Man I feel like just giving up sometimes

spantini

COO of me, inc.
You've got some good movement and nice changes there, especially right after the vocals - good place for a hook. I was getting a standard southern rock vibe. Could use some arranging to work wth a vocal part. Don't give up.. whenever a catchy phrase pops into your head, try to fit it with this tune and see where it goes.
 

TomoStrat

New member
You grow as a composer just as you grow as a player of an instrument or a singer so... it's just practice, composing, recording and listening over and over again.
 

revnice1

Member
>I wish I could find a singer and lyrics person to collab with.
I might be up for a try. I'm no singer, I could demo the fit but you definitely don't want me singing on the final thing. But - I write off-the-wall stuff that people seem to remember.

If you PM me, I'll give you email and we could get going.

rev
 

damianhk

Member
I think everyone can sing. Find your key, and jot some stuff down; whatever you're going through or thinking about. You might surprise yourself.
 

DM60

Well-known member
The best place to start is at the beginning. Throw stuff on the wall and see what sticks. What I do often is I ad lib to the tune, go ba, ba, hum, hum to the tune and very often words start to form, then ideas, pretty soon I have a song. DO NOT WORRY THAT IT IS GOOD! Just work the song until it forms.

As others have stated, as you work through many songs, you will get your style, your way of working and it will start to happen. Pull out every trick you can to get something completed, but finish it. You can always go back and do it again.
 

LazerBeakShiek

Active member
Everyone can sing. Everyone can have their own style.

Writing songs is different. Sure you all can do it. Only how do they use such simple words to make such profound storytelling? Or make it like a personal conversation. Some people even use song to teach and convey knowledge...Warn each other. Yes, about love.

You can see my feeble attempts in this forum...such winners as 'Space Monkey' or 'I Pump The Jelly'. There must be something else to it. After 30 years I conclude it must be magic. A very strange magic.
 

grimtraveller

If only for a moment.....
I think everyone can sing
While I wouldn't say 'everyone', I'm in broad agreement with this. I think most people can sing, it's just that most people have no need to work on their voices, their breathing, their pitch and durability.

DO NOT WORRY THAT IT IS GOOD! Just work the song until it forms.
I also agree with this. Sometimes, a song in one's mind sounds good but somehow, no matter how the recording goes, it never matches what one hears in one's mind. On the other hand, sometimes, a song doesn't sound much but once it's recorded it sounds fantastic. Both have happened to me numerous times.
It's been a very long time since I felt that I had to like one of my songs in order to record it or do it justice. It's enough to just have the idea, work on it and make a song out of it. Everyone else may love it, I might not. It's not unusual for artists to not like some of their work and I don't think the artist is the best judge of their work, anyway.
 

Mickster

Well-known member
If by "singing" you mean some sort of non-speaking approach resulting in some sort of melodic sound that can at the very least be described as "singing" ......then ok. If you mean singing that recreates the main melody of a song closely......ok. However......if you're referring to singing that is "professional" or meant to be accurate or enjoyable for the most part...........then I have to respectfully disagree.

There are many people who sing off pitch....even if it's well in their range. There are many people who sing out of tempo. For some.....training can be helpful it seems.......but not for most. You often cannot train away what the person actually hears in his or her own brain....and trust me......that may not be what you and I hear. Mentally we all interpret our singing pitch and tempo as part of an internal set of stimulus and reason.

If you aren't on board with this....ok. But how many times....even in this forum....have you had people with pitch and tempo problems ask what you think of their singing? If they are not able to hear tempo and or pitch problems in their own playback.......they may never be able to. If those issues are fairly minor or not numerous......well maybe they missed it......but not likely. Before you answer their question............ask them what THEY think might be problems with their singing. 9 out of 10 will not mention pitch or tempo issues if they have them. It's because they don't hear them.

I once had a guy come over to play a few acoustic songs. We decided to harmonize. He took the main vocal. He was off pitch wise and tempo wise often. When I would play the actual vocal line note by note he would sing to it........and was still off. I would actually sing a note and he was off while singing with me.....thinking he was duplicating it. When I would visually "conduct" along with his singing.....he still had tempo problems. His brain told him he was on tempo and pitch. He couldn't hear any issues...and so...couldn't correct them.

Those of us who have been in bands auditioning vocalists or others who sing........have seen this happen I'm sure.

My wife...who is a mental health professional...has explained that how our brains hear pitch and tempo are interpreted by our brain and are not a a given ability for everyone.

So....2 more cents of my talking on and on........

Mick
 

unclehando

New member
Yea I hated hearing my voice at first, But all I had to do is just get used to hearing it. just practice singing louder and your voice will get better. I still dont thing my vocals in my song are that good , but its special because I made them. Just accept that you are gonna feel like this at first
 

LazerBeakShiek

Active member
If by "singing" you mean some sort of non-speaking approach resulting in some sort of melodic sound that can at the very least be described as "singing" ......then ok. If you mean singing that recreates the main melody of a song closely......ok. However......if you're referring to singing that is "professional" or meant to be accurate or enjoyable for the most part...........then I have to respectfully disagree.

There are many people who sing off pitch....even if it's well in their range. There are many people who sing out of tempo. For some.....training can be helpful it seems.......but not for most.
The ride home from work is a great practice space. Sing along with the radio. That M-F with the same CD in the deck/or mp3 list, keep the material the same. Not on the way to work. Use the energy of freedom.
If you aren't on board with this....ok. But how many times....even in this forum....have you had people with pitch and tempo problems ask what you think of their singing? If they are not able to hear tempo and or pitch problems in their own playback.......they may never be able to. If those issues are fairly minor or not numerous......well maybe they missed it......but not likely. Before you answer their question............ask them what THEY think might be problems with their singing. 9 out of 10 will not mention pitch or tempo issues if they have them. It's because they don't hear them.
Hey man, I blow it all the time. Nobody has 100% accuracy. The odd note happens.
His brain told him he was on tempo and pitch. He couldn't hear any issues...and so...couldn't correct them.
My hearing is not as good as it was either. Get used to this.
 

grimtraveller

If only for a moment.....
If by "singing" you mean some sort of non-speaking approach resulting in some sort of melodic sound that can at the very least be described as "singing" ......then ok.
I don't mean that. But it may be on the road to singing.
If you mean singing that recreates the main melody of a song closely......ok.
This is more in the ball park of what I meant. Most people I've ever heard sing are more in this category.
However......if you're referring to singing that is "professional" or meant to be accurate or enjoyable for the most part...........then I have to respectfully disagree.
My particular point specifically recognized that most people that "sing" have no reason to work on their voices. I mean, unless you are going to sing professionally or in a church or a choir or home record or some kind of performance type situation, then there's no point in putting oneself through the hassle of breathing exercises, training muscles, controlling pitch beyond the average way many of us sing and all the other things that enable us to make a pleasing sound that is actually enjoyable for the most part. So most simply don't.
This may be a poor analogy but I would say that if push came to shove, most adults can keep children entertained in a goofy, fun way. But the overwhelming majority of adults don't. It's not because we are all incapable of this, it's just that there is no reason for most adults to do this. Some are more gifted in that vein and some are more practiced in it. Most might turn it on for a few minutes when meeting a nephew/niece/friend's child/pupil/patient ~ but most can't be bothered to hone that. Why should they ?
There are many people who sing off pitch....even if it's well in their range. There are many people who sing out of tempo
Well, that's true. I know many a singer that rarely misses pitch but struggles with tempo and those that can catch the nuances of virtually any tempo or time signature in the funkiest of modes, yet have more pitch issues than a one armed baseballer.
But that's not a matter of something that is so innate that it can't be dealt with.
For some.....training can be helpful it seems.......but not for most. You often cannot train away what the person actually hears in his or her own brain
You can certainly train someone to listen to what they need to replicate. Their response is key {no pun intended}.
The only part of what you say that I disagree with actually, is the word 'most'. I think that what you have been saying applies to the minority rather than the majority.
I'll stress again, I'm not saying that every human being is a closet Aretha Franklin on the sly. Singing is not really some secret magical art open only to the blessed and gifted few. There are, without a doubt, those that are gifted beyond the average {or those that have honed their skills to beyond the average}. But the average {most of us in the human race} does exist.
....and trust me......that may not be what you and I hear. Mentally we all interpret our singing pitch and tempo as part of an internal set of stimulus and reason
I agree. However, fortunately, systems have been worked out in just about every culture and time period that codify some kind of order. A C# is a C# and an E is an E {or whatever code of notes has been worked out}, regardless of what someone else's brain might dictate.
Like you, I've had that problem with singers that just can't hear a note that I can hear and reproduce clearly. It's at that point that patience must demonstrate its sterling qualities before I explode. Sometimes, I've just had to give up. But in every one of those situations, if I was prepared to spend hours on it, it would have been cracked. And I'll tell you, the attitude of the singer in every one of those instances down the years was the defining arbiter in the matter. Not one of them housed an "OK, I'm going to work on this until I get it" outlook.
And these were people who could sing !

how many times....even in this forum....have you had people with pitch and tempo problems ask what you think of their singing? If they are not able to hear tempo and or pitch problems in their own playback.......they may never be able to
I think most people are lazy singers. I don't mean lazy in a derogatory sense, just in the sense that for the most part, we tend to be our own audience so it really doesn't matter if there are tempo and pitch problems.
The very fact that people are asking what is thought of their singing shows that they've gone beyond the stage where they are just singing to themselves and are perhaps beginning to recognize that if they are going to step out into the arena where others will hear them, they need to up their game.
That, plus the incessant need some people have for validation !
My wife...who is a mental health professional...has explained that how our brains hear pitch and tempo are interpreted by our brain and are not a given ability for everyone.
This is a very nuanced topic.
But remember, we are talking about most people, not every person.
Some of the top artists in history had problems with tempo and some of them were rhythm guitarists {John Lennon} and drummers {Bill Ward} !
I frequently laughed when I read Miles Davis' autobiography because he was critical of so many of the people he worked with {and loads that he didn't work with} and most of his criticism was musical. I was surprised at those that came in for his savage tongue lashing. Some of the jazz greats. True, it was only his opinion, but I'd never heard the same criticisms applied to any of them by anyone else.
But part of what has made so much modern music {ie, from the mid 1940s onwards} so interesting is the vast array of differing sensibilities of the players and singers that have clashed and collided in the making of their art.
 

LazerBeakShiek

Active member
Would you ever try something like a voiceliverack? In this instance it could strengthen his pitch recognition. Have him sing the note. Then pitch correct it. The voiceliverack with a keyboard can midi control the pitch in a semi realistic sounding way. Have them slide up or down to match the note.

Grim have you ever tried the voiceliverack with kids? If I play the midi notes , my niece will do the whole Frozen soundtrack. My nephew likes the robot voice and drum samples loaded up. He raps..its cute. You can entertain them for hours with that stuff.
 
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TAE

All you have is now
Yeah I like the musical ideas in it .... somewhere in the Alman brothers, Marshall Tucker ( Can't you see) and Gun's n Roses kind of genre...Not sure if I can sneak in the time to mess around with it but I totally felt like I could throw down some lyrical melody lines and lyrics throughout it pretty easy... What is the song supposed to be about or do you not actually have a feeling / idea for what the storyline for the song should be... I miss my old girl..I hate my new girl...I love my new girl...I hate fish tacos...I miss my dog...I like long walks on the beach...pretty girls...ugly girls....average girls....getting stoned...getting sober...Boy do I have a hangover...keep your hands off my truck, my gun, my mom, my little brother, my little sister, what is the meaning of all this? I know the meaning of all this...etc...
 

TAE

All you have is now
BTW on the anyone can sing thing...yep anyone can sing....that said I have ran across people who in no way, shape or form will ever be able to sing in tune ...just absolutely tone deaf..it is a scientific actuality ..kind of sucks but that's just the facts...I sure am not going to be signed by a NBA team ever either...dang!
 

TalismanRich

Well-known member
I knew someone who basically had one note. EVERYTHING she sang was the same note, and it never had anything to do with the real melody. She could ruin a Gregorian chant!
 
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