Im gonna get kicked off the forum for this but...

  • Thread starter Thread starter tjohnston
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Re: Re: come on now, guys....

therage! said:
Well if the "mastering" engineer of the commercial record destroy's it then yes I'll be complaining. It's amazing to me how much shit I here being produced by major labels. We all know about the level's wars that have been going on and what it's doing to recordings. One thing I would really like to know is how some of the big name mastering engineers think about the shit they have created. Can they take themselves seriously? I guess it may come down to getting paid or not getting paid. I would love to ba able to sit down with an engineer that is trying to win the level war and go through each song on his mastered CD and have him explain to me why his CD sounds like total shit. I have heard numerous songs in the clinic that are sonically much better than some of the major label stuff. I would like nothing more than to see all of the major labels die off. Maybe (but I doubt it) then we could get music back to what it should be. One sad thing about all this insanity is the kids growing up on this shit! I feel better now! :D
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I have no comment about the over-compressed CDs since it's a pretty common sense here already, but, I was speaking more on the musical level. People in the clinic think that commercial music are automatically bad because of whatever marketing reasons there are.
I just don't like seeing people here putting professional/pop artists down while alot of the "respected"stuff in the clinic sound just alike (I mean it in a good way) A good song is a good song regardless who did it and how. Homemade doesn't automatically win over pro-made, and vice versa. this is all musically speaking

I guess I just don't get the contradiction when people in the clinic say, "this is good, it's radio-ready" at the same time, "This place is much better than radio, radio sucks"


AL
 
I'd have to agree with you for the most part. The quality of your sound depends on your equipment and more importantly, your ability to use it. However, this IS a homerecording site, and I really enjoy listening to other people's creations. Even if they're not the best quality. I just like listening to the music and the mix. It's fun being a critic. I have yet to hear a HR that was up to pro standards. Whoever told you that doesn't know what they're talking about.
 
This thread ws based SOLEY on listening to LO - FI Streams.

If any of you upload a song off of your favorite commercial CD and stream it at Lo Fi it is going to sound like Horse shit!Total sonic trash.

I dont think some of you guys have read the entire thread because you are making statements in agreeance with a guy who bases his conclusions on the music in the clinic by listening SOLEY to Lo Fi streams.NOT Mp3.


Mind boggling.
 
Re: Re: come on now, guys....

therage! said:
Well if the "mastering" engineer of the commercial record destroy's it then yes I'll be complaining. It's amazing to me how much shit I here being produced by major labels. We all know about the level's wars that have been going on and what it's doing to recordings. One thing I would really like to know is how some of the big name mastering engineers think about the shit they have created. Can they take themselves seriously? I guess it may come down to getting paid or not getting paid. I would love to ba able to sit down with an engineer that is trying to win the level war and go through each song on his mastered CD and have him explain to me why his CD sounds like total shit. I have heard numerous songs in the clinic that are sonically much better than some of the major label stuff. I would like nothing more than to see all of the major labels die off. Maybe (but I doubt it) then we could get music back to what it should be. One sad thing about all this insanity is the kids growing up on this shit! I feel better now! :D
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Whats this about the "levels war" ??? You mean engineers are either lowering or raising the master levels so the are totally different from other labels or something???
 
Re: come on now, guys....

A1A2 said:
But, tj, while being a completely newb, is one unbaised judge from the consummer's point of view.
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I don't care about consumers. Maybe you do. That's cool.

About Rich's comment on "realness", I dunno, the big boys in the clinic all sound pretty radio-ready to me, and I certainly have no problem with that. Let's say if Macle or Erland one day go big, shall we treat them as "commercial, non-emotional, not-real" then?? and start complaining about their stuff being too compressed, popy and so on?
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I hear what you are saying. I meant "real" as in creative, not that there aren't good "high volume" performers. I just like it when you take money(to a certain degree), time equations, release dates, record deals, lawyers, managers, and expectations OUT of the equation. I guess I mean stripped down. Plenty of "big" artists out there that I admire too. You have good points though A1A2.....
 
all right then, lets put this tread out of its misery. I constantly read in books, magizines, web pages and forums that, "Yes its true. You can make near pro recordings in your very own home."
With my crass statements I kind of insulted the entire forum. The question I ask the entire forum is, "How true is this statement?" I think its safe to say that its difficult with moderate equipment and still difficult with top of the line products. For those of you who dont care about pro sound I think you are the most likely to achieve satifaction with your music. After listening to the mp3 clinic (in every format) I concluded that good sound is possible but not as common as the recording industry advertises. For those who were angered by my comments Im sorry to have offended you. Anyway it takes balls to challenge the entire forum. Thank you


The End
 
Well I guess some people just suck.......

But that does'nt mean they can't try.I've only posted once in the clinic and quite frankly I don't post more because most of what's in the clinic is way better than my stuff.
You can't go from newb to pro overnight and a good portion of the people on this have no professional aspirations anyway.This forum just helps you get better and learn.

So if you are expecting everything to sound "pro"you are in the wrong place.I've heard some fantastic songs in the forum,stylistcally and production wise.

If everybodies stuff sounded perfect there would be no need for this forum.
 
tjohnston said:
After listening to the mp3 clinic (in every format) I concluded that good sound is possible but not as common as the recording industry advertises.
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Now thats something we can ALL agree on.

Now go buy a boatload of equipment and do some recording so we can rip it apart in the clinic.LMAO! j/k

:D
 
What I think TJ means is that it hasn't been compressed until all the life has been sucked out of it and it can be peddled off to a gulible teeny-bopper audience.


I like the MP3 mixing clinic the way it is. There is a littel bit of the people who recorded those songs in each one, which makes them all individual, unlike a lot of radio music now.
 
tjohnston said:
all right then, lets put this tread out of its misery. I constantly read in books, magizines, web pages and forums that, "Yes its true. You can make near pro recordings in your very own home."
With my crass statements I kind of insulted the entire forum. The question I ask the entire forum is, "How true is this statement?" I think its safe to say that its difficult with moderate equipment and still difficult with top of the line products. For those of you who dont care about pro sound I think you are the most likely to achieve satifaction with your music. After listening to the mp3 clinic (in every format) I concluded that good sound is possible but not as common as the recording industry advertises. For those who were angered by my comments Im sorry to have offended you. Anyway it takes balls to challenge the entire forum. Thank you

The End
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I think you got the point, mostly. Other than patting yourself on the back for the size of your boys... bad form, son. But I thought the original question was legit.

I love the clinic. There's some brilliant writing, some talented performing, some excellent recording, and excellent mixing going on here...

...but it's rare all this excellence comes together on one piece. My singer's hot, and I'd like to think my songs are pretty good, but I'm new at the mixing thing, and am probably a few years away from doing a really good job. Most of us here are in a similar boat - strong points and weak points. Each with a different mix of them, of course.

One other bit that makes a big difference here is the recording space. Nearly everyone in the know will tell you "fix your space first". For a lot of us, because of the expense/inconvenience involved, it's the last thing we fix.

Finally, we don't really have mastering in the clinic, to my knowledge. So you're hearing pre-mastered mixes. As some guys pointed out, pro mastering is dicey anymore - won't necessarily improve your sound, just heat it up for airplay/club play. But it's still a difference.

Anyhow, good thread, I thought. Stick around, take some baby steps with the rest of us, your stuff will improve, too.:)
 
Re: Re: come on now, guys....

RichHead said:
I don't care about consumers. Maybe you do. That's cool.



I hear what you are saying. I meant "real" as in creative, not that there aren't good "high volume" performers. I just like it when you take money(to a certain degree), time equations, release dates, record deals, lawyers, managers, and expectations OUT of the equation. I guess I mean stripped down. Plenty of "big" artists out there that I admire too. You have good points though A1A2.....
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I see what you mean now. Sometimes, I am afraid that the clinic will somehow turn into a cult when people start prejudging and rejecting "anything" on radio.

Glad we understood each other :)

AL
 
Well, we do what we can with what we have. That is the basic them and credo of home recording. You ask me which I would prefer...
--------------
My setup:
*a bunch of SM 57's
*a beta52 on kick
*chinese overheads
*a $500 drum set
*me tuning the drums
*cymbals that came in a pre-pack for a shamefully low price
*a "drum room" that is a storage space
*a Soundtracs board that cost me $850
*no outboard compressors, preamps, or eq
*Pro Tools

or a Pro setup:
*SM57 on snare and nothing else, a bunch of cool mics I've never seen on toms
*beta52/D112/ATM25/RE20 on kick. oh yeah, AND a U47.
*Neumann overheads and room mics
*a 2-3000 drum set (often multiple rented drum sets for different songs)
*a professional tuning the drums
*thousands of dollars in handmade cymbals
*a drum room that is specifically designed for the purpose
*a Neve board worth a non-laughable fraction of a million dollars
*literally hundreds of outboard preamps, eqs, and compressors, many of which are worth more than a mid size car
*well-maintained 2" tape, or a RADAR system

Not to mention: better engineers, time, assistants, a mix engineer who has his whole own pile of gear and another fine desk to work with, and an accomplished mastering engineer. A lot of these recordings you've heard in the mix clinic would sound "pro" to you if they were mixed and mastered by "name" professionals. But most of the time, the professional product is highly massaged, and uses top-quality gear and talent from the top to the bottom.

The reason we hem and haw over stuff we hear in the mixing clinic is that we know the limitations of "home recording" compared to pro recording. Once you get going with recording, you'll gain a new appreciation for it too.
 
I agree with ole Tjohnston. And hes makin points without bigotry.Hes tryin to learn. He already knows hes hooked on this stuff.....Hows That HOOK feeL?? We're all hooked...I've been hooked for longer than some of you have been alive...I owned my first strat in 1967 and it was brand new...dont mean a thing....Tjohnston, drop yer cash carefully...keep studying...listen and learn and dont let the pirahna near the boat...peace
 
cavedog101 said:
I agree with ole Tjohnston. And hes makin points without bigotry.
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Everytyhing?

Originally posted by tjohnstonAfter listening to dozens of songs on the mixing clinic I have grown a little disapointed and sceptical. Why, you may ask? Well because I think it sucks! Everything I have heard on the mixing clinic just plain sucks.
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You agree with that crap?
 
" A lot of these recordings you've heard in the mix clinic would sound "pro" to you if they were mixed and mastered by "name" professionals. "

not much of a " name " unless you are REALLY into a dead musical form called " hardcore metal " LOL, but I'd LOVE a chance to mix something that anyone has done here...if you can ever throw some stuff on an ftp or something, let me know, it would be fun as hell I think!
 
pipelineaudio said:
I'd LOVE a chance to mix something that anyone has done here...if you can ever throw some stuff on an ftp or something, let me know, it would be fun as hell I think!
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I think you're absolutely right...(I've been waiting for something like this, lol). Okay, you'll hate this, b/c you hate all my tunes, but go here:

www.nowhereradio.com/honestmango/singles and grab "ONE MISTAKE." I just did the rough mix about :30 minutes ago.

(Yes, the autotune is intentionally huge)...lol. If you're interested, I'll get the tracks to you. I'm very anxious to see how much better it can sound. (trust me, I've left you PLENTY of room for improvement :D)
 
sounds like a fun one! Did Jamal do the drums? I could try this...ID certainly need the autotune fx track that you did too tho, I dont know that I could pull that effect better than that. Are the drums just one stereo track? or how do you have em ?
 
pipelineaudio said:
sounds like a fun one! Did Jamal do the drums? I could try this...ID certainly need the autotune fx track that you did too tho, I dont know that I could pull that effect better than that. Are the drums just one stereo track? or how do you have em ?
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HELL NO THAT S NOT ME...lol..thats all chris...i think the drums are probably all on one track....:D
 
pipelineaudio said:
sounds like a fun one! Did Jamal do the drums? I could try this...ID certainly need the autotune fx track that you did too tho, I dont know that I could pull that effect better than that. Are the drums just one stereo track? or how do you have em ?
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YESSSSS... Kick ass...I'm gonna' talk to my bass player in the morning and see if he can upload the tracks on one of those sharing things you talked about.

The drums...interesting. The foundation is a bunch of made up loops on a stereo track, but then I've got a seperate track for a different kick (little meatier), and well...another one for the snare,...crap, looks like yet another one for some crashes...lol. Okay, it's 5 drum tracks, but nothing as convenient as a real kit would look, lol.

I'll just print the autotune on the vocal track if that's okay, but otherwise dry.

It's 3 acoustic tracks, 2 electrics,...hrm, a kind of miscellaneous "synth" track, lol. Fuck, this is a mess...I see some other vocals, lmao.

Why don't I clean this up and PM you when I have the files transferable...Dude, I totally appreciate this.

buh bye
 
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