SM7db Fake Chinese

[TalismanRich]

I was looking at them on Ebay, and there are several listed from a place about 20 miles from me. I used to drive through the town on the way home from work when they were rebuilding the interstate highway years ago. It's about 3 miles from the US Gold Repository at Fort Knox.

If you were really interested in buying something like this one, I would probably be willing to actually do an inspection if the seller agreed. The seller has several listed. Of course I would need to know what to look for. I haven't learned the fine points to search for when looking at authentic SM7s.

Shure SM7A Cardioid Dynamic Vocal Microphone | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Shure SM7A Cardioid Dynamic Vocal Microphone at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

 

[CoolCat]

Its why as a consumer, after watching Rode videos and how they brought it all in house, was interesting.
For me a consumer, maybe a peculiar want is a mental clarity on what I bought from who.
RODE made in Australia, from start to finish and we have parts and you can buy direct online. Ok, sanity in a way!

Neumann went to Sennheisers Corporate Portfolio. But Neumann is still made in Germany and has some "homeland" connection. Fender was smart enough to keep at least one factory in the US for marketing and foundation future "image" and tariffs etc...they started the Squier line to get the low end beginners and that crowd doesn't care where its made only price and or quality. I have a 30yr+ Squire Jazz still a dream to play.

Shure killed their own off and moved it all somewhere else and now will pay the Tariff and deal with bootlegging and backdoor millions to be lost. I say millions because for a cheap simple dynamic mic to produce the quality will go up and up and soon the fakes will be the better deal I assume, for 90% of future buyers will see Shure as a Chinese company and they wont care.

I'm in senior citizen zone, not a big market, I like chasing down some things these days, like the original KSM32 that is US but it also has a different headbasket and was made a short time. Is it worth more? no. lol ..but its $300 with aluminum case and hard and shoc mount, velvet dust pouch! .
For a SM7 , we have a new one to use, but an "old" one to hear/own might be cool in a collector vibe, but I don't want to spend $700 on a fake old one...lol
My next new SM7b might be made in China, or SM7DB.. for $102.

 

[rob aylestone]

Every time I buy a potentially or obvious fake to test on my Youtube channel, I'm getting more and more paranoid about not mixing them up. I stick a label on each box before I unbox it and immediately put the same sticker on the mics. I have the SM7B I use all the time, but have two others. One is genuine and one is not and I have mixed them up. I cannot tell which is which. It's easy with some of the SM58s - a quick one-two and you say real or fake. Same with the Sennheisers. The SM7B is a problem - the fakes are really good.

I reviewed a Neumann BCM104 fake and it was really, really good. The give away was that it had screws to undo the grill, not the pushbuttons, and the PCB in the XLR tube with the roll off and sensitivity switches was missing! You really have to research this stuff or you make mistakes.

The problem really is that we would all be angry if somebody was selling a fake as genuine on ebay, but equally I'm quite happy using the good ones. That's sort of wrong?

 

[RFR]

Every time I buy a potentially or obvious fake to test on my Youtube channel, I'm getting more and more paranoid about not mixing them up. I stick a label on each box before I unbox it and immediately put the same sticker on the mics. I have the SM7B I use all the time, but have two others. One is genuine and one is not and I have mixed them up. I cannot tell which is which. It's easy with some of the SM58s - a quick one-two and you say real or fake. Same with the Sennheisers. The SM7B is a problem - the fakes are really good.

I reviewed a Neumann BCM104 fake and it was really, really good. The give away was that it had screws to undo the grill, not the pushbuttons, and the PCB in the XLR tube with the roll off and sensitivity switches was missing! You really have to research this stuff or you make mistakes.

The problem really is that we would all be angry if somebody was selling a fake as genuine on ebay, but equally I'm quite happy using the good ones. That's sort of wrong?

Sort of wrong….. maybe. Then again, a good tool is a good tool.

But I think the real ‘wrongness’ would be with deception.

 

[TalismanRich]

I wouldn't have an issue if they labeled it Shur SM-B7 or Sure SMB-7 or something like that. It's the deliberate counterfeiting that makes me avoid them, even if they are very good copies.

It's not much different from printing fake money, and doing that can get you 20 years of free room and board.

The other issue with counterfeits is that if an unknowing buyer gets one and it either sounds like crap or breaks, there is no warranty. And it can cause damage to the real company's reputation. A newbie gets a crappy microphone, and then starts to post on Reddit, HR, and other sites about how bad the mic is. Newbie #2 reads that and spouts the same or maybe changes his mind about purchasing a real one, not know that the criticism is due to a fake. Or a wire breaks loose inside the mic, and the buyer tries to send it to the real manufacturer for repair or replacement, only to be told "sorry Charlie".

For someone who knows the situation and accepts the risk, it's not a big deal. For uninformed, who are the ones most likely to grab that bargain off Ebay or Alibaba, it can be a big deal.

 

[Dusty Ol' Bones]

Not trying to draw this too far OT but a couple years ago I inadvertently bought a fake SM58 on Amazon. I used it and thought it was fine until I got an email from Amazon telling me it was fake and an automatic refund of the hundy I spent on it. The good news is that the mic works and I still use it when I practice playing through an amp. The other good news is that I didn't pay for it. Since it works, I never considered using that money to buy a real one.

What I learned was not to buy things like that from Amazon, unless maybe its from sold from the manufacturer's Amazon page.

 

[rob aylestone]

My dentist was telling me that there are loads of dentist tools available - but there was an incident with UV setting tools - those things they stick in your mouth to set the stuff they fill your teeth with. UV wavelengths are very specific because some, like UV-C are very dangerous. Guess what the fakes were using? Yep - the dangerous one!

 

[R D Smith]

The other issue with counterfeits is that if an unknowing buyer gets one and it either sounds like crap or breaks, there is no warranty. And it can cause damage to the real company's reputation. A newbie gets a crappy microphone, and then starts to post on Reddit, HR, and other sites about how bad the mic is. Newbie #2 reads that and spouts the same or maybe changes his mind about purchasing a real one, not know that the criticism is due to a fake. Or a wire breaks loose inside the mic, and the buyer tries to send it to the real manufacturer for repair or replacement, only to be told "sorry Charlie".

This happened at the company I worked for. An item came back for warranty, that was a fake. All the parts were either made by us, or using our tooling. The substraite cicuit was made using our films. The only thing that tipped us off, was the microprocessor had a program revision, that we never used in that product (which is probably why it failed the test at the rebuilder).

Rob said he had a couple of microphones that he mixed up the fake and the real one, and couldn't tell the difference. In the case of things like a microphone, I wouldn't be surprised to find quite a few fakes are made using authentic parts that come from the O.E. manufacturer, or the O.E. manufacturer's suppliers.

 

[rob aylestone]

Yep - that's my guess. They are masters of sourcing!

 

[CoolCat]

Every time I buy a potentially or obvious fake to test on my Youtube channel, I'm getting more and more paranoid about not mixing them up. I stick a label on each box before I unbox it and immediately put the same sticker on the mics. I have the SM7B I use all the time, but have two others. One is genuine and one is not and I have mixed them up. I cannot tell which is which. It's easy with some of the SM58s - a quick one-two and you say real or fake. Same with the Sennheisers. The SM7B is a problem - the fakes are really good.

I reviewed a Neumann BCM104 fake and it was really, really good. The give away was that it had screws to undo the grill, not the pushbuttons, and the PCB in the XLR tube with the roll off and sensitivity switches was missing! You really have to research this stuff or you make mistakes.

The problem really is that we would all be angry if somebody was selling a fake as genuine on ebay, but equally I'm quite happy using the good ones. That's sort of wrong?

Its not wrong for the ears to decide if you like it or not.
Is it wrong in the world economy way? But Shure laid off all their workers and moved to Mexico and China and now have a Chinese problem, is that wrong if we like buying the copy for $102 that possibly made from the same materials? lol

 

[CoolCat]

interesting like the above comparison of SM7db, one didn't work.
I noticed today several people posted reviews on EBAY theirs "didn't work" either, put in a 1 star rating.

maybe they are SHURE QC failures being sold ?

 

[rob aylestone]

The snag I found fixing it was the cables appeared too short, so unless there is a trick I didn't spot, I suspect actually soldering the capsule to the cables that pass to the rear preamp is a dab and run process. One had come off (or never been connected) but in fixing it, I broke the other off too! I started at the preamp end, and added a couple of inches of wire to each lead, then there was space to solder to the capsule. This bolsters my idea that they are collecting the components together and sourcing alternate parts to complete the 'whole' - like the preamp and the capsule, but the casing, windshields and boxes may indeed be genuine? We will never know.

 

[CoolCat]

its a job for 007 or Ethan....

 

[ecc83]

Mentioning no names but! I think far eastern counties have forever ignored Intellectual Property Rights and thus had a massive advantage over the west as they get all their software for free.

I would also assume they can access engineering "drawings", BOMs and even CAD data for almost anything designed here?

Dave.

 

[rob aylestone]

One of my Chinese sources for radios often try to sell me Motorola - which I just never sell. They describe them as High Quality copies - while others might be described as OEM, the ones made from surplus parts when models are discontinued. I have no idea what they really mean?

 

[TalismanRich]

I remember talking with some of our company folks who worked at our chemical manufacturing plant in China. He told me that once someone gets the process information to make something, someone else in their "family" will set up a business and start making the same product, at least as best they can.

Sometimes chemical processes need very specific controls for things like temperature, timing and agitation which can be expensive to set up. So while the materials and formulas might be exactly the same, the consistency of the product would vary a lot. They might not monitor incoming raw materials which added more variation, but they would generally get something which they could sell at a profit.

Once they start selling the product and make some money they would begin adding equipment to improved controls and the product would get more consistent. What they rarely spent money on was the environmental controls that large companies would have to follow, which meant lower cost. Within a year or two, they would have a thriving business, undercutting the company that actually developed the product.

I'm sure it's the same with everything else in China. With the way that things can be measured so accurately, it would be fairly simple matter to disassemble a mic capsule, laser scan the mechanical parts and program them into a CNC, measure the tension of the diaphragm and the electrical parameters. Making a circuit board is childs play. Reverse engineering is a quick and easy way to design a product.

 

[R D Smith]

Mentioning no names but! I think far eastern counties have forever ignored Intellectual Property Rights and thus had a massive advantage over the west as they get all their software for free.

I would also assume they can access engineering "drawings", BOMs and even CAD data for almost anything designed here?

Dave.

There is no such thing as intellectual property in CN, and you don't need the drawings to reverse engineer a product. All you need is an original product.

Reverse engineering was my job for many years. Our sales department would usually get requests for a item, and if the projected volume was sufficient we would develop it. For example, we are going to make a regulator and rectifier for a Bosch alternator, we buy the OE alternator and put it on the tester and get a performance chart. Then the technician would disassemble it, after the EE got through identifying the circuit, I would get the physical part/s for the mechanical design. If there were patent issues, we would change the design to avoid infringing on a patent. In some cases, our design was better than the OE and that was a good selling point.

However, in CN, they know what each company makes and it's easy to pick up the phone and call.

 

[ecc83]

There is a story that Peter Walker of Quad never patented his electrostatic speaker design because it was so hard to get right.

The principle is simple enough of course but the devil, things like the film tension, was in the detail. I suspect it took so much time and effort to develop and make that the speakers hardly made a profit. The amps paid the bills? PW made the ELS because it was THE best speaker then known and probably still is today other than deafening SPLs!

R.D.Smith, this ^ is not in reply to your post. Pure serendipity!

Dave.

 

[CoolCat]

it is a kludge of mismatched pieces and random suppliers and changes as needed.

but I think large company's like Shure or Fender often swap suppliers adding to confusion of FAKE or REAL or BOTH!
I found a Shure paper stated 1995...that has a picture of a SM7(1973), a schematic of a the Humbucker -Coil (1999) and the date on the sheet says 1995 (the Humbucker coil wasnt added until in 1999 ) . basically showing no one cared about updating drawings and marketing literature. Its only a microphone.

I think its lifespan in brief is
SM7 patent pending label USA- 1973 ($2500 ish)
SM7 without patent pending.label ..up to 1984 ($2000)
SM7 Assembled in Mexico label (USA parts (probably short lived?) 1984 ($700-1100)
SM7 label switches to "Made in Mexico" ($700-$1100) ? to 1999.
SM7A label, Made in Mexico 1999 (added Humbucker coil for CRT hum rejection) ($600 ish?)
SM7B made in Mexico 2001 to present...they added FOAM lol...not a engineering marvel change? ($400 new, $280 used ish)
SM7db made in China 2023 to present..added the booster amp, (pretty smart , imo, no need for booster boxes and an extra cable and can be Bypassed if a person wants.)($500new-$380 used approx)

but this might not be correct, because I think I read SM7B is also made in China for that areas customers and Mexico does its area of customers.
in the video SM7db, mentions, SM7db Fake for 62$~ As Rob says, if someone were to buy 4qty, its $250 vs $1800!!!

 

[ecc83]

"but I think large company's like Shure or Fender often swap suppliers" Or even the relatively small one I worked for.
This is an "eggs in basket" thing plus you don't want to be held to ransom.

I was tasked with swapping amp transformers. After establishing that basics like lead out colour, voltage ratio were right I would fit them into an amp and put it on soak test. Most times the alternative traff was fine but I recall one for a 60W amp failed after 20 minutes!

Then far eastern Co's seemed to have no scruples about swapping a component brand without notice. Constant battle to keep on top of the buggers!

Dave.