stripping guitars...

[tylerxxx]

i have an older gibson les paul special that i never use(i prefer my esp h-301)
it's this bright red color, and i really don't like it. i've been looking at the threads in the guitar section and seen a bunch of modified guitars and they looked amazing, so i decided i want to do that myself.

what do i do? do i sand it? do i use paint thinner? where do i start? i know it's not rocket science or anything, but i just don't want to screw up.
any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[juststartingout]

http://www.projectguitar.com/tut/tutorial5.htm

 

[xtjdx]

I used paint thinner to start out with but quickly realized that sanding would be a lot better option (for me at least) on my SG.

 

[jimistone]

use industrial strength paint stripper (don't get it on the binding or plastic parts). If you aren't pretty good and experianced at sanding, you will screw up the contours of the guitar body. If you do sand it...use a wood block...you finger tips behind the sand paper will sand out furrows.

Aircraft paint stripper will not hurt the wood, but it will take the paint off.

 

[tylerxxx]

use industrial strength paint stripper (don't get it on the binding or plastic parts). If you aren't pretty good and experianced at sanding, you will screw up the contours of the guitar body. If you do sand it...use a wood block...you finger tips behind the sand paper will sand out furrows.

Aircraft paint stripper will not hurt the wood, but it will take the paint off.

what about a power sander?

 

[xtjdx]

If you use a power sander, make sure it's a finishing sander. Otherwise you'll get ridges (they're small, so if you don't care about it being a nice job, then you could use a regular).

 

[tylerxxx]

what if i wanted to sand the neck too, would that be a bad idea?

 

[David Katauskas]

You have 3 options:
1) have someone else do it
2) use a spray can and masking tape
3) follow directions below

When I refinished my guitar, I followed the same methods used when painting cars.

Preparation:
1) dis-assemble everything from the body...yes, everything
2) use a good wax remover and wipe all contaminants from surface
3) wash with Comet or other abrasive sink cleanser
4) hand sand with 120 wet/sand
5) dry, clean with damp rag, clean again with damp rag

Now your ready for the priming process:
(use a spray gun and spray booth)
1) spray 2 coats of acrylic primer (I used PPG)
2) sand with 180 to knock down all of the ridges (orange peel)
3) clean with damp rag, clean again with damp rag
4) spray another 2 coats of acrylic primer
5) sand with 400 to knock down all of the ridges (orange peel)
6) clean with damp rag, clean again with damp rag

Now you're ready for the painting process (again, I use PPG base/clear method):
1) spray 1st coat of base (I used black)
2) wait 15 minutes
3) spray 2nd coat of base
4) wait 15 minutes
5) spray 3rd coat of base
6) wait 15 minutes

Now you're ready for clear (again, I used...you guessed it...PPG)
1) spray 1st coat of clear
2) wait 1 hour
3) spray 2nd coat of clear
3) wait 1 hour
4) spray 3rd coat of clear
5) wait 1 week

Now you're ready for color sanding (be sure not to sand thru clear coat):
1) using 1000 grit wet/sand, remove all bumps (orange peel)
2) using 1500 grit wet/sand, sand entire body
3) using 2000 grit wet/sand, sand entire body

Now you're ready for polishing:
1) with electric buffer, apply small amound of polish compound
2) clean
3) with electric buffer, apply small amount of micro-polish compound
4) clean
5) with hand glaze, rub entire guitar body
6) wait for 3 months

Now your ready for wax:
1) with a high grade wax...well...wax it

Now you're ready for guitar assembly:
1) put it back together and hope you don't scratch anything

Now you're ready to play:
1) take a nap because you are exhausted from all of the work you've done
2) wake up, drink a beer, play you're newly painted guitar

 

[Fusioninspace]

DK - excellent outline for a quality job! So here's a couple more questions -

How long should the final paint job sit before you proceed with polishing/etc.? I've always heard that those quality finishes aren't 100% dry for several weeks...

I know with the polyurathan I use on my other wood working projects dries very quickly and can be finish sanded in a couple of days.

Or is the "several weeks" based on older formulations?

 

[David Katauskas]

If you bake the acryllic enamel, then you can polish it the same day (not recommended for wood)...if not, you should wait at least 1-2 days before sanding. The new paint is not like the old laquers where it "dried". The new paints are actually chemicals that bond upon adding the hardening agents (that's why they are so dangerous if you breath them).

To answer your questions, once it has been wet sanded with 2000...waiting another day will help it harden some more. You may be referring to the laquer finishes which are currently outlawed in the US...you can't buy it anymore either. That stuff needed a long time to 'dry'.

Anyway, that should give it time to harden, then sand. You'll still need to let it breath, so it should sit another 3 mos before applying wax or other sealer.

BTW - these are just general guidelines...you should really use the recommendations provided by the paint manufacturer since they are all different. PPG has a good site and have all of their information available via PDFs.

 

[donkeystyle]

i think gibson started this rumor to make it seem more special that they can use nitrocellulose laquer. the truth is, i/anyone else can go to my/their local sherwin williams and buy nitrocellulose laquer. you can also buy it from http://www.stewmac.com

also stew mac has all kinds of other painting stuff. here's another place that has really good instructions for first timers. you can also buy most of what you need from him. http://www.reranch.com/

most guitar builders will tell you that nitro is the best way to go, but i know that tons of builders use other type of paints. i think that paul reed smith even uses urethane, but i'm not sure. i was told once by a dealer and i remember thinking "holy crap, no way."

To answer your questions, once it has been wet sanded with 2000...waiting another day will help it harden some more. You may be referring to the laquer finishes which are currently outlawed in the US...you can't buy it anymore either. That stuff needed a long time to 'dry'.

 

[ibanezrocks]

why would nitro be a better finish? I've been reading up on this lately and haven't yet found any facts suggesting that the lacquer finish would provide more protection for the guitar.

 

[David Katauskas]

The information from my paint dealers is that the EPA will not let them sell spray laquers...I'm sure the the laquers that are available are either in brush-on form or spray cans.

Also, isn't the nitro-laquer the stuff that 'yellows' over time?

Correction : I had a brain-fart...the clear I use is urathane

 

[donkeystyle]

The information from my paint dealers is that the EPA will not let them sell spray laquers...I'm sure the the laquers that are available are either in brush-on form or spray cans.

Also, isn't the nitro-laquer the stuff that 'yellows' over time?

Correction : I had a brain-fart...the clear I use is urathane

you can get them in spray cans, but i can literally go get a gallon of nitro from the sherwin williams right down the street right now. and like i said stewmac sells it too.

nitro does yellow. the theory behide why it's best for guitars is that it's cellulose based, so it somehow like becomes more of a part of the wood than just a coating on it. i don't really understand it or buy into it, I was just saying that lots of guitar builders say that it's better for guitars. plus it yellows in a really cool way.

there's a builder on here that goes by light. he can explain it better i'm sure.

urethane is pretty soft in comparison to laquers, plus it feels funky. i don't like it.

 

[donkeystyle]

why would nitro be a better finish? I've been reading up on this lately and haven't yet found any facts suggesting that the lacquer finish would provide more protection for the guitar.

i don't think it's a protection issue. laquers are harder than other paints, and in nitro's case, there's another theory that i mentioned in my last post. basically, they're harder, so they transfer energy better.

 

[David Katauskas]

donkeystyle,

I think we're saying something completely different...I'm sure you can buy a gallon of lacquer from SW. My understanding of spraying laquer and the EPA may be f'ed up...the information is only as good as it's source, (this is what I have been told from a few very credible sources). However, I haven't seen any lacquer paints in a few years.

I've seen lacquer primers and clears, but not paint (color). Urethane shouldn't be cleared with lacquer, as it will be destroyed. The lacquer clears are meant to be applied over lacquer paint (which as mentioned, I haven't seen in a while, except in spray cans), or they are to be applied over wood (or stained wood).

Also, the urathane coating that I've been using is extremetly hard...the paint I buy (PPG) is top grade stuff. They are completely different applications. For example, 1/2 gallon base (red), 2qts clear, 2 qts primer and other various reducers and hardeners will cost you around $600. We're talking apples and oranges.

Both lacquers and urathane clears can be buffed to a high gloss, but lacquer will shrink and takes much longer to process. Urethane would still be my preference.

It's interesting to see many of the DIY sites referring to lacquer color spraying using spray guns...I'll have a chat with some of my 'paint friends' and find out what the deal is.

Dave

 

[donkeystyle]

oh ok i understand what you're saying now. you have to add the colors to the clear to make them colors.

it was my misunderstanding, not yours.

donkeystyle,

I think we're saying something completely different...I'm sure you can buy a gallon of lacquer from SW. My understanding of spraying laquer and the EPA may be f'ed up...the information is only as good as it's source, (this is what I have been told from a few very credible sources). However, I haven't seen any lacquer paints in a few years.

I've seen lacquer primers and clears, but not paint (color). Urethane shouldn't be cleared with lacquer, as it will be destroyed. The lacquer clears are meant to be applied over lacquer paint (which as mentioned, I haven't seen in a while, except in spray cans), or they are to be applied over wood (or stained wood).

Also, the urathane coating that I've been using is extremetly hard...the paint I buy (PPG) is top grade stuff. They are completely different applications. For example, 1/2 gallon base (red), 2qts clear, 2 qts primer and other various reducers and hardeners will cost you around $600. We're talking apples and oranges.

Both lacquers and urathane clears can be buffed to a high gloss, but lacquer will shrink and takes much longer to process. Urethane would still be my preference.

It's interesting to see many of the DIY sites referring to lacquer color spraying using spray guns...I'll have a chat with some of my 'paint friends' and find out what the deal is.

Dave

 

[Armistice]

Bummer

Came in here thinking my two favourite topics were being covered in the one thread, but it seems you're not actually talking about the type of stripping I was imagining...

Later.

 

[David Katauskas]

<Austin Powers> Oh behave!