J
James K
Member
also, the specific desk is a Studiomaster series 1 16/16/2 desk. It has a split design and 16 groups. Do you know anything about these consoles? I.E. do they have inserts, flip switches etc.
T
Thrust
New member
Its been 15 plus years since I had experience with any studiomaster but as I recall they of course had inserts as most mid level recording boards did. Studiomasters niche was the small home studio and they apparently did very well in that market until Mackie arrived. Mackies were a little bland sounding but much much cheaper. In the late nineties I remember some lower prices on Studiomasters but by then Mackie was king. The model you are talking about is probably a 80s model and a split design doesnt have " flip switches" if I understand your meaning correctly. But dont discount that Fostex you have. They are a good match for analog recorders. Because of there bright open sound they pair up well with tape which is colored naturally. I hope Im wording this correctly. I wish I had never gotten rid of my first Fostex mixer. I recieved many favorably comments on mixes done on it. Cant say the same about my Tascam mixers though. I dont ever remember a big fully featured Fostex mixer though.
J
James K
Member
By 'flip switches' I mean switches to route the tape returns to the main channels for mixdown. Is there a way to do this on a split console or would I need to actually swap the leads around?
Yeah, I understand what you mean and I do like the sound of my Fostex. I've always found the EQ to be very nice to use. The problem is that it only has 12 channels so isn't suitable for 16 track recording. Ideally I want to get a Soundtracs (probably solo logic) but the studiomaster board is up for sale at the moment so I'm wondering if that's a good option. If I can get a good deal on it, I'll probably just go for it and then upgrade at a later date if I'm not too keen on the sound.
J
James K
Member
Well guys, I got the MS16 and the mixer for £621 all together 
Feeling pretty happy right now I'll let you know how I get on.
Cheers for all the advice
Feeling pretty happy right now I'll let you know how I get on.Cheers for all the advice
jpmorris
Tape Wolf
Oh, that was the one on ebay that was going for £250 for the last couple of days? I was watching that - collecting it would have been a problem, though. Let us know how you get on with it!
J
James K
Member
Yep, that's the one. I live in Hastings so it was a pretty big opportunity. Should be picking it up today.
T
Thrust
New member
Mixer
Just want to know what you think of the studiomaster and how you think it compares to the Fostex after you get all set up. Good luck with your new gear. I think you made exellent choices. Ive many times considered 1 inch 16 but dont want to pay the tape prices for 1 inch. The studiomaster analog tape combination is gonna be real real rock n roll sounding. Im drooling just thinking about it. I think Ill stick with my half inch 16 though just out of frugallity. Keep in touch.
Just want to know what you think of the studiomaster and how you think it compares to the Fostex after you get all set up. Good luck with your new gear. I think you made exellent choices. Ive many times considered 1 inch 16 but dont want to pay the tape prices for 1 inch. The studiomaster analog tape combination is gonna be real real rock n roll sounding. Im drooling just thinking about it. I think Ill stick with my half inch 16 though just out of frugallity. Keep in touch.
T
Thrust
New member
Just an afterthought. If you decide you like the Fostes mixer better you could always use an inexpensive line mixer for tape returns from the 16 track. I use one right now for effect returns to expand my channel count on my main mixer.
J
James K
Member
Hi,
I've got it all set up now. All the pots and faders are crackly so I've got to get all those cleaned. I've done all the faders and the pan knobs so far. They took about a minute each and there are about 300 in total :/ I'm really pleased with the sound so far. It sounds loads loads better than my Fostex R8 and 812 combo. It's got a really nice detailed, warm yet still bright sound. Acoustic guitars sound amazing. Using exactly the same mic technique as I've always done, the sound was so much better. The EQ on the desk is very pleasant sounding. I understand what people mean now when they say it's like a blunt tool rather than a scalpel. It's just easy to work with. One thing I noticed is that I need to use less EQ with this setup. I used to have to cut the sibilant frequencies on the vocals quite a lot but now they seem to sound almost perfect with no EQ. Basically, I'm very pleased with the whole setup, the desk has a few quirks (dual signal levels on TRS jacks and other non-standard stuff like that) but I doubt it'll cause any operational problems.
Regarding the 1" format, I was turned off by the cost of tape but then I worked out the actual running cost. The tapes are about £80 each. From what I've heard from various people you can reuse tape around ten times or more so that works out £8 a use. You can then get around 5 songs on a reel so that works out £1.60 per song which is pretty good I think. I got 4 tapes with it, one unopened. They're all Ampex 456 and as I suspected, they all have sticky shed syndrome except one (which isn't the unopened one). The one that works though seems to work and sound fine. From what I gather, it's around 15 years old so it seems to suggest that the format is pretty hard-wearing.
Anyway, thanks for the interest. I'll post whenever I have any progress.
Cheers
James
J
James K
Member
here's the first recording I did on it. It's pretty rough but here it is anyway. Is That Love - Squeeze cover by jrkimber on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free
jpmorris
Tape Wolf
Oh, I haven't heard that song for years! Very nice. Needs more keyboards though.
I would be interested to see how you've done the track assignments too.
On a more MS-16 related note, do these machines support automatic punch-in, like the TSR-8, i.e. you give it a start and stop point and the CPU automatically punches in and out? (I still dream of a 1" machine and am kind of torn between the MS16 with its wider tracks, or the MSR24)
T
Thrust
New member
So I conclude you like the Studiomaster? How do you compare the two mixers?
J
James K
Member
Hi,
yeah, it's missing the keyboards. It was just a rough track to see how the new setup sounded. I might do it again though and spend more time on it. The track assignments were:
3.Drum OH
4.Snare
5.Kick
6.Bass Guitar
7.Acoustic Guitar
8.Electric Rhythm Guitar
9.Lead Guitar
10. Lead Vocals
11. Backing Vocals
Unfortunately the MS16 doesn't do automatic punch-ins or have a socket for a punch in pedal. I suppose it wasn't really designed for the solo musician/engineer in mind. It's pretty annoying 'cause I used the punch pedal on my R8 quite a lot for drop-ins.
yep, I like the Studiomaster. It took me a while to work out where everything was on it but I've got the hang of it now. It has a very nice sound. The best way I can describe how it compares with the Fostex is that it sounds more 'professional'. It just sounds bigger, fatter and warmer. By that I don't mean overdriven and the modern cliché of 'analogue' 'cause that's not the sound I'm after. I'm pretty sure it could produce that sound but it does the nice warm yet still bright sound that I'm after very well. As I said, the EQ is less clinical than on the Fostex, it seems to have a wider Q and a less dramatic effect. There are a couple of things I preferred on the Fostex. The Fostex had stereo FX returns where the studiomaster just has two mono returns. I currently have one stereo reverb unit plugged into both of them panned left and right but when I get another effects unit, I'll have to employ a line mixer or run into two of the main channels. The other thing that I'll need to get used to is that the insert points are post EQ whereas they were pre on the Fostex. Overall though, it's a very desk and the EQ cut buttons on each channel seem a very useful feature.
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j.harv
@#$%
jpmorris
Tape Wolf
Incidentally, regarding the earlier parts of this thread, if you need parts for the MS16 I believe these folks are TEAC's main parts dealer in the UK:
CHS - replacement remote controls, instruction manuals, audio & video accessories, electronic components & spare parts
They do stock the pinch roller, but it's about £72.
EDIT: How odd. I just posted the URL - that blurb was not my doing.
CHS - replacement remote controls, instruction manuals, audio & video accessories, electronic components & spare parts
They do stock the pinch roller, but it's about £72.
EDIT: How odd. I just posted the URL - that blurb was not my doing.
hilltop studios
New member
James,
Congrats on the MS16 and Studio Master ! Your recording sounds very good. Nice Job! Good luck with everything and here's a link for you to check out for tape. These are pancakes that you could easily assemble to your 456 flanges. My MS16 is very happy with them and they are bias compatible with 456. Not sure how the shipping would work for you though.....guess that might be a problem. Well again best of luck and enjoy !! Regards, Dave
http://reeldealpa.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6_11&products_id=23
Congrats on the MS16 and Studio Master ! Your recording sounds very good. Nice Job! Good luck with everything and here's a link for you to check out for tape. These are pancakes that you could easily assemble to your 456 flanges. My MS16 is very happy with them and they are bias compatible with 456. Not sure how the shipping would work for you though.....guess that might be a problem. Well again best of luck and enjoy !! Regards, Dave
http://reeldealpa.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6_11&products_id=23
J
James K
Member
Thanks
I found a similar thing but for sale in England. Quantegy 456 for sale on 1" pancakes for half the price of new RMGI. I'm going to buy three reels of that and use the flanges off the dodgey reels of Ampex I have.
M
MSH
New member
Hi James
I just bought your 812 to pair up with a Model 80 I picked up a week or so ago
The Model 80 was a bit of a punt as it was being sold as untested but I got it for £34+£9 p&p. I tried it out using the effects inserts as tape in/outs on my Yamaha N12 and it seems to work perfectly - result
Really surprised and impressed by the sound compared to digital. My plan is to still compose in digital (cut and paste makes building songs so easy) then record the finished songs in analogue. Probably end up mastering back in digital though.
Looking forward to getting the 812 and getting back to basics with some analogue recording. Funny how after moving to 1s and 0s years ago (kept my Tascam 244 though - just resurrected it with new belts and the pinch roller from an old cassette deck) I'm now yearning for the simplicity and honesty of tape.
Cheers
Mike
I just bought your 812 to pair up with a Model 80 I picked up a week or so ago
The Model 80 was a bit of a punt as it was being sold as untested but I got it for £34+£9 p&p. I tried it out using the effects inserts as tape in/outs on my Yamaha N12 and it seems to work perfectly - result
Really surprised and impressed by the sound compared to digital. My plan is to still compose in digital (cut and paste makes building songs so easy) then record the finished songs in analogue. Probably end up mastering back in digital though.
Looking forward to getting the 812 and getting back to basics with some analogue recording. Funny how after moving to 1s and 0s years ago (kept my Tascam 244 though - just resurrected it with new belts and the pinch roller from an old cassette deck) I'm now yearning for the simplicity and honesty of tape.
Cheers
Mike
G
gbowling
New member
I have an MS 16, with the DBX. I purchased it new around 1991 or so. I was used for one CD that was released in 1993. It's sat idle ever since. I would like to sell it if anyone is interested
Thanks, Gary
Thanks, Gary
