Software Pirating is compeletly out of hand

  • Thread starter Thread starter mentalattica
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oh yeah... and don't forget the software companies would very much like, and have tried repeatedly, to prohibit you from reselling the software you PAID for. So that only they could sell it even if you buy it from them in the first place. Piracy is about them trying to be the absolute ONLY outlet for their software. And they have helped change the laws that once made what I do perfectly legal bfeore 1997.
 
OK, you're right. Why pay them for their software if they're gonna be all stingey about it? Why should they even have a say in how it is distributed anyway? You are a great crusader. You should be the one writing intellectual property laws. However, if this happens I think it only fair to warn the others--stay out of the intellectual property business unless you are just another crusader wanting to make and spread free software for the rest of us numbskulls to use.
 
Reggie said:
OK, you're right. Why pay them for their software if they're gonna be all stingey about it? Why should they even have a say in how it is distributed anyway? You are a great crusader. You should be the one writing intellectual property laws. However, if this happens I think it only fair to warn the others--stay out of the intellectual property business unless you are just another crusader wanting to make and spread free software for the rest of us numbskulls to use.

I never said it should be free. They can charge whatever they want. But obtaining a copy someone gives you for free to use non-commercially should not be illegal. The only reason that this is illegal is because they fucked up and wanted the government to fix it. it's about greed not intellectual property.
 
mrT said:
I never said it should be free. They can charge whatever they want. But obtaining a copy someone gives you for free to use non-commercially should not be illegal. The only reason that this is illegal is because they fucked up and wanted the government to fix it. it's about greed not intellectual property.


no, it's about you using someone's product. Company's sell products. Consumers buy them. Economics 101. It's how society works. You don't take someone's product, use it, and don't pay for it just because someone else broke the licence agreement and hacked it. You're like the idiot kid who knows his friends stole the car, but thinks "I can't get in trouble for riding around in it because I didn't steal it!! It's all okay!! The cops can't do anything!"

But obtaining a copy someone gives you for free to use non-commercially should not be illegal.

Their distribution of the product breaks the license agreement. They didn't have any right to distribute the product to you for ANY price without transfering ownership (in other words, they can't use it anymore and all registration falls under your name...including the license agreement).

Just because it's easy to copy something doesn't make it right.
Just like because it's easy to steal candy from the grocery store, doesn't make it right.

And I guess technically since I never had to go through "click-through-license" that I never Broke any contract or even agreed to abide by the terms of the liscence myself. The only one that is legally accountable is the person who cracked it and gave it too me. But then again I would be using an altered version of the software and I'm not too sure that the infringment would apply?


Your logic is extremely moronic and none of what you say will be held up in court if a company decided to prosecute you over it.
 
I"m not a person who uses Pirated software as I don"t need to as I get pretty much all the free software I want from my Old Job but I (Like everybody else) have an opinion.....

If software Companies don"t want there software to be Pirated then they have to put a real effort into protecting it from piracy by makeing it Uncrackable or so hard to crack that it isn"t worth the pirates effort to try to crack it, and if they put as much effort into developeing these protection schemes that they do into advertiseing or other aspects of there business then there would be a Lot less Piracy going on.....

If a Person leaves there Car doors open with there keys just sitting there in a Bad Part of town you can not really feel too bad that the person gets there car stolen, because if there car was that important to them they would have locked it.....

There isn"t much use in haveing laws if there is no enforcement or deterant and it seems that software companies don"t think piracy is a very big deal or they would do something about it like writeing protection schemes that are to difficult to Crack or just not worth there time to crack.....

Like in here is Canada Pot is "officially" Illegal but I wanted to I can walk down town and go to the Pot store and Buy as much weed as I want, and I don"t mean from a dealer I mean an actual Store with a Cash register and a Display case with a Variety of different types on display with a menu ect.....

You would think if the government really didn"t want poeple smokeing pot they would shut a place like this down and throw the owners in jail but this shop has been open for about 4 years now and does quite a hefty business....

Without a deterant and enforcment things like this happen and the poeple to blame are the ones who are supposed to be enforceing these laws and detering others from doing it...

Poeple will allways want to do what they can get away with and laws without enforcement and deterents are not Laws at all but mear suggestions....


The end of my rant.....

Cheers
 
Why does "non-commercially" make it OK? Why should you be able to use the same fancy software for free that commercial establishments have to pay good money for? Do you REALLY think they make their money from all the pro studios that are doing so well anyway? They probably need the latest version of Cubase like they need another hole in their head. I'm sorry, but you are not a very smart person; and not really a very "good" person either.
 
Minion said:
Words, words, words....


The end of my rant.....

Cheers

So you would have no problem with the piraters who would be responsible for further increasing the R&D costs of developing new software, as well as quite likely making it a greater pain to authorize your legit software?
 
Reggie said:
Why does "non-commercially" make it OK? Why should you be able to use the same fancy software for free that commercial establishments have to pay good money for?


Before 1997 that very "idiot" idea was the law. Software companies saw how they made a product that could legally be GIVEN AWAY and said "oh shit, we don't like that" so they lobbied to have the law changed. And you guys that like to think you know everything about me and my character because of this post are... idiots.

and my arguments not holding up in court does not make them wrong. I'm sorry you guys think software companies should have carte blanche to dictate that they MUST be paid for every copy in use of their product no matter how it was made (even if not by them, or if you god forbid installed it on TWO of your computers).

So just to get this straight. I think if you come up with a program you should have every right to be the only place it may be purchased from (excluding resale). I even think that they should put the best anti-piracy software in it. But they shouldn't be able to regulate who can give their product away for free. Do you think it should be illegal to give a friend a copy of a cd. He obviously won't buy it himself then. What if I wanted to get a 100 stack of CD's buy the retail product and just stand on the street corner handing them out.

The fact is, what I don't get for pirating is support, packaging, updates, patches...etc. That's what you are REALLY paying the money for. And I'm inclined to think that the guys that actually write the code do so on a for hire basis so I doubt I'm fucking them over in any direct way.
 
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The idiocy of this argument is that the costs of developing crack-proof schemes would have to be passed on to the consumer, who then complains about the high costs, and uses that at further rationale for piracy.

The fact is, it is virtually impossible to make a crack-proof program. The closest we come is to tie it to hardware-protection scheme either via a dongle or propriety hardware. And then you bitch about that.

Software development of ANY kind is time consuming and EXPENSIVE. Now, ypou'll get guys like the developer of Reaper who appear to be doing it for the love of the game, but trust me, he's not making a living of of it. Companies that are out to make a profit and stay in business have real hard costs, and developer's, testers and marketing salaries to pay.

Now, mind you, I'm not such a hard-ass that I cannot see a point for using some cracks to evaluate an app, given the argument that there are few really good alternatives. (The same holds true for evaluating any soft product). However, my problem lies in that there creeps in a sense of entitlement in certain people who begin to feel that there is nothing wroing with outright piracy. This argument that "I wouldn't buy it anyways" is crap, because I believe that if it were important to you, you would. You somehow manage to get the scratch for your weed, right? It's is simply that it is too easy to pirate software and rationalize it away. And to me, piracy is a true bellweather of someone's moral compass precisely due to the fact that it is hard to enforce, and is thus a true measure of your integrity.



Minion said:
I"m not a person who uses Pirated software as I don"t need to as I get pretty much all the free software I want from my Old Job but I (Like everybody else) have an opinion.....

If software Companies don"t want there software to be Pirated then they have to put a real effort into protecting it from piracy by makeing it Uncrackable or so hard to crack that it isn"t worth the pirates effort to try to crack it, and if they put as much effort into developeing these protection schemes that they do into advertiseing or other aspects of there business then there would be a Lot less Piracy going on.....

If a Person leaves there Car doors open with there keys just sitting there in a Bad Part of town you can not really feel too bad that the person gets there car stolen, because if there car was that important to them they would have locked it.....

There isn"t much use in haveing laws if there is no enforcement or deterant and it seems that software companies don"t think piracy is a very big deal or they would do something about it like writeing protection schemes that are to difficult to Crack or just not worth there time to crack.....

Like in here is Canada Pot is "officially" Illegal but I wanted to I can walk down town and go to the Pot store and Buy as much weed as I want, and I don"t mean from a dealer I mean an actual Store with a Cash register and a Display case with a Variety of different types on display with a menu ect.....

You would think if the government really didn"t want poeple smokeing pot they would shut a place like this down and throw the owners in jail but this shop has been open for about 4 years now and does quite a hefty business....

Without a deterant and enforcment things like this happen and the poeple to blame are the ones who are supposed to be enforceing these laws and detering others from doing it...

Poeple will allways want to do what they can get away with and laws without enforcement and deterents are not Laws at all but mear suggestions....


The end of my rant.....

Cheers
 
I'll admit, I'm not sure what the heck you are talking about before 1997. Don't you remember "Don't Copy That Floppy"?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Xfqkdh5Js4

Edit: Nevermind, I found the NET Act. Just because there wasn't a law against it from the first moment people discovered they could use the internet in this way, doesn't mean it was always right and always should be. I see no problem with the NET Act.
 
Reggie said:
I'll admit, I'm not sure what the heck you are talking about before 1997. Don't you remember "Don't Copy That Floppy"?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Xfqkdh5Js4

Edit: Nevermind, I found the NET Act. Just because there wasn't a law against it from the first moment people discovered they could use the internet in this way, doesn't mean it was always right and always should be. I see no problem with the NET Act.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion and I do disagree. (BTW thanks for all the neg rep guys! I hit you all back but with green. Cause I know that this is just opinon on the internet and not some sign of moral bankruptcy)

Copyrights are going too far these days and I don't agree with it. Fair-use is becoming a joke and software companies can write any conditions they want into the EULA. I think this is all an abuse of what copyrights were SUPPOSED to be about. Protecting the right of the creator to soley distribute for money his product.
 
Minion said:
If software Companies don"t want there software to be Pirated then they have to put a real effort into protecting it from piracy by makeing it Uncrackable or so hard to crack that it isn"t worth the pirates effort to try to crack it, and if they put as much effort into developeing these protection schemes that they do into advertiseing or other aspects of there business then there would be a Lot less Piracy going on.....

Are you sure you're not media exec? You sure say the stupid things they keep saying lately.

You have it all wrong (just like most companies). This approach only alienates the consumer.

People treat piracy as the enemy - they should be looking at is a competitor (which is what it really is).

The only solution that will ever work is to make taking the legal route as easy and painless, if not easier than downloading the stuff off of BitTorrent.

A good example would be what Apple did with iTunes. Charging somone $.99 for a song and making it a straighforward, fast, reliable and transparent process is much more appealing than searching for torrents which may or may not be up long enough for you to get the entire file.
 
The iTunes store is bollocks. I love both apple and iTunes, but here the UK you pay £0.79 for a song, and the Artist gets £0.04. I'd much rather get their album on peer-to-peer, buy a ticket to their show, then directly give the band a tenner for their T-Shirt any day!

That said, that is a bit different from ripping of a £400 DAW...
 
mrT said:
I think this is all an abuse of what copyrights were SUPPOSED to be about. Protecting the right of the creator to soley distribute for money his product.

That's exactly what it does!!!!!
But people like you steal it instead, so he can't make money...and in turn spends 10% more trying to program better copy protection.

If you can't afford an inexpensive program like Reaper or N-Track...then you shouldn't be recording. Period.
 
Minion said:
I"m not a person who uses Pirated software as I don"t need to as I get pretty much all the free software I want from my Old Job but I (Like everybody else) have an opinion.....

If software Companies don"t want there software to be Pirated then they have to put a real effort into protecting it from piracy by makeing it Uncrackable or so hard to crack that it isn"t worth the pirates effort to try to crack it, and if they put as much effort into developeing these protection schemes that they do into advertiseing or other aspects of there business then there would be a Lot less Piracy going on.....

If a Person leaves there Car doors open with there keys just sitting there in a Bad Part of town you can not really feel too bad that the person gets there car stolen, because if there car was that important to them they would have locked it.....

There isn"t much use in haveing laws if there is no enforcement or deterant and it seems that software companies don"t think piracy is a very big deal or they would do something about it like writeing protection schemes that are to difficult to Crack or just not worth there time to crack.....

Like in here is Canada Pot is "officially" Illegal but I wanted to I can walk down town and go to the Pot store and Buy as much weed as I want, and I don"t mean from a dealer I mean an actual Store with a Cash register and a Display case with a Variety of different types on display with a menu ect.....

You would think if the government really didn"t want poeple smokeing pot they would shut a place like this down and throw the owners in jail but this shop has been open for about 4 years now and does quite a hefty business....

Without a deterant and enforcment things like this happen and the poeple to blame are the ones who are supposed to be enforceing these laws and detering others from doing it...

Poeple will allways want to do what they can get away with and laws without enforcement and deterents are not Laws at all but mear suggestions....


The end of my rant.....

Cheers


I don't believe you just typed that :(

I don't know which Canada you live in , but in the Canada I live in pot is illegal and there are no such stores you can "buy" it over the counter. Pot was decriminalized for personal use , it's still "illegal" though, especially trafficking the drug.

I dispair when i read that people think that stealing something is ok if it's easy to steal and it "becomes" the real owners "fault" because it was easy to take, copy or whatever. Seriously guys , where is your personal integrity and self respect ? do people even have that any more ?

The problem here is that people that do pirate and steal from others really do not have the ability to see it any other way. It's akin to watching a cockroach run over your kitchen floor and then try to explain to it that it cannot live in your kitchen. It neither has the mental or intellectual capacity to understand you so you are wasting your breath :rolleyes:
 
mrT said:
Copyrights are going too far these days and I don't agree with it. Fair-use is becoming a joke and software companies can write any conditions they want into the EULA. I think this is all an abuse of what copyrights were SUPPOSED to be about. Protecting the right of the creator to soley distribute for money his product.
Now I'm confused. Do you believe in protecting the right of the creator to soley distribute for money his product? If so, I don't see how you can justify using software that some 1337 haX0r decided he would distribute to you for free. Fair use certainly isn't giving away free copies to your friends or whatever. This whole "if I can steal it easily without getting caught and without stealing any physical retail packaging, it is perfectly OK" mentality is pretty low as far as I am concerned. The fact that you and your kind can bypass any kind of morality issues by thinking you are doing some kind of Robin Hood act is really quite disgusting. It looks like the digital age is going to be around for quite some time, and many products are going to be reduced to 1's and 0's that can be copied and passed along over networks; so should all of this be up for grabs to whoever wants to copy it? Should one person buy a legit copy and distribute it for free to whoever they want? Where do you draw the line?
 
Elton Bear said:
but here the UK you pay £0.79 for a song, and the Artist gets £0.04. I'd much rather get their album on peer-to-peer, buy a ticket to their show, then directly give the band a tenner for their T-Shirt any day!
Why can't you do both-- buy their music and their ticket/Tshirts? Is it OK for the people who can't make it to the shows, to download their music for free on peer-to-peer? Give them no compensation for their creative efforts? Give the record label no compensation for their investment in the band to produce and market their music?
 
Yeah there's nothing better than paying $15 for a slow download of songs at 128 kbps with no treble and phase issues :mad: Sorry, iTunes blows.

No the answer is to find more efficient ways of doing business, cut costs and prices, and cater to the consumer.

For example, if I owned a bank and wanted the business of a large client, would I:

A, raise my bank fees because people are switching banks, make him pay for a plane ticket to come out and visit the bank, make him take a cab, and not reimburse him for anything.

OR

B, cut him a deal on bank fees so he will be a loyal customer, fly someone out to visit his offices, wine and dine him, and offer a smooth transition.

It's simple business and simple economics.
 
And I will say for the record that if I start pulling in money doing recording I will buy my software. I think that is the right thing to do. But until then I will continue to go the free route. You can hate it all you want but I have my reasons.

Second:
You guys can call me a theif all you want but if you came to my apartment/studio and then started to give me some self-rightous sermon on "The Danger's of Software Piracy" when you found out I used warez I would be correct in calling you an Asshole.

So quit being Assholes about it.

:)
 
I don't care how destitute you are, it doesn't make it right. I don't make any money playing movies on my computer. Should I be entitled to free downloads then? This whole idea that software should be free unless you make money off of it is a moot point. It isn't just intended for people who make money from using it; it is also for people who like to record for fun, and those people should have to pay for their fun too.
 
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