F
foreverain4
New member
i am not saying that a great mic pre will not make a difference, i just think it is important to build your signal chain from the front to the back..
C
chessrock
Banned
Middleman said:
Fact is, if you want a professional sound, you're going to have to have a quality source ... and a quality space in which to track and monitor. Good mic pres can help. In the sense that it's a good idea to have them, if you can.
But on the whole mic / pre debate, I'll take the good mics any day.
Preamps are just a box with phantom power and a volume knob on it that you plug your mic in to.
Mics and monitors are transducers of sound; and it's at that stage - where sound is changed from one form to the other - where the greatest potential degredation / distortion to the signal occurs.
A good microphone will still sound like itself, whatever it's plugged in to. A crappy, harsh Chinese mic still sounds like ... a crappy, harsh Chinese-made mic ... whether it's plugged in to a $1K + mic pre, or a $200 one. Worry about the accoustics, monitors, and your mic collection before you blow your wad on a gain knob.
Q
Quantagee
Banned
chessrock said:
So, what you are saying is that a good mic and a good room and good monitors and good sound sources = a good recording with different mics?
How is that possible? I can record outside if I want and that removes the room. But, I still get non-professional recordings though I have a good sound source. I have the best mics (Behringer and Studio Projects B1s) and I still have a hard time with pro sound. It was only when I bought my new pre-amps that I made a good recording. This was outside too. I will move everything inside to my room and test your theory. Maybe I will have all the eggcrates I need by then. I am excited with all the iformation I get from this great BBS. It is looking better than Harmony Central (I have many friends there).
F
foreverain4
New member
Quantagee said:
reshp1
New member
Quantagee said:
You're kidding right? Please tell me you're kidding.
I
In Tune Audio
Member
Quantagee said:
Okay I'm confused. In your first post you said you would buy mics first. In this post you said it was when you bought new preamps that you finally got a good recording.
A Good room is one that has some natural reflections. IMO you don't want a totally dead room, but you need to control your reflections as well. This is for a whole nother thread and has been covered a bunch, but never used eggcrates. They will make your recording sound like crap. People always try them because they think that it will make things sound proof. But no matter what you do, your room will never be sound proof, and eggcrates don't absord sound. Most will actually reflect sound, and in a very unnatural way.
Q
Quantagee
Banned
foreverain4 said:
ljmaxx
Hurricane Offender
Quantagee said:
I just looked at your profile and it says you are an audio engineer. Is this true?
F
foreverain4
New member
Quantagee said:
sorry i couldnt help you man.. good luck
Q
Quantagee
Banned
ljmaxx said:
When I get to High School, I will be one. I am the only audio engineer in my school and I record all the bands here. I love to learn and I love audio engineering. That is what I do and want to do forever.
I am building a studio and expanding my studio to 8-tracks. I want to stay with analog too.
S
Sonic Idiot
New member
Buy either:
A super nice mic.
-or-
A super nice preamp.
It makes no difference. What it might do, however, is inspire you to futz around more with your equipment and (gasp) even record some music and (gasp) PRACTICE your chosen medium (voice, lute, slide whistle, spoons, banjo, Mooluk, etc.) You'll be amazed how awesome an accomplished musician sounds recorded with gear costing less than a grand. And, yes, it is a RECORD. If the artist says it's a record, it is a record--big fancy studio's be damned (many of which have the room vibe of a clinic) Thank dog we live in a time when we can do great work ourselves, outside of the recording industry, and as we like it.
A super nice mic.
-or-
A super nice preamp.
It makes no difference. What it might do, however, is inspire you to futz around more with your equipment and (gasp) even record some music and (gasp) PRACTICE your chosen medium (voice, lute, slide whistle, spoons, banjo, Mooluk, etc.) You'll be amazed how awesome an accomplished musician sounds recorded with gear costing less than a grand. And, yes, it is a RECORD. If the artist says it's a record, it is a record--big fancy studio's be damned (many of which have the room vibe of a clinic) Thank dog we live in a time when we can do great work ourselves, outside of the recording industry, and as we like it.
F
foreverain4
New member
Quantagee said:
high school huh?! why does your age say 37?
S
Sonic Idiot
New member
Sorry. That was a rant. I will say I am a professor of Chinese mics, some of which I like a lot. But moving up to the RNP from an ART MP easily, easily made the biggest difference in my sound. (Including my experience with a neuman TLM 103. One of many, of course, but I was unimpressed.)
The new Neve's, in spite of their newness (yet unproven) give me a gear woody... what can I way, I'm a pre-amp guy. Ultimately, If I had the cash, I'd spend the money on some big monster tube pre--like a UA.
The new Neve's, in spite of their newness (yet unproven) give me a gear woody... what can I way, I'm a pre-amp guy. Ultimately, If I had the cash, I'd spend the money on some big monster tube pre--like a UA.
J
jonnyc
New member
Hey Quantagee you said "Quality Equipment is the Key". Actually talent is the key. A talented person can work absolute wonders with the crappiest equipment.
C
chessrock
Banned
Guys, Quantagee is full of shit.
He's trying to be Walters, only he's better at it because he's actually funny.
He's trying to be Walters, only he's better at it because he's actually funny.
Q
Quantagee
Banned
foreverain4 said:
my teachers all say that I am slow, but getting there.
What is this, the Spanish exposition or what?
I am trying to learn, let's stay on topic please.
Thankyou.
johnsuitcase
New member
Bang for the buck
I think you're best off working with what you have, trying different things, maybe borrowing or renting pieces here and there, until it's painfully obvious to you what is your weakest link.
Having some different flavors of Mics (a few LD condensers, a couple MD condensers, a selection of dynamics), and a few different mic pre's (even the cheap Presonus BlueTubes work really well) will give you some chance to try different combos.
For me, I usually look into gear when I have a session and realize I need another set of headphones or whatever. If you just can't get the vocal sound you want, research it, rent some different things and try everything you can think of. If all your mics suck (yours are a decent selection of low-end mics), maybe try something more high-end. If your Pre's are cheap, maybe try something there. One of these elements will make a bigger difference than the others. Then you have to weigh the costs.
If you really want to get technical, you can make a decision grid:
Item_____improvement (1-10)_______cost
Mic 1__________3 _________________$250
Mic 2__________5 _________________$500
Pre 1__________4_________________$600
Pre 2 _________7_________________$1200
The "improvement" column is subjective, of course, but do your best to estimate. Now, just calculate out Bang-for-the-buck:
(improvement/cost)
Mic 1 = .012
Mic 2 = .010
Pre 1 = .006
Pre 2 = .0058
So, dollar for dollar, Mic 1 will be your best bet. And the next piece to pick up would be Pre 1. Using those two should result in vastly improved sounds, for less than Pre 2 (you could get Mic 1 & Mic 2, but since the mic and pre are used together, you get a synergistic effect with the best mic and best pre dollar-for-dollar).
I hope this methodology brings out the importance of playing your cards right. Most of us don't have unlimited funds, we need to put the money we can spend into that thing which will give us the best return immediately.
Having a Universal Audio LA-610 and a Neumann U87 may be great, but if that's ALL you have, you're SOL.
Think bang for the buck.
And of course, the best bang for the buck is knowledge, which you can gain here, or by experimenting, reading books, etc.
I think you're best off working with what you have, trying different things, maybe borrowing or renting pieces here and there, until it's painfully obvious to you what is your weakest link.
Having some different flavors of Mics (a few LD condensers, a couple MD condensers, a selection of dynamics), and a few different mic pre's (even the cheap Presonus BlueTubes work really well) will give you some chance to try different combos.
For me, I usually look into gear when I have a session and realize I need another set of headphones or whatever. If you just can't get the vocal sound you want, research it, rent some different things and try everything you can think of. If all your mics suck (yours are a decent selection of low-end mics), maybe try something more high-end. If your Pre's are cheap, maybe try something there. One of these elements will make a bigger difference than the others. Then you have to weigh the costs.
If you really want to get technical, you can make a decision grid:
Item_____improvement (1-10)_______cost
Mic 1__________3 _________________$250
Mic 2__________5 _________________$500
Pre 1__________4_________________$600
Pre 2 _________7_________________$1200
The "improvement" column is subjective, of course, but do your best to estimate. Now, just calculate out Bang-for-the-buck:
(improvement/cost)
Mic 1 = .012
Mic 2 = .010
Pre 1 = .006
Pre 2 = .0058
So, dollar for dollar, Mic 1 will be your best bet. And the next piece to pick up would be Pre 1. Using those two should result in vastly improved sounds, for less than Pre 2 (you could get Mic 1 & Mic 2, but since the mic and pre are used together, you get a synergistic effect with the best mic and best pre dollar-for-dollar).
I hope this methodology brings out the importance of playing your cards right. Most of us don't have unlimited funds, we need to put the money we can spend into that thing which will give us the best return immediately.
Having a Universal Audio LA-610 and a Neumann U87 may be great, but if that's ALL you have, you're SOL.
Think bang for the buck.
And of course, the best bang for the buck is knowledge, which you can gain here, or by experimenting, reading books, etc.
Middleman
Professional Amateur
chessrock said:
I disagree. Experience with cheap and expensive units of both preamps and mics has shown me that you can't get a great sound out of expensive mics with marginal preamps. However, a really good preamp can make marginal microphones at least usable.
I do agree about the space. That can be as much as 50% of the sound.
warble
New member
Quantagee said:
Damn, that's a good price for that piece of gear. I must have been been crazy to sell mine in 2000 for $50.
Warhead
Jai guru deva om
Sonic Idiot said:
I disagree, and don't understand this statement.
Confused...
War
