Jaco's "puwoooww" sound, how?

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cordura21

cordura21

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That kind of fretless sound, that goes pwwwowww, like Pat Metheny bassists did also.
I saw some presets in the JStation that use chorus, and also recommends just the bridge pickup.
Any other recommendations, on technique and gear?
Cheers, Andrés (please no smart ass-get Jaco to play it fot you- stuff, thanks)
 
no tricks just talent

seems to me that the secret to jacos sound was firm fingers plucking near the bridge, a little reverb (especially on the Joni Mitchell recordings) and a good dose of finger vibrato. and of course perfect timing and composition.
 
The fact that he used a fretless bass was important, too-- he could get a little blur to the attack of the pitch, and a different sound to the vibrato, that you can't achieve with a fretted instrument.

As far as I know he used no effects at all except the built-in distortion on his Acoustic amp head on certain tunes...
 
Yah the fretless Jazz is an important part!

Other effects? On "Slang" of course he had some kind of looping/delay effect and I thought I had read somewhere that he used an MXR Distortion on that live solo off 830.
 
I suppose his modus operandi for effects might have changed over the (alas, too few) years... you are right, I forgot that little Echoplex thing he did in the middle of "Slang." One of the earliest examples of that "trick" outside of Robert Fripp that I recall hearing.
 
I think those eight tens that Hartke designed for him might have some to do with it toooo!
 
In addition to the Fender fretless Jazz bass the standars Jaco recipe was using the bridge P/U volume all the way up and the neck P/U about 3/4 the way up.

As these are single coil reverse wound P/U's (on vintage Jazzers anyway) they are only hum cancelling if turned up at the same volume so using the volume balancing techique as described above can be noisey depending on your environment. One alternative to this that I have read is to optimize the bridge P/U height for optimal sound output and to set the neck P/U further away from the strings to approximate the volume balance described above.

I believe most of it is technique though as I have heard several players get that sound with a variety of basses. Mark Egan (used to use Pedulla and now uses a variety of basses), Alain Caron (F Basses). Steve Bailey (who has a signature line by Ibanez - I think....any way he has excellent video teaching tape you should be able to find on line; it is well worth twice the price. I have heard some very sweet Music Man fretless among others also.

Although I have read extensively about fretless and have been working on it it seems to be primarily technique so don't get to caught up in the equipment issue. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING that I believe Steve Bailey mentions is learning to quickly correct your intonation by rolling your finger tip to the right spot (up or down). You get that sound not by landing exactly in tune at each note but by getting very close to it and reacting to correctly roll up or down (in miliseconds) to the correct pitch. We are talking just a few "cents" off and correcting by rolling your finger... you can not do this being a half or even a quarter step off...you have to be just a tad off and roll your finger tip into that "perfect pitch". That is where the omnious oscilating mwah sound comes from.

To parody an old disco song;

I want Mwah, mwah, mwah.....
 
Great post SB
While that makes sense and it's sounds like you've done your research (and practice) I think there is a good amount of gear issues, from strings to pickup selection etc.

I always think of the old Stones records with Bill Wyman playing fretless and you can hardly tell, compare that to Jaco on Hijira.

It makes a huge difference whether you're using roundwound/pressurewound/flatwounds on a fretless to get that good dug in sound. I think the sound is best attributed to roundwounds tearing the hell out of a rosewood neck on a jazz bass.

Sounds like what you're talking about is how to play fretless WELL!
 
Yeah gear is always an issue and part of the sound I agree.

But the other side of the coin is any player on this board can walk up (theoreticaly anyway) and play through the exact same rig, settings etc from anyone like Jaco to Marus Miller to Eddie VanHalen and they are not going to sound the same. Some of us (not me mind you) may even be just as technically skilled but our technique is going to make us sound different. Many players have such a dinsinct style that they could play any guitar/bass and amp combo and you would still know who it was even if it was on a piece of junk bass/guitar on a cheapo four track.

Ya know what I mean? I still remember hearing Micheal Jackson's "Beat It" on the radio the first time and I just knew it was Eddie VanHalen playing the guitar solo! There were 100's of Eddie V copycat guitarists at the time in various bands but I knew that was the real Eddie V.

Although Mark Egan and Alain Caron have very different styles from Jaco you can hear his influence in their tone and on the slow sustained note solo kind of stuff it sounds very similiar to Jaco's tone with very different equipment...different basses, amps, effects but getting very similiar (and to me) equally beatifull tone. I just think there is more than one way to get similiar sounds and can often be done with different equipment by really working on technique.

I just strongly believe that any yahoo with the $$ can run out and buy the same top dollar rig as his hero but without deveolping technique he/she still won't sound good or like his/her hero.
That same person can work their butt off on technique and they will find a way to sound good on practically anything and phenominal on really good equipment and you take that with you in your pocket every day, every night and everywhere you go no matter what equipment you may or may not own.

I will never forget hearing a bass player in a cover band a drummer friend of mine took me to see. He had the EXACT same rig as the one I started on...same entry level Yamaha bass (BB-450) I think and an old Peavey Mark IV head (early 80's with a Peavey 1-15" cab). I was never happy with my tone with that rig but this guy had such amazing tone and punch! That night my perception of what I really needed to sound good changed dramatically. I still love to read the reviews in bassplayer of $2,000 and up basses, cabs and amps and dream of owning some of them some day but I know I don't need them....I need to practice, play and listen.

Sorry I got on a soap box there. Equipment is a factor in tone I just think we focuss on it too much.:)
 
Amen Scooter, good post.

Although I JUST got home with a new Hamer hollowbody and I can't wait to see how this beautiful piece of equipment changes my playing/songwriting after playing a tele for so long! mmmm, humbuckers....
 
Blipndub,

Congrats on the new guitar. The Tele remains my favorite but when it comes to guitars I do do like several flavors. I have a nice '68 Tele I will never sell but something with humbuckers would be a welcome addition to the spice rack.

For my bass I usually just want that one good sweet tone and change my finger or thumb attack for variety with the occasional rare chorus.

New gear does inspire new ideas!
 
What's really fun is having something as different as the Hamer and then switching back to the sweet speed of the Tele maple. It's a mid 80's MIJ with a nice one piece neck and a good worn in feel. Maybe the bound rosewood of the Hamer will just make me love the Tele all the more. I am enjoying that fat sound of the Hamer, but the Tele will never be far out of reach.

There must be some serious mojo in that 68 of yours!
 
Yeah there has to be some history in it ...if only it could talk.

It looks like the one Bruce Springsteen was always playing in the 80's. Blonde/Natural finish and black pickgaurd with most of the laquer worn off the maple fretboard...very comfortable.

I picked it up for only $225 around 1983. Unfortunately its not 100% original some one replaced the bridge with the newer six saddle bridge and replaced the tuners. The case is not original either but the pickups and the sound are all vintage Tele. If only my playing could do it justice.

How we got from Jaco to Tele's I'm not sure but its probably my fault....LOL
 
Well, It's a natural progression really. Jaco kind of sums up the musician and gear issue, because we know that Jaco came through his guitars not the other way around. Most of us are not a force strong enough in the universe to evoke so much power so we flirt with the tools of greatness rather than greatness itself!
At least I do.

And I'm just a dumb American so I contribute to my sense of identity by what I own and that sense of identity contributes to the music I create.
 
The Stones' current bass player Daryl Jones knew Jaco. He also played Jaco's bass. Know what? It didn't sound like Jaco in Daryl's hands. Get the equipment you want, but at the end of the day it's the equipment you had coming out of the womb with that counts. Anyhow, what does the world want with a Jaco clone?
 
Yeah...what he said.

So to summerize. It's what's inside that matters not the gear itself, ingeniuty creativity and talent are more important than guitars, strings, fingerboard woods, amplifiers etc. However, those extranious things can influence the way someone approaches an instrument (in their own unique way) and may have an impact on their sound. It's an evolving process, an ongoing tension of creativity between man and machine!

And another thing! This is kind of my beef with amp simulators (although I have one) is that who can tell one POD, Vamp, J-Station, Yamaha whatever, from another? I like the reliable sound of the simulator for late night pc-based recording, but it's so thin compared to sticking a 57 in front of a pulsing speaker. Anyway...does technology and cool equipment free us creatively or trap us in our own desires?
 
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