Public Mix Contest #11 !!!!!!

[mshilarious]

I think part of my problem in mixing this is...
The song doesn't really lend itself at all to artistic leeway within the mixing.

As I said I haven't listened to the raw tracks (not Raw Tracks!), but not my impression is that's not the case. tenkas' intro is a pretty good demonstration of that, and I could see a mix that's a 'reverse' tenkas--start with everybody, and then drop instruments for the first verse.

Also I think there's plenty of room for creativity not only in the mixing of the distorted rhythm, but especially in the interplay of the backing vocal and the lead. That's a critical area that I'll be focusing on in judging.

 

[NL5]

yeah bad link! shame! whos incharge here.....?

i already told xfin about that, i gave him the right link.
if you wanna hear my mix, here it is

http://briefcase.yahoo.com/benison_jerberson
click public folder
click HR-PMC11

We need a direct link. The yahoo briefcase link doesn't look like it will work.

 

[vanbas2]

Here is my shot
Please tell me what do you think about it

vanbas

 

[Disposable]

As I said I haven't listened to the raw tracks (not Raw Tracks!), but not my impression is that's not the case. tenkas' intro is a pretty good demonstration of that, and I could see a mix that's a 'reverse' tenkas--start with everybody, and then drop instruments for the first verse.

Also I think there's plenty of room for creativity not only in the mixing of the distorted rhythm, but especially in the interplay of the backing vocal and the lead. That's a critical area that I'll be focusing on in judging.

See, I'd just as soon leave out both the distorted guit,
AND the backing vocals. As I really don't care for either...

Guess I'll have to play around some more.
Thanks for the insight about how you plan to judge...

 

[Kainz]

As I said I haven't listened to the raw tracks (not Raw Tracks!), but not my impression is that's not the case. tenkas' intro is a pretty good demonstration of that, and I could see a mix that's a 'reverse' tenkas--start with everybody, and then drop instruments for the first verse.

Also I think there's plenty of room for creativity not only in the mixing of the distorted rhythm, but especially in the interplay of the backing vocal and the lead. That's a critical area that I'll be focusing on in judging.

Hmh, I have to somewhat diasgree with you when it comes to the creativity part. The only place where there indeed is some room for that is the intro (and yes the distorted part. But the song's feeling doesn't really need some hardcore distortion there?). The rest of the song is quite there allready.. I'm not saying it isn't possible to turn it completely something else than what it is. But what is the point? The most bizarre mix? In _my opinion_ this song is meant to have quite acoustic and natural feel to it (or that is what I think the band is after, and the sounds/overall playing of the dry tracks definitely suggest this too).

Actually I didn't disagree so much with you afterall hehe

I'm interested what do you mean with the "interplay of vocals" there? Those back vox are a bit out of tune and it hurts the overall clearness to bring them to something else than backvox (or lets say, relatively out of tune compared with the main vox/gtr). Again you could play with the scissor here and create two solo voxes.. but is this what the song needs..? I dunno

And btw, that reverb(ish) and hollow sound you are hearing isn't coming from the dry tracks. They are pretty nicely and professionally tracked (GJ again Chris). It is just the mixing

 

[ocnor]

Like Chris's reference mix...
While sounding pretty good, didn't do anything for me.
Though, I know that's probably how this song should be mixed...
I really don't want to mix it like that.

This is exactly the point that I brought up in the earlier thread about the way these contests are judged. The winner will ALWAYS be determined by the judges "PERSONAL PREFERENCE" because this can't be separated from the technical aspects of the mix. For example how much is too much Bass? What is not enough air? What does a killer guitar sound like? How much reverb is too much?

 

[Disposable]

I'd actually,
This past weekend,
Started a much more "tighter"
Or "less open" sounding mix...

While it's not what I originally was wanting to do...
It's more a "common" type of mix.

 

[mshilarious]

This is exactly the point that I brought up in the earlier thread about the way these contests are judged. The winner will ALWAYS be determined by the judges "PERSONAL PREFERENCE" because this can't be separated from the technical aspects of the mix. For example how much is too much Bass? What is not enough air? What does a killer guitar sound like? How much reverb is too much?

Well music is an art form, so it has to be subjective.

I will say I didn't DL the raw tracks because I didn't want to create a personal mix as a standard AND I've only listened to xfinsterx's mix on PC speakers. I'm open to any interpretation, but I'd like it to be stylistically cohesive and technically correct--and please note that technical factors, however subjectively judged, dominate the scoring.

 

[xfinsterx]

Ya know after listening to 'em all, I think maybe the drums were recorded in a verby space. xfinsterx?

Bingo!

Thanks for doing these reviews Mshil!

(on another note)

Its my birthday today people so im stoked.

Also, ive heard this song close to 100 times in the last week or so.
And my ability to crituiqe it is dwindling.
Im taking a two day break from even hearing the song.
Thanks to all of you for entering and working so hard at the mix.
Thats really inspiring to me personally, and equally rewarding for the same reason.

Now...in going to go get my B-day started Jack Daniels style!!

Take care and mix on! Ill be back to judge on the 25th.

-Finster

 

[xfinsterx]

This is exactly the point that I brought up in the earlier thread about the way these contests are judged. The winner will ALWAYS be determined by the judges "PERSONAL PREFERENCE" because this can't be separated from the technical aspects of the mix. For example how much is too much Bass? What is not enough air? What does a killer guitar sound like? How much reverb is too much?

Thats right Ocnor!
Even if i tried i wouldnt be able to supress my mix preferences while judging.

However....I know when something is good and when it isnt, whether i prefer it or not.

 

[reshp1]

Happy birthday Finster, say hello to Jack for me.

 

[xfinsterx]

Happy birthday Finster, say hello to Jack for me.

Thanks buddy!

Actually Jack's gonna get aquainted with my steak marinade (gonna BBQ) before he gets started on me!

God im a sap for BBQ.

Carry On!!

 

[ocnor]

Well music is an art form, so it has to be subjective.

I will say I didn't DL the raw tracks because I didn't want to create a personal mix as a standard AND I've only listened to xfinsterx's mix on PC speakers. I'm open to any interpretation, but I'd like it to be stylistically cohesive and technically correct--and please note that technical factors, however subjectively judged, dominate the scoring.

This is where you get into that gray area that I was talking about before. What is the scientific formula used to determine if something is stylistically cohesive and technically correct? As you pointed out "music is an art form". How do you judge art? In my opinion a 3 judge panel is far too small to get an acurate consensus of a mix. I believe that a better method would be to require all of the entries to have a standard MP3 conversion rate. Then have everyone that submits an entry to vote by PM or email on their 3 favorite mixes. The votes would be kept secrect until the final tally.

 

[NL5]

This is where you get into that gray area that I was talking about before. What is the scientific formula used to determine if something is stylistically cohesive and technically correct? As you pointed out "music is an art form". How do you judge art? In my opinion a 3 judge panel is far too small to get an acurate consensus of a mix. I believe that a better method would be to require all of the entries to have a standard MP3 conversion rate. Then have everyone that submits an entry to vote by PM or email on their 3 favorite mixes. The votes would be kept secrect until the final tally.

That has been brought up in the past - these contests already entail quite a bit of work for everyone involved with putting them on - besides, it is meant to be a FUN learning excerise!

 

[Disposable]

Ocnor...
That's how the contests are run over at my other "stompin' grounds" musesmuse.com. While it seems to work well, it does take a LOT of time to listen to everyone's stuff. I think for our purposes here, three judges is likely to be enough. I have a lot of fun with these, even if I come nowhere near winning. It gives me new material to experiment with.

 

[ocnor]

However....I know when something is good and when it isnt, whether i prefer it or not.

So if you went into an art gallery you would be able to tell the difference between a beautiful abstract sculpture and a bunch of junk welded together by a half wit?

 

[mshilarious]

This is where you get into that gray area that I was talking about before. What is the scientific formula used to determine if something is stylistically cohesive and technically correct? As you pointed out "music is an art form". How do you judge art? In my opinion a 3 judge panel is far too small to get an acurate consensus of a mix. I believe that a better method would be to require all of the entries to have a standard MP3 conversion rate. Then have everyone that submits an entry to vote by PM or email on their 3 favorite mixes. The votes would be kept secrect until the final tally.

Volunteer to manage that for PMC #12 and I bet xfinsterx would be happy

Seriously, gimme a list of objective criteria and I'll publish results, but I won't judge that way. It's too easy to mix by the numbers and still sound like poo.

 

[ocnor]

Ocnor...
That's how the contests are run over at my other "stompin' grounds" musesmuse.com. While it seems to work well, it does take a LOT of time to listen to everyone's stuff. I think for our purposes here, three judges is likely to be enough. I have a lot of fun with these, even if I come nowhere near winning. It gives me new material to experiment with.

Don't you listen to all of the mixes anyway? I listen to every mix and read all of the comments made about each one. This is just as an important part of learning as my own mixing attempts are. I feel that more opinions are better and the people that actually attempt to mix the tune have a better insight than people that didn't.

 

[7string]

Now...in going to go get my B-day started Jack Daniels style!!

Ah... a man after my own heart... uh... liver...

Happy Birthday -X!

 

[Kainz]

Happy Birthday man! And I agree... way too much this song even for me

Anyway, something new from me here.

The more I listened the song the more I grew tired of the intro... It just plain sucks
So I tried to give some more "tension" for it. I dunno if I succeeded at all... heh. Tweaked some other things too. This time it is around 99% there hihi

The song: Yet another one....

Edit: I had some really strange high frequency thingies happening there and the overall mp3 quality was a bit strange.. Dunno what caused it but I coded it again and replaced the old one. Seems to be ok now. Strange..