sugaree

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man, you get some seriously great sounds of your tascam multitrack.
Bass guitar especially sticks well to cassette.

First off, sounds nice and thick. Guitars sound great. Solo sounds very much in tune to the Bob Weir style. Bass sounds great. Vocals could maybe use a little bit of upper low end frequency bump. It's a bit mid-rangy. Sounds a bit nasally almost. Performance is very good though. Also, I'm not diggin' the drum machine. Maybe it's the cymbal samples you are using on this one, cause the bass and snare sound fine. Usually I can overlook something like this, but for some reason it's not sitting all that great with me. I've never had a problem with this in your other recordings. Wonder why it's bothering me this time? MHO is that this song could really benefit from some real drum playing, though I know it may not be possible.

Still, very good, and very much in the spirit of your other dead tunes, though maybe as stellar as your last Beck cover - Rowboat. That will be a tough one to beat.
 
I'm not a Dead fan, but I've heard a lot of their music.

There are two failings in the recording that I can note...being familiar with the sound of their recordings.

1-there is a slow-death-enhancing lack of overdrive...edge...grit...in the guitars: too clean. Too carefully played...:^) Sounds like an authentic '50's pre R&R thing. ["I'm loving you lots and lots"...from 'That Thing You Do'.]

2-the vocal sounds like it has been EQ trimmed in the mids and low mids too much: it lacks balls...sounds thin and effete. And it's bone dry in the midst of a least one heavily verbed guitar... the stark contrast is strange to my ear.

Q: was this song originally sung an octave up by the whiney-sounding guy in that band? It sounds like you're singing at the very low end of your effective vocal range...and it'd be a lot more bettah sung up an octave. But I'm guessing you can't reach that...but you want to do it in the original key, maybe? Raise it a fifth or so, and get it to fit the range in your voice that can pump????
 
all sounds good to me...love the guitars...really sweet sounding..also I think the "casual" vocals suit it..Ive never heard the original...who are the grateful dead anyway, are they a mexican band? ;)

I think the hi hat samples are the weakest link in the song..but as you say its a drum machine..what ya gonna do <shrugs shoulders>
 
I was actually kind of pumped when I first saw this post, because this song is perfect for you. But I have to agree with others about the vocals. Sounds like it's coming over a telephone wire. No balls or grit which this song needs. Musically, I love the instrumental part, and it's all recorded really well. Just fix the vocals and I think it will be great!
 
ksounds said:
man, you get some seriously great sounds of your tascam multitrack.
Bass guitar especially sticks well to cassette.

First off, sounds nice and thick. Guitars sound great. Solo sounds very much in tune to the Bob Weir style. Bass sounds great. Vocals could maybe use a little bit of upper low end frequency bump. It's a bit mid-rangy. Sounds a bit nasally almost. Performance is very good though. Also, I'm not diggin' the drum machine. Maybe it's the cymbal samples you are using on this one, cause the bass and snare sound fine. Usually I can overlook something like this, but for some reason it's not sitting all that great with me. I've never had a problem with this in your other recordings. Wonder why it's bothering me this time? MHO is that this song could really benefit from some real drum playing, though I know it may not be possible.

Still, very good, and very much in the spirit of your other dead tunes, though maybe as stellar as your last Beck cover - Rowboat. That will be a tough one to beat.
Click to expand...

Thanks for listening ksounds :).

Yeah, I guess the vocals really are an issue. I actually kind of liked the nasal sound on this, but the consensus is that something is off. I did scoop some lows and lo mids on them as my voice is naturally so boomy I think I may overcompensate.

At first I'm thinking I can just mute those cymbals a little and add some lows back in the vocals and I'll be all set, but I think it goes further than that.

Real drums would rule. Sadly, I am drumless:(.
 
jeffmaher said:
I'm not a Dead fan, but I've heard a lot of their music.

There are two failings in the recording that I can note...being familiar with the sound of their recordings.

1-there is a slow-death-enhancing lack of overdrive...edge...grit...in the guitars: too clean. Too carefully played...:^) Sounds like an authentic '50's pre R&R thing. ["I'm loving you lots and lots"...from 'That Thing You Do'.]

2-the vocal sounds like it has been EQ trimmed in the mids and low mids too much: it lacks balls...sounds thin and effete. And it's bone dry in the midst of a least one heavily verbed guitar... the stark contrast is strange to my ear.

Q: was this song originally sung an octave up by the whiney-sounding guy in that band? It sounds like you're singing at the very low end of your effective vocal range...and it'd be a lot more bettah sung up an octave. But I'm guessing you can't reach that...but you want to do it in the original key, maybe? Raise it a fifth or so, and get it to fit the range in your voice that can pump????
Click to expand...

Aw Jeff...death-enhancing and effete? Not the effect I wanted to be sure :p:D. Plus, you called garcia whiney :mad:!

Thank you though for your thoughts. I agree with most of what you say...

I actually was thinking of 1950's music during this for some reason and although the dead definitely rock this thing out a lot more, it is a very mellow tune even for them, so I felt like super clean guitars wasn't too much of a stretch. I like them this way. Plus, there have been no confirmed casualties thus far:).

You and k both got the same thing from the vocals. Yes I did trim them and probably excessively so. That is easier to fix than what you asked about though. Garcia sings it and I guess he is a tenor. Pretty much every time I cover one of their tunes I get the suggestion to move up an octave :o:) No, I can't reach that and yes, I wanted to play it in the original key. I'm not sure my voice pumps?
 
kcearl said:
all sounds good to me...love the guitars...really sweet sounding..also I think the "casual" vocals suit it..Ive never heard the original...who are the grateful dead anyway, are they a mexican band? ;)

I think the hi hat samples are the weakest link in the song..but as you say its a drum machine..what ya gonna do <shrugs shoulders>
Click to expand...

I believe you're thinking of los lobos...

Thanks for checking it out :)
Yeah, those damn cymbals - I'll see if I can squash 'em somehow. The whole thing was built around dr. rhythm, so the stereo drum track can't be edited, but I can still eq them differently.

guitar zero said:
I was actually kind of pumped when I first saw this post, because this song is perfect for you. But I have to agree with others about the vocals. Sounds like it's coming over a telephone wire. No balls or grit which this song needs. Musically, I love the instrumental part, and it's all recorded really well. Just fix the vocals and I think it will be great!
Click to expand...

Thank you gz :D.

I guess I didn't get the thing with the vocal sound on this at first, but it is pretty much unanimous, so there is work to be done:)! Glad you liked the rest of it.
 
Sugaree is not one of my favorite Dead songs, but it gets listened to often. I think it's the Truckin' to Buffalo cd, permanently installed in the car's cd player. ;)

The tempo seems much faster than what I recall and you kind of lose the slow shuffle feel. Maybe there is different version out there that you referenced...

Others mentioned the eq on the vocals, so I won't say anything there. But I think the singing is kind of one dimensional and flat. Not much life, kind of like you're just trying to get through the song. I heard your other Dead covers, so I know what you can do. This one isn't up to the same level as you've done before.

As usual, though, you nailed the guitars and they sound great. Bass too... They totally make the song.

Cool man!!
 
Did I mention .....jejune? :^) Kidding.


An aside:

Long before the internet was even thought up by Al Gore, the first 'music forum' spontaneously erupted on the toilet-stall wall at Berklee's cafeteria outhouse. [that's being kind]
Some s**t-for-brains hippie with enough money to pay for the honor [the most important requirement] to become a first-semester attrition statistic, started a thread: "Jerry Garcia is a GENIUS!"
Needless to imagine, some jazzbox luddite berated such perverse exclamation inside the halls...within the sacred walls.... of Music Mecca....in language that would make Gerg L blush.

However, as days went by, I would 'log in' [rimshot]; and I observed that posts ran about 5:1 in favor of Garcia's guitar profundity. Who knew??!!

I never 'got' Jerry's genius. But his success is impossible to dismiss. And he had fun making it...when he could remember it, I reckon.

And he had a lot of major fans at the school. Pot can do that to ya.

I wasn't inhaling......

OK...I lie. A prolly why I became an attrition stat,,,,

Try like anything, though, I did...and do...to find that journey-say-qua in the band and Jerry's work. I'm just too stiff, I guess. The music makes me wanna hurt myself and others....or drop acid.


AHA!!!
 
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I can't think of many bands that I absolutely hate more than the Grateful Dead, so obviously I don't know how this compares to the original. :p

I think the guitars and bass sound great. The vocals sound midrangey and lo-fi. Too dry too. The vocal performance seems lackluster and uninspired. The constant hi-hat is kind of annoying, but what can you do? It's a drum machine. Overall, I'd say just redo the vocals and you're good to go.
 
Typing as I am listening...I am liking this so far. Somehow though the drums are sounding a bit to chinchi. They need to be bigger. Also, I fell like there needs to be a harmony part. The guitar has a very good tone to it. Very good melody. I like the words. Very good. I always enjoy listening to your stuff. Very good! :D

-Adam.
 
Chili said:
Sugaree is not one of my favorite Dead songs, but it gets listened to often. I think it's the Truckin' to Buffalo cd, permanently installed in the car's cd player. ;)

The tempo seems much faster than what I recall and you kind of lose the slow shuffle feel. Maybe there is different version out there that you referenced...

Others mentioned the eq on the vocals, so I won't say anything there. But I think the singing is kind of one dimensional and flat. Not much life, kind of like you're just trying to get through the song. I heard your other Dead covers, so I know what you can do. This one isn't up to the same level as you've done before.

As usual, though, you nailed the guitars and they sound great. Bass too... They totally make the song.

Cool man!!
Click to expand...

Thanks for listening Chili. I've heard so many different versions of this tune over the years that I really just based this on memory and not any specific version, although I know they played it even faster than this around 82 or 83 when they were all coked up and couldn't get out of their own way.:) I wanted to do it more upbeat I guess and feel like the shuffle is preserved, albeit altered.

Funny, I really thought this was one of my better covers, but you never know. Some stuff I've put up here I'm like, "I can't believe they think this is ok!" - this one is kind of the opposite. Working on the vocal issues...thanks again!

Greg_L said:
I can't think of many bands that I absolutely hate more than the Grateful Dead, so obviously I don't know how this compares to the original. :p

I think the guitars and bass sound great. The vocals sound midrangey and lo-fi. Too dry too. The vocal performance seems lackluster and uninspired. The constant hi-hat is kind of annoying, but what can you do? It's a drum machine. Overall, I'd say just redo the vocals and you're good to go.
Click to expand...

Well thank you very much greg for suffering through 6 and a half minutes of some of your least favorite material of all time :D. On the vocals - I've listened to it again and am sort of getting the vibe that I sound like I took a bunch of downers or something...not how it felt at the time, but there's no denying it didn't come out right...the cymbals will be muted somewhat, but they're probably there to say...

propman said:
Typing as I am listening...I am liking this so far. Somehow though the drums are sounding a bit to chinchi. They need to be bigger. Also, I fell like there needs to be a harmony part. The guitar has a very good tone to it. Very good melody. I like the words. Very good. I always enjoy listening to your stuff. Very good! :D

-Adam.
Click to expand...

Thank you Adam. Just to be clear...this isn't really mine, but a cover of a grateful dead song. I'm trying to alter the drums with eq, but I think I just tracked them all crispy clean like that because I liked the contrast and there are few other high sounds that I can capture on tape, so I get fooled into thinking they will be offset by all of the guitars and stuff...didnt seem to work here...hopefully the fact that it isnt my tune won't detract too much. Thanks again!
 
New Mix - New Vocals

Ok, new mix at the top and here as well:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=660667&songID=8296098

I rerecorded the vocals and tried to be less of everything you guys described...but maybe not as much of a difference as one would hope? This time I didn't do any eq at all and I added delay and reverb to reduce the dryness...too much now? Please give it another try and let me know if this is any better...

I also muted the cymbals a little and raised the level of the only distorted guitar a bit here and there.

Thanks for all of the help so far..seriously:cool::).
 
Much, much closer on the vocals to what I was expecting from you. This song needs the low end on the vocals, and this one is better. It still sounds a little distant. What kind of pre-delay do you have on the reverb? Maybe shortening it would bring the vocals more forward????????? Sounds a lot better though.
 
yup its mucho mucho better...the vocal still has that casual feel which I like, but the added reverb helps sit in the mix and get along nicely...guitars great..hi hat..well what do you want? lol, its much less obvious in the mix...great performance miser :)
 
Yup, second mix sounds a lot better, Pete!;)
Really like the vocals now, they sound steadier and hava bit more feel to them. Love that clean guitar sound. I don't know any Grateful Dead music, so I'm unprejudiced and to me this is a Heat song. And a good one at that, nice work!

Joey :):):):)
 
Yep, much better - frequency wise. Did you re-record the vocals? The performance sounds different, not sure, but it sounds much better - maybe it's the added frequencies. Also, the hi-hat sounds more natural buried down in the mix. Still love the guitars.

One thing, I'm not sure the reverb is adding much to help. Is their delay on there as well? IMO, the vocals sound a bit disconnected from the vibe of the rest of the song. Not saying it sounds bad at all, just disconnected from the vibe, if that makes any sense. If I approached it, I would try it out much drier. That's what my instincts are telling me. Might be worth trying?
 
The vocal performance is better, but it still sounds kind of midrangey and thin in the mix. Maybe some stereo effect - like a chorus or double-track - would beef up the vocal presence some.
 
i would leave the vocals alone, i like the casual feel to them too. i thought they were perfect in the first mix
 
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