views to learn your way around your machine. Find out where all the cards are, where they connect to the motherboard and look at how the mechanical components interrelate to one another.

In other words, get to know your machine. This ain't some impersonal computer or DAW. This machine is alive. It has moving parts. It is a precision analog instrument that deserves your attention. There are wires and motors and solenoids and real semi-conductors in there.

Now where is that Ritalyn I had a second ago?? Damn, I guess I have to get another beer instead.

 

[regebro]

If you can't figure out how to fix the machine yourself, you should be able to buy a copy of the service manual from Tascam, which tells you most of the things you need to know. It might cost you $100 so, that what Fostex charged for my A-8LR manuals.

 

[regebro]

Regebro, I don't follow ya on this:


I've never had to remove my take-up reel from the left side of the deck. I just spool all of the new tape from the right onto the take-up reel on the left and then the reel that the new tape just came off of is now the take-up reel and all the new tape ends up back on the original reel (which is also the now the take-up reel) It ends up tails out when the tape is finished.

Did that make sense? I know I've been in these conversations before and it can realy get confusing the more it is discussed.

Oh, and Quantegy does still use the red and green tape on the ends.

Eh. Yeah, of course. You are correct, I'm confused. You do exactly the same thing as I do, which is to skip the "flip" altogether, which is quite possible with most reels (at least for 1/4"), since they have no front or back until you slap a note sticker on them. Forget anything I said, I'll edit my earlier post so it sais the right thing.

Oh, you get the red and green ends on Quantegy tape? Which type of tape? I use 1/4" 456 and 457 and none of my tapes have it.

 

[Sennheiser]

1/2" Quantegy 456 still uses it. I just mounted a new reel last week and had to pull of the green tape from the front of the reel.

I wish I had a 1/4" mixdown deck. I'm still mixing to cassette or, (Yuck) Protools Free to upload to the internet.