SM58's for vocals only?

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zwh

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My band is going to be recording some demos soon on a digital 8 track multitracker.

We own a 58 but also have access to borrow 4 or so other 58's. We also have a couple other cheaper mics and one condenser.

Can we achieve decent results using the 58's to mic things other than vocals? For this I mean micing a guitar cabinet, all of a drumset, possibly bass cab?

Of course if we had the money we would go with the better suited mic options, but for now we'll have to stick with what we've got.

Does anyone have any experiencing using 58's in this manner? I've heard that there isn't much different between a 57 and a 58, except for the wind screens. Is this true?
 
Take off the ball windscreen and mic away. Magically, you have an SM57.

You should have enough mics for 2 overheads for drums, 1 guitar, 1 bass, and 1 vocal.
 
Myriad_Rocker said:
Take off the ball windscreen and mic away. Magically, you have an SM57.

You should have enough mics for 2 overheads for drums, 1 guitar, 1 bass, and 1 vocal.
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Cool, thanks. For the scratch vocals we'll just use a cheap mic, and go back later and dub in with the condenser or a 58.

As far as the drums - Will two overheads be enough?

If we have enough mics I was wanting to do 4 mics on the drums . 2 overheads, 1 kick and 1 snare. Will the 58's be adequate for all these positions?
 
Yeah, a 58 wont give you the best sound on a kick but for just a demo with limited mics, it will do fine. I'm guessing you are wanting to record everything separate. So use two 58's for overheads on the drums, panned hard left and right, and one on the snare and one on the kick. I actually use to use a Beta58 on the snare and really liked it, though the 58 is different, that goes to show you just because it's a vocal mic, doesn't mean you can only use it for vocals..... And when you do vocals, I suggest you stand pretty far back if you are going to use the 58. What kind of condenser do you have though?
 
i'd just use that condenser for one overhead, and mic kick and snare. If you have the channels/mics for it mic the toms up too.
 
The condenser is a cheap Audio Technica AT2020. Think it will be better as a single overhead?
 
zwh said:
The condenser is a cheap Audio Technica AT2020. Think it will be better as a single overhead?
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Nah, don't do that. I think you'd much prefer a stereo kit with the two 58's up top. Just take those ball windscreens off and throw them up. Make sure they are the same distance from the kick and snare and you're good. Throw a mic on the snare and the kick. That's 4 mics. Mic up the guitar and the bass and push record.

Do the vocal dubs with the 2020 or another SM58.
 
Myriad_Rocker said:
Make sure they are the same distance from the kick and snare and you're good. Throw a mic on the snare and the kick.
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What do you mean by this? The snare mic should be the same distance away from the snare as the kick mic should be away from the kick? I don't get it?
 
undrgrnd studio said:
What do you mean by this? The snare mic should be the same distance away from the snare as the kick mic should be away from the kick? I don't get it?
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He means make sure the 2 overheads are the same distance from the snare and kick.

Thanks for the info fellas.
 
I used to record only with SM58 clones. I could not even afford the real thing. Mic placement will get you there if you listen.
 
Ditch the 58s and get some AKG d790 or d890 mics.

I've compared the two and well I own the AKG. It's just got alot more of everything. Sound quality is great. Used it live and not a single feedback problem ever. Shure makes good stage mics but IMO they are getting long in the tooth compared to some of the newer competition like AKG.
 
I think a stereo kit is more important than a little better sounding. I recorded a mono kit once and it was not good, and it sit in the mix horribly. But I would definitely us the AT for vocals. Are you recording this a separate times or all at once, how man inputs do you have or how many tracks can you record at once, into different tracks?
 
Really?

Do you know what frequency response charts are? Do you understand frequencies? I dont mean to be rude, but I think you should definitely take some time and look into that. Theres a website thats called www.modrec.com that you should look at. It'll tell you all about mics and how they work.

I say all of this because I see that someone told you to use a SM58 as a kick mic. Sure, you'll get the attack decently, but a bass drum resonates (depending on tuning) at the lower frequencies, I wanna say somewhere in between 50 and 200 hertz. If you look at the 58's chart, it picks up BELOW unity in that range. In fact, it rolls off at about 150 hertz.

Before you do any more recording, my advice is you look up the Frequency response charts for all your microphones, learn them, and then make you're decision. I'm positive that this is more important than mic placement.
 
ndrobison said:
Do you know what frequency response charts are? Do you understand frequencies? I dont mean to be rude, but I think you should definitely take some time and look into that. Theres a website thats called www.modrec.com that you should look at. It'll tell you all about mics and how they work.

I say all of this because I see that someone told you to use a SM58 as a kick mic. Sure, you'll get the attack decently, but a bass drum resonates (depending on tuning) at the lower frequencies, I wanna say somewhere in between 50 and 200 hertz. If you look at the 58's chart, it picks up BELOW unity in that range. In fact, it rolls off at about 150 hertz.

Before you do any more recording, my advice is you look up the Frequency response charts for all your microphones, learn them, and then make you're decision. I'm positive that this is more important than mic placement.
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With all due respect, frequency response charts are important if you are making critical analysis, but what is important with music recording is how it sounds... the best mics in the world won't sound good unless they are placed in the right position, and sometimes judicious EQ can overcome frequency shortcomings. After all, cymbals go higher than the response curve of an SM 57 or an SM 58, but on a desert island I'd make a whole kit of old school Shures work for me...

Experiment with positioning the mics you have, and remember that often "sounds cool" beats "sounds perfect" hands down... don't be afraid to be original. Plenty of great sounding albums have been made with less than amazing gear, and most of the time the gear isn't the biggest limitation...
 
ndrobison said:
I say all of this because I see that someone told you to use a SM58 as a kick mic. Sure, you'll get the attack decently, but a bass drum resonates (depending on tuning) at the lower frequencies, I wanna say somewhere in between 50 and 200 hertz. If you look at the 58's chart, it picks up BELOW unity in that range. In fact, it rolls off at about 150 hertz.
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An SM58 or SM57 for that matter can make a perfectly good choice for kick drum. Is it the best mic for the job? well sometimes and sometimes not.

The SM57/58 has plenty of low end for the job regardless of the graph showing it's response down 3 or 4db at 100 cycles 8db or so at 50 cycles. If my memory serves me right I believe the RE20 is down a few db at 50hz, that didn't stop that mic from being used on a lot of kick drums over the years.

ndrobison said:
Before you do any more recording, my advice is you look up the Frequency response charts for all your microphones, learn them, and then make you're decision. I'm positive that this is more important than mic placement.
Click to expand...

The numbers can be as much of a hinderance as a help. I would suggest listening to your mics not memorizing a bunch of graphs and numbers.
 
i've gotten shockingly great stuff with a 58 on guitar amps, kick drums (batter head works much better with this mic for me), snare, toms, bass amps, room mics . . . no joke! Proximity effect can make a big difference in the frequency response of a cardiod mic.

everything except for vocals, really. I've never gotten a good vocal sound out of them for recording.

i would shoot out the 58 and the 2020 as a mono overhead and figure out which one is going to work with your kit and your room. if the 58 sounds better, THEN you could think about throwing up a "stereo pair" (of 58s?). stereo overheads are overrated slightly (lots of classic and modern records use mono overs).
 
jbratch said:
i've gotten shockingly great stuff with a 58 on guitar amps, kick drums (batter head works much better with this mic for me), snare, toms, bass amps, room mics . . . no joke! Proximity effect can make a big difference in the frequency response of a cardiod mic.
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Shockingly great stuff eh?

I'm sorry, but until I hear proof I just can't believe that. Amps, snare, and toms maybe (but still, I doubt the result would've been 'shockingly great'...). It is important to know the freq response of the mics you're using- and on kick drums, the results I've heard with an SM58 (or 7's) has certainly not been exemplary.
 
shockingly great in that you wouldn't expect them to work well at all based on threads like this. but if all the guy has is '58s, the kick can sound just dandy if he finds the right placement.

frequency plots are great and I'm all for them, but they are not everything.

mics have different responses at different distances from the source (as well as different responses on different axes).
 
Myriad_Rocker said:
Take off the ball windscreen and mic away. Magically, you have an SM57.

You should have enough mics for 2 overheads for drums, 1 guitar, 1 bass, and 1 vocal.
Click to expand...

I agree with this, except for the fact you may want a direct in for the bass and the guitar, and possibly an area mic, or a condenser.

We really don't know what kind of music you're recording do we?
It's a great setup, and this is standard, but normally it takes about an hour before the band starts deviating or trying different techniques.

I'd go to youtube search for "recording drums" or "recording guitars" or stuff like that, and listen to the methods. See what stands out for you as good techniques, etc.:p
 
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