My computer is now useless (Includes: excerpts my letter to Toshiba)

[DM60]

I know the hardware choices are limited and tested to function together, but surely the move to intel meant that the hardware is not higher grade than anything else?
The logic boards may be of a better design or quality, but all the components are generic.
Intel integrated/nvidia discreet gpus, hynix ram (in my mbp anyway), broadcom wireless and ethernet chips, intel processers, hitachi hard drives etc..

The only difference between an 8800gt and a mac 8800gt is £100 and a hexadecimal bit in the rom.

I consult manufacturing, I was working with an agricultural manufacturer and they use an ECM (Engine Control Module), they would use the same engine, the ECM was used to proved more HP (if purchased), programmed for tracks or tires, a host of others. Same engine, just the programming. So, it is pretty common.

I only dislike Apple not because of the OS, but because of Jobs. He was always a patent troll, even in the 80's. He gets his GUI and laser printing from Xerox, but as soon as someone copies him, he hauled them in to court. He hurt a lot of programmers in the early days (Jobs made Bill Gates look like a school girl). I've always disliked Apple for that reason. But it is a decent product really.

 

[Steenamaroo]

I consult manufacturing, I was working with an agricultural manufacturer and they use an ECM (Engine Control Module), they would use the same engine, the ECM was used to proved more HP (if purchased), programmed for tracks or tires, a host of others. Same engine, just the programming. So, it is pretty common.

I vaguely remember setting specs on some CAT ecms for a guy a while back. Sounds like a similar thing.

He was always a patent troll, even in the 80's.

Sounds about right.

 

[propman]

No. that is not true. I've done this for over 20 years. On PCs, they work with a common standard (that is part of PCs problems, not everyone adheres to the standard).

I believe what was being suggested was moving the pre-installed OS along with the drive which -- being that windows is (from what I've read) very hardware dependant, will not work unless you know something I don't.

 

[rayc]

I can empathise: about 2 years ago I bought a brand new Dell desktop specifically set/assembled for audio recording. I was great for a year and a month (no longer under warranty) t which stage it died. I discovered after some research, that the motherboard was the problem and a VERY common fault across the model and well documented on the net. I could replace the motherboard for a couple of hundred dollars but Dell's replacements have the same latent problem - no point going there. Non Dell repacements were available, dearer and had no warranty worth owning. I bought a 2nd hand ACER for $300.
Dell are off my list forever - not just the m/board but the 4 DVD drives & 2 HDDs I've had to replace in the net machine upstairs and the appauling call centre based customer service has declined in service dramatically over time.
On the other end my wife bought me a 2nd hand/refurbished ACER Travelmate 1/2 a dozen years ago & it's still chugging along.
Adam, in every case I've sent my HDD with an external drive to a data recovery mob who've save just about everything for me. Make sure you get your data if nothing else.
My rule of thumb for audio is simply that laptops aren't robust enough to trust.

 

[DM60]

I believe what was being suggested was moving the pre-installed OS along with the drive which -- being that windows is (from what I've read) very hardware dependant, will not work unless you know something I don't.

If you give me your laptop information, I will tell you what type of hard drive you have. Everything else doesn't matter. You will take your hard drive, move it to another hardware platform and boot up, update drivers to your hardware, run as if nothing has happened. There might be a few issues you will have to search for drivers, etc. But it isn't like having to reinstall. The new computer will be like the old. The only issue you could face is that the new computer may require a few different drivers for improved performance.

Don't despair, you just need to get another laptop. As long as your hard drive is good, then everything is still there. If you are in the US, Tiger Direct is having some good Laptop Sales. Hell everyone is having laptop sales.

 

[BroKen_H]

Propman, you are correct in assuming you will not be able to boot to the drive of a different system. Unless the system is IDENTICAL to the previous system your Registry will not allow bootup. However, I have (on many occasions) put a boot drive from a scrapped machine into a secondary (non-boot) position on a different machine to get data from the drive. If needs be, you can buy an external case for your drive and turn it into a usb device to accomplish that end.

The problem isn't with Toshiba's normally rock solid builds. It's with the way Wal-Mart/Target/Lowe's etc. do business. If you want them to sell your product, you have to build it for their price. This often means that the product you buy will have inferior equipment or poor engineering (which accounts for a lot of the cost of most electronics) and subsequently you will get a possibly inferior item. A lot of $300-400 laptops you buy at Wal-Mart will be excellent, solid machines, but you are taking a crap shoot when you buy there. If you buy a low-end Toshiba from Toshiba.com, you will likely still get a solid machine. But you will pay more.

I bought a Husqvarna riding mower at Lowe's a few years back and had nothing but problems with it. Kept having to send it to a service center over 100 miles away, even though there is a Husqvarna service center here in town. When I asked at the service center if they could fix a simple problem for me I was told that they couldn't order the parts! Even though they service the same model, the ones from Lowe's are not the same machine.

My brother runs a computer service center for HP/Toshiba laptops and the advent of $300 laptops at Wal-Mart and others has almost put him out of business. No one buys $3000 laptops that need a service center any more. They buy $300 disposable computers that can be replaced every 6 months if necessary and the $300 machines are simply recycled. It's honestly cheaper to buy a $300 computer every six months than to buy a $3000 computer every two years, so most businesses are running on that model. It's poor for the environment, poor for labor, just poor. We've adopted China's cheap throw away model instead of the US's quality model that had our economy booming through the 50's 60's and 70's.

Oops, didn't mean to make this a sociopolitical post...that just slipped out through my fingers.

 

[jimmys69]

Propman, you are correct in assuming you will not be able to boot to the drive of a different system. Unless the system is IDENTICAL to the previous system your Registry will not allow bootup. However, I have (on many occasions) put a boot drive from a scrapped machine into a secondary (non-boot) position on a different machine to get data from the drive. If needs be, you can buy an external case for your drive and turn it into a usb device to accomplish that end.

The problem isn't with Toshiba's normally rock solid builds. It's with the way Wal-Mart/Target/Lowe's etc. do business. If you want them to sell your product, you have to build it for their price. This often means that the product you buy will have inferior equipment or poor engineering (which accounts for a lot of the cost of most electronics) and subsequently you will get a possibly inferior item. A lot of $300-400 laptops you buy at Wal-Mart will be excellent, solid machines, but you are taking a crap shoot when you buy there. If you buy a low-end Toshiba from Toshiba.com, you will likely still get a solid machine. But you will pay more.

I bought a Husqvarna riding mower at Lowe's a few years back and had nothing but problems with it. Kept having to send it to a service center over 100 miles away, even though there is a Husqvarna service center here in town. When I asked at the service center if they could fix a simple problem for me I was told that they couldn't order the parts! Even though they service the same model, the ones from Lowe's are not the same machine.

My brother runs a computer service center for HP/Toshiba laptops and the advent of $300 laptops at Wal-Mart and others has almost put him out of business. No one buys $3000 laptops that need a service center any more. They buy $300 disposable computers that can be replaced every 6 months if necessary and the $300 machines are simply recycled. It's honestly cheaper to buy a $300 computer every six months than to buy a $3000 computer every two years, so most businesses are running on that model. It's poor for the environment, poor for labor, just poor. We've adopted China's cheap throw away model instead of the US's quality model that had our economy booming through the 50's 60's and 70's.

Oops, didn't mean to make this a sociopolitical post...that just slipped out through my fingers.

There is much truth in this post. Even Daltile wholesale distributors are not able to get pricing better than Home Depot sells their own ceramic tile for (I have a remodel/tile business). It comes from bulk (by the container) pricing. The colors don't match and the quality is poor. The same goes for any chain store. Product is based on quantity, not quality.

I have a Toshiba Laptop that gives my home built recording PC a run for it's money. Built like a rock. Not built for Walmart. Keep in mind, that is a $1000 laptop, as opposed to a $300 disposable version. There is meaning to the saying 'you get what you pay for'. It may work good for toothpaste, but a computer that you depend on? sigh.....

 

[Steenamaroo]

So, first, I will say, you can't compare a Mac with a $400 laptop.

Are there machines in the toshiba price range with better build quality?

yes but they are in the $800-1200 price range.

That just needed to be seen, in order.

Here is what I would do and it is simple. I would go find a comparable laptop that works, pull the hard drive out of the old, install into the replacement, update drivers, keep charging. It is that simple. Plenty of how to videos, just make sure your hard drive is compatible with the replacement system.

Propman, you are correct in assuming you will not be able to boot to the drive of a different system.

Which of these is correct?

 

[jimmys69]

That just needed to be seen, in order.






Which of these is correct?

From my (limited) experience, hard drives from lappy's of different manufactures will not boot. I would sooner try the external case option.

 

[DM60]

Propman, you are correct in assuming you will not be able to boot to the drive of a different system. Unless the system is IDENTICAL to the previous system your Registry will not allow bootup. However, I have (on many occasions) put a boot drive from a scrapped machine into a secondary (non-boot) position on a different machine to get data from the drive. If needs be, you can buy an external case for your drive and turn it into a usb device to accomplish that end.

The problem isn't with Toshiba's normally rock solid builds. It's with the way Wal-Mart/Target/Lowe's etc. do business. If you want them to sell your product, you have to build it for their price. This often means that the product you buy will have inferior equipment or poor engineering (which accounts for a lot of the cost of most electronics) and subsequently you will get a possibly inferior item. A lot of $300-400 laptops you buy at Wal-Mart will be excellent, solid machines, but you are taking a crap shoot when you buy there. If you buy a low-end Toshiba from Toshiba.com, you will likely still get a solid machine. But you will pay more.

All I can say is, I have replaced whole systems (board, memory chip graphics card), put my old hard drive in and updated the drivers, kept on going. So, not sure what you are talking about if this is a Windows OS system. Maybe on the old Macs as stated before where there were actual hardware architectural changes (Processor change for example) but I have never experienced it with a Windows based computer. Only issue you would face is the connector type in this case, ISA or SATA.

 

[BroKen_H]

Let me be more clear. If you have two systems with identical hardware, you will be able to boot without issue, but you should change the registration key to the one on the new machine (legal issues, not operational). If you have minor (and I do mean minor) differences, you can boot in safe mode, install drivers for the new equipment and then reboot to the new OS. You will still want to use the registration key from the new machine.

Now, if you are going from a Toshiba with an Intel processor and WD hard drive (common) to a HP with an AMD and Seagate (also common) it likely will not boot even in safe mode. The Registry (which I mentioned in my previous post) is written to the hard drive and controls many, many aspects of how and why your computer works. If the motherboard, processor, HD controller, BIOS and many other things have changed, you will have extreme problems trying to headache your way through. It is just simpler to put the HD in an external case and pop it into the system as an external drive after boot. All the data will still be available, just not the OS (which should be included with any laptop you purchase).

 

[BroKen_H]

Steen,

Basically, both are correct. DM60 is stating plainly that you need to be sure your hard drive will be compatible with the new system. Six of one, half dozen of the other. No arguments.

 

[Steenamaroo]

Alright. As long as that's clear to the OP.

 

[jporter12]

In my experiences, you may be able to swap your old drive into a new computer and get it to work, but it will never perform as well as just loading your software on the new computer and copying your files over to the new one. If you buy an external enclosure, you can keep the drive in there, and use it for backup!

Regarding the quality of a Wal-mart laptop, I think this has been pretty well hashed out here, but this is my experience with my low-end (not walmart) Toshiba. I have a refurbished Toshiba that I bought from Toshiba around 5 years ago for around $500, hauled it to work every day for about 3 years, about half that time strapped to the back of my motorcycle seat, has been dropped several times, used and abused, batter replaced, hard drive upgraded, and the thing hasn't missed a lick!

Don't get me started on consumer grade HP's...

 

[polarity]

There are lots of things that cause this not work. Not that it can't work but as a general rule it will not. Usually it has to do with motherboard chipset. Different chipset = blue screen of death on boot USUALLY (not always). The other hard ware like video card, sound, network, etc can easily be reloaded but some things cant. You CAN though do the hard drive swap, if it boots you're set, if it doesn't and you have windows cds you can run a windows repair (NOT RESTORE), repair might solve it.

Also I looked in your profile and didn't see, where are you located? I won't claim to be the most knowledgeable person here but I have done IT work professionally for about 13 years, everything from geek squad to private consulting. System Admin and engineer to phone support. If it's something I can help with, I'd be more than happy to. I work on these things all day anyway, and extra hour of my time one evening wouldn't hurt.

All I can say is, I have replaced whole systems (board, memory chip graphics card), put my old hard drive in and updated the drivers, kept on going. So, not sure what you are talking about if this is a Windows OS system. Maybe on the old Macs as stated before where there were actual hardware architectural changes (Processor change for example) but I have never experienced it with a Windows based computer. Only issue you would face is the connector type in this case, ISA or SATA.

 

[Rod Norman]

I'm really sorry to hear about your problem. At this point you need to do everything you can to download your material to another computer. I'm assuming you didn't back up all your files? Try plugging in a flash drive, rebooting, and seeing if it will read the flash drive long enough to drag and drop the files. Remember that the hard drive is still intact., so looking for another laptop and installing the drive into a case and making it your external drive might allow you to recover all your files. Given the nature of your correspondence with Toshiba, I doubt if they will replace your computer. Look for an out of date laptop online or in thrift shops. Good luck,
Rod Norman

Guys, I've belonged to this board for quite some time and have gained a lot of knowledge. I hope I've contributed at least half of what I've received, though even that is a tall order to fill. The computer I've used to create my music was far from ideal but it was all I could get; an on-sale Toshiba laptop from Walmart
(now kaput).

As it stands, it doesn't look as though I'll be able to complete the music I've been working on or start any new projects. The only computers I have at my disposal are an eMachine from 2004 and an Acer laptop running Vista that I managed to fix through -- given my technical skills -- some seemingly miraculous, though incredibly uncertain jury-rigging.

Feeling crummy that the computer my dad had gotten me as an extremely hard-to-come-by gift had broken, I wrote Toshiba a really brash letter outlining the many problems I've encountered with the laptop. These include catastrophic hinge failure caused by the stress of the hinges being too much for the flimsy plastic housing they were attached to, internal speaker damage (caused by said hinge failure), audio card breakage (from the repeated plugging in of headphones), and sudden complete self-destruction.

I ended the letter by saying:
"I would demand restitution for this flagrant injustice to me as the consumer if I wasn't afraid that I'd be sent another wad of human feces that had been sculpted and duct-taped into the shape of a lousy computer."

Is it so wrong to expect a company with the brand recognition of Toshiba to create a product that is built to last? I'm feel utterly defeated. I spent hours (from midnight to three in the afternoon) trying to fix it. It's days before my twenty-first birthday, and I feel like absolute crap. Oh, well. There's no sense in getting too upset.

 

[DM60]

There are lots of things that cause this not work. Not that it can't work but as a general rule it will not. Usually it has to do with motherboard chipset. Different chipset = blue screen of death on boot USUALLY (not always). The other hard ware like video card, sound, network, etc can easily be reloaded but some things cant. You CAN though do the hard drive swap, if it boots you're set, if it doesn't and you have windows cds you can run a windows repair (NOT RESTORE), repair might solve it.

Also I looked in your profile and didn't see, where are you located? I won't claim to be the most knowledgeable person here but I have done IT work professionally for about 13 years, everything from geek squad to private consulting. System Admin and engineer to phone support. If it's something I can help with, I'd be more than happy to. I work on these things all day anyway, and extra hour of my time one evening wouldn't hurt.

I've been working with computers professionally for about 25 years. I not going to argue the point. I will just say from my experience, I have swapped drives for many years and other than updating drivers, I have not had a problem.

OP, you can try it and possibly save yourself a lot of time. Of course, as stated you can just slave it and fetch the information. Main point over all, you haven't lost your data so don't be depressed. There are IDE/SATA to USB adapters for a reasonable price with a laptop that is probably your only option. That will get you to your data easily. Good Luck.

 

[michaelst]

Yeah . . . but what are the chances that I'd hear back from them anyway? I might as well have a little fun.

After you call thier product a piece of shit, the possiblity you'll hear back are pretty non-existant.
Insulting someone's product, or service is not 'a little fun'.

Your music is a rancid, maggot infest piece of warm horse shit. You have less talent than a rapper. You and your 'music' should never be hear from again.

Yeah.. that was fun.

 

[DM60]

After you call thier product a piece of shit, the possiblity you'll hear back are pretty non-existant.
Insulting someone's product, or service is not 'a little fun'.

Your music is a rancid, maggot infest piece of warm horse shit. You have less talent than a rapper. You and your 'music' should never be hear from again.

Yeah.. that was fun.

Wow, if that doesn't make your point, guess nothing will.

 

[mjbphotos]

Simple thing: if you want to edit HD video (and not take hours to process a few minutes of video), or want to work with 30 tracks of audio with lots of plug-ins, you need a computer made to handle it - a $400 Walmart special will not do it.

To echo the Dell comments from a few others - the documented motherboard issue soured me to Dell, after losing 2 of them at home. Work still uses them for some stupid reason - I had one of those die, too!