Remixed a song... is it better, worse, or a wash?

[NotThatBright]

I remixed this song I did maybe a month or two ago (a cover of Black Coffee, by Black Flag)... I made the following changes in the remix:

-Less compression on the snare (barely any)
-Less compression on the overhead mic
-Panned the overhead tracks (I always copy it and put it on two tracks) as far left, and as far right as possible (previously panned one halfway left and one halfway right)
-Doubled the vocal track and set one about 4% left of center and one 4% right of center.
-Flattened the EQ for the guitars

I expected to get a fuller sound from the wider panning of the overhead tracks, less cymbal bleed into the snare due to the lesser compression of the snare track (my mixer doesn't have a gate that helps), and possibly a thicker vocal sound. I think I got some of those things, but not a shitload of any of them.

Can you give a listen and tell me if you think the 2nd mix is better, worse, or pretty much a wash? Also please point out stuff that sounds bad (besides the playing and yelling), if you would. Thanks.


https://soundcloud.com/user92696274096/black-coffee/s-TNOuO

https://soundcloud.com/user92696274096/black-coffee-2nd/s-NxU9l


This song is almost 5 minutes long... once you get to the first round of black coffees (about :55 into it), you've pretty much heard it all, so listening to the whole thing isn't necessary unless you want to hear about more coffee-drinking and staring.

 

[Schwarzenyaeger]

I listend to Nr. 1 first without hearing Nr. 2

The kick was pretty damn heavy and everything sounded compressed and upfront. Not that it was bad, it sure sounded heavy but the vocals were much too silent. Maybe you could turn down the drums a half DB and side chain a gate that makes the guitars duck another half DB when the vocals set it.

Nr. 2 sounds really bloated and there seems to be some rumbling going around the low end.

 

[NotThatBright]

Thanks for the feedback.

Nr. 2 sounds really bloated and there seems to be some rumbling going around the low end.

The bass was supposed to be equal in both versions, I must have turned it up without realizing it for the remix. Thanks for pointing it out, I'll turn it down and see if it alleviates the bloat.

 

[RAMI]

-Panned the overhead tracks (I always copy it and put it on two tracks) as far left, and as far right as possible.

Just so I understand, are you saying you take a single (mono) overhead track, copy it and then pan them? If that's what you're doing, you're really accomplishing nothing other than making a mono track louder. It's not making it stereo or anything. A mono track copied is till a mono track and nothing more. You can pan it all you want, it's still mono right up the middle. This isn't opinion, it's fact, and it's been discussed to death. You're not accomplishing anything that you wouldn't accomplish by simply turning up the original mono track.

 

[NotThatBright]

Just so I understand, are you saying you take a single (mono) overhead track, copy it and then pan them? If that's what you're doing, you're really accomplishing nothing other than making a mono track louder. It's not making it stereo or anything. A mono track copied is till a mono track and nothing more. You can pan it all you want, it's still mono right up the middle. This isn't opinion, it's fact, and it's been discussed to death. You're not accomplishing anything that you wouldn't accomplish by simply turning up the original mono track.

I must have missed these discussions! Thanks for the information. I'll use stereo tracks in the future for the overhead.

 

[RAMI]

I must have missed these discussions! Thanks for the information. I'll use stereo tracks in the future for the overhead.

Hehe...The only reason I mentioned that it's been discussed to death is because I wanted to save you the time from saying something like "I beg to differ, I hear a difference when I copy and paste the track, etc...etc....etc...", because, sooner or later, people always realize that copying a track and panning them does nothing other than make it louder and still mono once they really listen.

Is it one mic? Then it will always be mono. Don't waste a track by recording one mic onto a stereo track. You can't make stereo from mono. If you have a single overhead mic, just go with it and make it mono, like it is. If you want stereo, you need 2 mics.

 

[NotThatBright]

Hehe...The only reason I mentioned that it's been discussed to death is because I wanted to save you the time from saying something like "I beg to differ, I hear a difference when I copy and paste the track, etc...etc....etc...", because, sooner or later, people always realize that copying a track and panning them does nothing other than make it louder and still mono once they really listen.

Is it one mic? Then it will always be mono. Don't waste a track by recording one mic onto a stereo track. You can't make stereo from mono. If you have a single overhead mic, just go with it and make it mono, like it is. If you want stereo, you need 2 mics.

I usually start right in with the four-letter words when I'm disputing something, in lieu of the classic "I beg to differ...", but I suppose there's a first time for everything

Audio isn't my area of expertise, I'm happy to defer to the collective wisdom of the guys who know what the hell they're talking about, one of which you appear to be. I'll google for reassurance if I'm told something that seems hard to believe. What you said isn't hard to believe, it's just something I didn't want to hear that I'll have to accept if I want to learn to do this right

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[RAMI]

I usually start right in with the four-letter words when I'm disputing something, in lieu of the classic "I beg to differ...", but I suppose there's a first time for everything

Audio isn't my area of expertise, I'm happy to defer to the collective wisdom of the guys who know what the hell they're talking about, one of which you appear to be. I'll google for reassurance if I'm told something that seems hard to believe. What you said isn't hard to believe, it's just something I didn't want to hear that I'll have to accept if I want to learn to do this right

Thanks for the feedback.

It's all good, man. You're ok.

You don't have to Google. Solo your 2 copied tracks and pan them. Try not to be influenced by the change in volume (we usually think something louder sounds better) and really listen to see if you can hear it magically becoming stereo.

Think about 2 things:

1)If simply panning 2 identical tracks would turn them into stereo, why would anyone use 2 overheads in that case? And most people do use 2 overheads.

2) Even if this was somehow magically possible, how would the 2 identical tracks "know" what to send to one side and what to send to the other, to make that stereo happen?

Your ears + common sense should give you the answer.

 

[NotThatBright]

It's all good, man. You're ok.

You don't have to Google. Solo your 2 copied tracks and pan them. Try not to be influenced by the change in volume (we usually think something louder sounds better) and really listen to see if you can hear it magically becoming stereo.

Think about 2 things:

1)If simply panning 2 identical tracks would turn them into stereo, why would anyone use 2 overheads in that case? And most people do use 2 overheads.

2) Even if this was somehow magically possible, how would the 2 identical tracks "know" what to send to one side and what to send to the other, to make that stereo happen?

Your ears + common sense should give you the answer.

Hey, I believed you the first time. Mama didn't raise no fool!

You had me at this:

"Is it one mic? Then it will always be mono. Don't waste a track by recording one mic onto a stereo track. You can't make stereo from mono. If you have a single overhead mic, just go with it and make it mono, like it is. If you want stereo, you need 2 mics."

By definition, something that's stereo means that the output of two speakers can't be the same, right? You'd need two mics to come up with different information.

Of course then I should be asked why the hell I was doing this to begin with. The answer to that is I sometimes have my head up my ass. Thankfully you were here to throw some logic in my face.

 

[RAMI]

Of course then I should be asked why the hell I was doing this to begin with. The answer to that is I sometimes have my head up my ass. Thankfully you were here to throw some logic in my face.

I'm pretty sure I speak for a lot of people when I say that most of us tried the "copy, paste, and pan" thing at some point, until we either figured it out or someone set us straight. One day, you'll be able to enlighten someone else.

 

[NotThatBright]

I'm pretty sure I speak for a lot of people when I say that most of us tried the "copy, paste, and pan" thing at some point, until we either figured it out or someone set us straight. One day, you'll be able to enlighten someone else.

Of course. Pay it forward!