Recording gear for Vocal, what mic/ do I need preamp? is that it

[ssman]

Hi. I need a setup to record vocal. I'm looking for equipment that is on the threshold of hifi, for example, (i'm into headphones) I have an emu 0404 soundcard ($100) and sennheiser hd580 headphones ($110), and a cmoy headphone amp ($40). That equipment is (imo) on the threshold of the greatest hifi sound.
I'm looking for the same most cost-effective equipment for recording except I know nothing. I've read around but there's too much I'm unfamiliar with . I have a limit around $150-180. Can I get recommendations for what i should buy. I think I only need a mic and a preamp and cables/adapters to hook up everything up????

thanks so much!

 

[chessparov]

You've got the start of a decent "tracking" set-up, however, to mix on a high quality level the cost for good monitors would be well over $180 alone.
(let alone having the AE skills in place)

What are your goals/objectives specifically?

Chris

 

[chessrock]

I'm looking for equipment that is on the threshold of hifi, for example, (i'm into headphones) I have an emu 0404 soundcard ($100) and sennheiser hd580 headphones ($110), and a cmoy headphone amp ($40). That equipment is (imo) on the threshold of the greatest hifi sound.

With your price limitations, I'd look for mostly used stuff -- search ebay or check the local pawn shops. M-audio makes good entry-level mic pres, and CAD, MXL or Studio Projects make acceptable cheap vocal mics.

You might have to lower your expectations just a tad. Most of the stuff in your price range, including the stuff you already own, is pretty much barely at the threshold of entry or consumer-level. This "greatest hifi" stuff might be more for down the road at some point.

 

[Treeline]

Yep. Ditto Chessparov and Chessrock's posts. You'll be needing commas in your bank account for high sound quality. But experience is more valuable, so you're starting at exactly the right place. Use the search function here; the site is an online encyclopedia of information.

 

[ssman]

You might have to lower your expectations just a tad. Most of the stuff in your price range, including the stuff you already own, is pretty much barely at the threshold of entry or consumer-level. This "greatest hifi" stuff might be more for down the road at some point.

as far as listening to music my soundcard and headphone's are as good as you can get. The $100 difference between 0404 and 1212m is barely noticeable in sound quality, same w/ senn 580 vs senn 650. maybe on this board you wont agree, but you can go to head-fi and look there so i dont know what you mean.

all i need is 1 mic, i don't need to "mix". 1 mic (shure sm 57 used = $70), 1 preamp ($100?) and cables... wouldn't that be it

 

[crazydoc]

What kind of music?

 

[gordone]

The problem is that the $100 preamp is NOT going to be "the threshold of hifi". Also, the A/D converters in your card might be "ok", but if you're looking for a "hifi" setup, you might be looking at a couple of grand.
-$500 for a decent condenser mic
-$1200 for a Great River MP2 (that's what I use)
-$500 or more for a great set of converters

So like others said, you might want to lower your expectations a bit. The stuff you need to playback music is alot different than the stuff you need to record music. Also, don't discount the sound of the room you're recording in.

BUT, you should be able to get started with an SM57 and a Audio Buddy, but just be aware, that there's a ton of better stuff out there once your experience reveals to you the limitations of your current setup.
Good luck!

as far as listening to music my soundcard and headphone's are as good as you can get. The $100 difference between 0404 and 1212m is barely noticeable in sound quality, same w/ senn 580 vs senn 650. maybe on this board you wont agree, but you can go to head-fi and look there so i dont know what you mean.

all i need is 1 mic, i don't need to "mix". 1 mic (shure sm 57 used = $70), 1 preamp ($100?) and cables... wouldn't that be it

 

[tallman]

What you have is entry level gear.. but don't worry. Entry level gear makes acceptable recordings. So now you're looking for a pre-amp and a microphone. A mic and a pre-amp is indeed all you still need to make recordings. For a microphone, a good beginner mic is the SM57. A good begginner condenser is the Studio Projects B1. These both come in at about $125CDN at my local store, which suggests to me they can be had for about $80US.

Finally you need a pre-amp. You are not going to get a great pre-amp in your price range, but you can get a clear sounding pre-amp that will certainly meet your expectations of hi-fi.

Try picking up an ART Tube MP preamp. It is a one channel pre-amp that sounds decent, and will cost about $70US.

There are a few final things you need to get good sound. You will need a mic-stand to avoid microphone handling noise, and you will need a windscreen or "pop-stopper" to reduce popping of the mic, and get rid of nasty "s" sounds.

If you can tell me exactly what you are planning to record, I can suggest parts better catered to your particular purpose.

Most of the guys here are *really* into high quality recording, and one of the first things you notice, once you've got basic recording skills, is that as good as you thought your recordings sounded with $400 worth of gear, they don't compare to commercial recordings you buy at the record store. Studios capable of that type of recording usually have a quarter million dollars worth of gear, or more.

Excellent recordings are usually made with mics in the $400-$4000 range, pre-amp's in the $1000 to $3000 range, tape decks that chime in at about $25000, and a whole host of other ingredients including compressors, limiters, enhancers, and so-on.

If you're just planning on doing spoken word, then all you really need is a quiet room, and a few hundred dollars worth of gear.

Oh.. there is one more ingredient that top-quality recordings have.. an experienced recording engineer. Once you get the basics, you can start working on that experience.

 

[crazydoc]

It depends on the type of vocals you want to record, but at this point in your recording career you will probably be perfectly satisfied with an MXL V67 mic and an Audiobuddy preamp for a total of $180. A mic stand and cables will be another $30 - $50.

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=6458&Category=Microphones

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=10658&Category=Audio_Processors

The Studio Projects VTB1 will give you more versatility, but a higher price.

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=10929&Category=Audio_Processors

If you can't swing the $100 for the mic, there are lots of other cheaper condenser mics out there that would probably be OK for your purposes. The MXL 990 is about the cheapest, and some folks have liked it on vocals (though others haven't.)

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/273156/

Personally I'd stay away from dynamic mics (such as SM57 types), because the cheap preamps available will more than likely degrade their sound.

 

[ssman]

thanks for the help. (please don't crap on my soundcard and headphones though, it's hurts my pride as a head-fier, but I get the point that this is entry level consumer gear for recording)

i'm recording myself i sing indian classical vocal, I want to get the most accurate reproduction of my voice with my price range. i don't think you know what that sounds like, but you can say it'd be like recording a male solo opera singer. if it would help if i link something i can.

I got a lot of different recommendations, I think I should go for a condenser mic as crazydoc advised, but studio projects b1, v67


thanks gordon your message was helpful... I see that recording equipment is a lot more expensive to get good sound.
crazydoc and tallman sorry for not replying to your first post. thanks for your really helpful recommendations though, should I look for used equipment or are used mics bad?

and should I go for the audiobuddy or someone recommended - ART Tube MP preamp ($70). since I'm only using 1 mic.

THANK YOU!

 

[ssman]

man! I dont have the resources, the time, or experience to audition and pick and choose by differentiating "the sonic and tonal nuances each particular piece of gear provides." for headphones its taken me a while to do that with all the gear out there (ex. grado sound vs senn's vs ety's etc.). from what I've heard about recording equipment there seems to be a lot more out there.

 

[Mustafa Salaam]

man! I dont have the resources, the time, or experience to audition and pick and choose by differentiating "the sonic and tonal nuances each particular piece of gear provides." for headphones its taken me a while to do that with all the gear out there (ex. grado sound vs senn's vs ety's etc.). from what I've heard about recording equipment there seems to be a lot more out there.

Then just go out and buy all Behringer gear!!

 

[Treeline]

Don't sweat it; just get started with what you can afford. By used everything if you can, but learn the value before you buy as you can easily pay too much.

I'd look for a used mic stand, used preamp, and new mic.

A new stand is $20.

A new Audio Buddy or ART preamp is about $80, as pointed out earler. Just be aware that whatever preamp you end up using, it must provide phantom power to make a condenser mic work.

Look for a large diaphragm condenser mic with an elastic shock mount. there are a million of 'em, all varying quality, most cheap ones promising way more than they deliver. But a new Studio Projects B1 is still under a hundred bucks and I've found it to be solid and versatile; I use it as a jack of all trades mic. YMMV.

You'll have to get cables; look at big online vendors for store brand cables to start with. They can be as little as $ 8 - 10. Fine for now, although you will see intense debates about the virtues of oxygen free v. cast silver v. aluminum conductors - all cables running at ten bucks a foot or more. No need for any of that right now.

You'll need a cable from the preamp to the sound card, and you should learn about balanced v. unbalanced cables and the whys about them. The search engine here will get you the answers on that issue.

That, and software on the computer, is pretty much it to get started. If you don't have a sequencing software program, check out the n-track forum here and follow the links. It's cheap and powerful; an excellent learning tool.

Pop stoppers are worth the twenty bucks or so that they cost. Your sound card is ok for now - it's far better than what I started with and not too far off from what I use now. Get some hours under your belt with this setup and read everything in sight here - and absolutely everything Harvey Gerst posts - and it'll come.

 

[ssman]

got gear, but...

I've bought an ART Tube MP and a marshall v67g now. Do I need a wind/pop filter? the mic says you need one because of moisture, but is it ok without? I don't want to destroy the mic.

 

[Innovations]

Whether you can do without is a question of mic placement. If you have your mouth pointed right at the mic within a few inches then most likely you will want one. Most voiceover, narration, broadcast, etc work is done either with the mic at about a 45 degree angle to the side or above. In these positions I don't use a pop filter. But building or buying a pop filter is cheap so have one in your toolkit. An embroidery hoop is available at fabric stores for pennies and even if you have to buy a pair of nylon stockings the total cost is pretty cheap (In reality most of us guys get the other one once one of our wife's/girlfriend's/sister's pair get a run).